Peppers trade rumor on the radio

bradmahn said:

I don't know if the lack of precedent means it won't happen, but there are creative ways to get around the lack of room, if that's the only hang up to a trade. For instance (and this may be ****, if it is, I expect to be beaten bloody within the next few posts), the Patriots and Panthers could sign their respective franchisee's to long-term contracts with equivalent minimal signing bonuses (or no bonus at all) and a June 1 roster bonus that would serve as the equivalent of a signing bonus. The roster bonus is prorated and doesn't count until June, so it would be a non-issue for each team.

I would assume, if the rumor is true and he wants to be on a winner, Peppers may be content with a deal similar to what Seymour signed, short years with big money, nearly all of it guaranteed, but that would depend on Belichick's confidence in Peppers's ability to make the positional transition.

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Yeah I can't think of a franchise for franchise trade before - but in theory, I don't even think its that complicated. Cassel for Peppers straight up, both have their contracts torn up upon arrival at their new destination, and both get new deals with the new teams. Wouldn't that work?

Box_O_Rocks said:

I've been on the lookout for the 6'7" Cornerback, but the bastitches all seem to be entering the NBA out of high school. :enranged:

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If you could get a CB his size that could run a 4.3 40 you would have something but the short guy fans in this forum would insist he was "quick twitch" whatever that means. Think goal line here? Fade route? Nyet!

If you could have a 6'7" OLB with 4.6 speed like say a Peppers, isn't that freekish? Jason Taylor did alright when he played that spot at 6' 6".

Let's just take a deep breath and think about this logically and not use the famous "no thanks" grade school comeback that is so popular here.

The dude has RB, SS, TE speed, he is not going to take a beating from pulling lineman, the QB must adjust his arc when throwing into the flats to get over him and he is what, ten pounds heavier than Thomas and yet he is critically reviewed here as a "no thanks' guy?
DW Toys

DW Toys said:

Let's just take a deep breath and think about this logically and not use the famous "no thanks" grade school comeback that is so popular here.

The dude has RB, SS, TE speed, he is not going to take a beating from pulling lineman, the QB must adjust his arc when throwing into the flats to get over him and he is what, ten pounds heavier than Thomas and yet he is critically reviewed here as a "no thanks' guy?
DW Toys

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Right, but this isn't about logic. It's about ranting and raving, silly.

I don't think his talent or measurables are at issue in any valid argument against. I think it's more about not being overly hopeful (picturing AD and Peppers converging on some poor QB ought make half of the forum downright randy) and wondering how the numbers would work. Does paying a lot for JP send bad signals to the team's middle class?

For that matter, even though franchising Peppers is expensive for his current team, doesn't his adamancy about moving on mean he's about more than the coin? So maybe he really wouldn't demand a ridiculous contract.

I'm for it, I'm just curious how it would work out financially. I've seen enough reasonable thinking in this thread to convince me the odds of him transitioning from "go kill the QB" to "go kill the QB" would be pretty smooth in all likelihood.

JSn said:

For that matter, even though franchising Peppers is expensive for his current team, doesn't his adamancy about moving on mean he's about more than the coin? So maybe he really wouldn't demand a ridiculous contract.

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Peppers has made some decent money already, he might not be the guy who is going to try and squeeze every last nickel. The only info on his rookie contract I found said it was 7 years, worth between 50 and 60 million depending upon incentives.

BradyManny2344 said:

Peppers has made some decent money already, he might not be the guy who is going to try and squeeze every last nickel. The only info on his rookie contract I found said it was 7 years, worth between 50 and 60 million depending upon incentives.

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Yeah, there's a bit of logical math here, to me.

He has made his petition for a trade about wanting to play OLB in a 3-4.
+
He has no track-record for successfully doing so (may take a little time).
+
He is only interested in certain teams.
=

Reduced negotiating leverage, at least imo.

I think he wants to skip the big payday and go for a ring

hes not going to have a very hard time moving to OLB, hes to athletically gifted and hes North Carolina Educated. The problem is it seems he wants a solid amount of money.

BB has given out large contract (while still a discount to the market) to FA linebackers before (Colvin & Thomas). I don't think money would be a huge issue.

JSn said:

Yeah, there's a bit of logical math here, to me.

He has made his petition for a trade about wanting to play OLB in a 3-4.
+
He has no track-record for successfully doing so (may take a little time).
+
He is only interested in certain teams.
=

Reduced negotiating leverage, at least imo.

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Yes, well put - the act alone shows money is not his top priority.

Belichick has shown he'll spend when he sees a free agent player who is deemed worth a high contract. AD has lived up to his contract so far - his important is all the more apparent seeing how the defense never overcame his injury - and I think he would fork over some change if he thinks Pepper will help.

My question is what happened to Peppers in 07 when he struggled so much. That is of concern to me.

Scott Pioli, in an interview with Mike Felger of Comcast Sports Net earlier this year, addressed the size issue with cornerbacks, saying that size isn’t everything. Here is what Pioli told Felger: “Part of it is that the bigger a player gets - the taller or longer sometimes a player is - the less fluid they are in changing direction. When you're looking for a corner, they have to be reactive athletes -- to see changes, know what's going on, plant their foot, and drive toward the football. The longer, taller bodies have more difficulty being reactive type athletes."

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The whole size argument is stupid. There is mold this team likes out of its players and big and fast is one of them. The thing with corner above is that the Pats have found a certain size CB has the skill set they look for more than bigger guys but to think that they wouldn't grab a 6 foot 2 inch corner if he was as fluid, reactionary, and had great hips than your crazy.

Same could be said for OLB if they find 6'5 270 make the best combo of skills that aren't going to ignore someone bigger and equally skilled (speed, change of direction) that would be stupid because the extra size would be an advantage.

Of course not every 280 lb guy can run/move well enough to be LBs but one or two can I am sure just like 270 lb guys are not supposed to be RBs see Jacobs and McClain.


and to those complaining of this thread at least he is worthy of this discussion unlike an overhyped Panther LB last year names Seward.

His talent is not the question to me at all. There have always been valid questions about his "want to" since he was in college. Here's an article some may want to peruse as an example.

Panthers do a year's worth of work in 45 minutes | The Herald - Rock Hill, SC

Little nugget from the Minneapolis Star Tribune this morning:

Bellying up to barter

The franchise is looking to sell tickets, and bringing back Tarvaris Jackson or Gus Frerotte as the starter isn't going to generate excitement. A big-name acquisition could assure a home sellout streak that began in 1998 continues for a 12th consecutive season.

There have been indications the Vikings have an interest in Matt Cassel, who had the $14.65 million franchise tag placed on him by New England, but could be available in a trade. The Patriots' asking price certainly would include high draft picks.

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Or mid-picks and some spice...

Without getting overly optimistic, I think that if we could somehow land Peppers and get him to sign a workable contract it would be a no-brainer. The Pats were reportedly very interested in converting Jared Allen to OLB if they could have figured out a way to get him. Peppers would be a similar kind of talent. Belichick is a master at figuring out how to use players to their strengths, and I have no doubt he would find ways to make Peppers productive even while he was learning the OLB position, and shield his weaknesses.

A front 7 of Seymour-Wilfork-Warren on DL and Peppers-Vrabel-Mayo-Thomas at LB, with Vrabel moving inside and Guyton substituting frequently as part of a core rotation, would be absolutely sick. It would also allow the Pats to go into the draft with only one major area of concern, DB, which they may even still be able to address to some extent in FA (Jabari Greer, Sean Jones, Michael Huff, resigning the two Sanders, etc.). That would give them a lot more room to maneuver in a very deep draft if a top RB, WR or OT fell to them.

2010 looks to be a very strong draft for defense, especially for 3-4 DE and LB options. Sergio Kindle, Ricky Sapp, Mark Herzlich, Brandon Spikes, Rolando McClain, Vince Oghobasse, Arthur Davis, Namdukong Suh, etc. It would be nice to be able to take advantage of this year's strong DB and OL classes without having to reload the front 7.

mayoclinic said:

2010 looks to be a very strong draft for defense, especially for 3-4 DE and LB options. Sergio Kindle, Ricky Sapp, Mark Herzlich, Brandon Spikes, Rolando McClain, Vince Oghobasse, Arthur Davis, Namdukong Suh, etc. It would be nice to be able to take advantage of this year's strong DB and OL classes without having to reload the front 7.

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Yeah, but it won't do us much good since we'll be picking at #32...

JSn said:

Yeah, but it won't do us much good since we'll be picking at #32...

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It will push some talent down to us at any rate. Some of those players listed (Arthur Davis, Vince Oghobasse) may possibly be available at the end of the 1st round, and would be good 3-4 DE's in case of turnover at that position (heresy, I know). If we're able to resign key people and don't need to upgrade the DL, there looks to be plenty of talent elsewhere to pursue.

My main point is that with the ability to move AD or Vrabel inside, getting an athletic freak like Peppers would give us the best 3-4 front 7 we've ever had, and would give us much more freedom to be creative in the draft. It's a longshot, but I can't imagine why it wouldn't be a good thing if we could make it work out.

It sure would be telling if they'd make a move with Delhomme... maybe they're interested, but playing it safe until they know.

bradmahn said:

I don't know if the lack of precedent means it won't happen, but there are creative ways to get around the lack of room, if that's the only hang up to a trade. For instance (and this may be ****, if it is, I expect to be beaten bloody within the next few posts), the Patriots and Panthers could sign their respective franchisee's to long-term contracts with equivalent minimal signing bonuses (or no bonus at all) and a June 1 roster bonus that would serve as the equivalent of a signing bonus. The roster bonus is prorated and doesn't count until June, so it would be a non-issue for each team.

I would assume, if the rumor is true and he wants to be on a winner, Peppers may be content with a deal similar to what Seymour signed, short years with big money, nearly all of it guaranteed, but that would depend on Belichick's confidence in Peppers's ability to make the positional transition.

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I suppose that's one way, though I'm wondering how far the NFL and NFLPA would bend in order to let that happen. You at least understood my query relates to the League requirement that new player's deals fit within the cap in order for a trade to go forward...a recent example was Brady re-working his contract to create enough cap space to absorb Randy Moss' Oakland contract before signing him to a "show me" contract with friendlier numbers. I keep hoping Miguel sobers up and chimes in.

I posted a thread on the Carolina Panther's message board to see what their fans thought about the hypothetical Cassel-Peppers trade. It looks like 40% don't want that deal PERIOD, 40% would want the Pats to throw in an additional draft pick to get it done (which I would consider if I were BB) and 20% would immediately do the deal straight-up. Here is a link to the thread...

Trade Peppers for Matt Cassell? - Carolina Panthers Message Board

rblee83 said:

I posted a thread on the Carolina Panther's message board to see what their fans thought about the hypothetical Cassel-Peppers trade. It looks like 40% don't want that deal PERIOD, 40% would want the Pats to throw in an additional draft pick to get it done (which I would consider if I were BB) and 20% would immediately do the deal straight-up. Here is a link to the thread...

Trade Peppers for Matt Cassell? - Carolina Panthers Message Board

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I'd throw in Tully Banta-Cain to even it up.

rblee83 said:

I posted a thread on the Carolina Panther's message board to see what their fans thought about the hypothetical Cassel-Peppers trade. It looks like 40% don't want that deal PERIOD, 40% would want the Pats to throw in an additional draft pick to get it done (which I would consider if I were BB) and 20% would immediately do the deal straight-up. Here is a link to the thread...

Trade Peppers for Matt Cassell? - Carolina Panthers Message Board

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If i were BB, I'djump on that in a heartbeat!!!!