When did we ever run the Amoeba Offense?

Why don't you answer the simple question the thread starter asked? McDaniels' offense was never called that by any NE coach, player, media, or even by himself while he was here. We NEVER ran an amoeba offense under McDaniel,

I did read the article the moment the thread was created, and you are a fool if you think McDaniels' lie somehow makes Belichick a liar too. Belichick never called McDaniels' offense an amoeba offense, only the liar McKID is claiming this now to the Denver newspapers.

PittPatriot said:

The buzzword in Denver this past week was Josh McDaniel's "Amoeba Offense" and how the Broncos are making a shift away from Shanahan's system (obviously).

I don't ever recall the Pats running this offense under Josh McD. Is this just something contrived to get some pub or excitement for the new regime?

I searched the forum to see if anyone had posted regarding this (the news is a few days old) but couldn't find anything. Thanks!

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McDaniels ball washers will continue to ignore your question, but the answer is it was contrived and was not coined that ever while McDaniels was here. McKid made this up out of thin air to make himself appear smarter than he actually is. His defenders attack all the while making zero supporting arguments that actually prove anything he says.

maverick4 said:

Why don't you answer the simple question the thread starter asked? McDaniels' offense was never called that by any NE coach, player, media, or even by himself while he was here. We NEVER ran an amoeba offense under McDaniel,

I did read the article the moment the thread was created, and you are a fool if you think McDaniels' lie somehow makes Belichick a liar too. Belichick never called McDaniels' offense an amoeba offense, only the liar McKID is claiming this now to the Denver newspapers.

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Please point to where in the article McDaniels says that he ran an "amoeba offense. Then, please explain to all of us what is meant by the term.

Here, let me help you. Here's the link to the article:

http://www.denverpost.com/sports/ci_11576892

Now, point out where McDaniels uses the term "amoeba" offense.

Article said:

.... The Boston media dubbed it the "Amoeba Offense" for its ability to adapt to its own personnel, or adjust to a defense.

""Our system is very unique,"..."It's not the same each week. It won't be the same. It doesn't fall into a specific category like the West Coast."

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This message board is a pretty good history of Boston media and events pertaining to the Pats, please do a search for this offense ever being called 'amoeba' by McDaniels, the Boston media, or any Pats affiliate while he was here. It never happened.

The reporter chose to attribute it to Boston media, but from the McDaniels interview, it's clear McDaniels is trying desperately to convey that he ran an adaptable amoeba offense; for all we know he was the one telling the reporter the Boston media dubbed it an amoeba, there certainly is no other source that would cause the Denver reporter to make that claim. There are multiple quotes by McDaniels in that article about changing week to week, shifting, being different, when that claim cannot be proven by him or any of his ball washers.

Also, for you to then say that somehow makes Belichick a liar (an absurd insinuation), shows how far you'll go to defend McKid.

maverick4 said:

This message board is a pretty good history of Boston media and events pertaining to the Pats, please do a search for this offense ever being called 'amoeba' by McDaniels, the Boston media, or any Pats affiliate while he was here. It never happened.

The reporter chose to attribute it to Boston media, but from the McDaniels interview, it's clear McDaniels is trying desperately to convey that he ran an adaptable offense. There are multiple quotes in that article about changing week to week, shifting, being different, when that claim cannot be proven by him or any of his ball washers.

Also, for you to then say that somehow makes Belichick a liar (an absurd insinuation), shows how far you'll go to defend McKid.

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In other words, you hadn't read the article because you didn't realize that McDaniels hadn't, in fact, been credited with calling it the amoeba offense. So, you lied.

As for the offense changing, again, you're calling Belichick a liar. Do I really have to point out the famous Vikings game for you, or will you now stop making yourself look like a total ass?

Deus Irae said:

As for the offense changing, again, you're calling Belichick a liar. Do I really have to point out the famous Vikings game for you, or will you now stop making yourself look like a total ass?

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A handful of instances, over 4 years of offensive play calling, does NOT make an amoeba offense and justify a claim that your team changes every week, like an amoeba.

I understand that concept is probably a little over your head.

maverick4 said:

A handful of instances, over 4 years of offensive play calling, does NOT make an amoeba offense and justify a claim that your team changes every week, like an amoeba.

I understand that concept is probably a little over your head.

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Bill Belichick Q&A, 12/22 : Chris Price - New England Patriots Blog

Q: You said plenty of times that your game plan changes week to week and you said that you implemented those plays for Hochstein on Friday and Saturday.
BB: Maybe I said that, but let me rephrase it. At the end of the week, we put in plays that were more oriented to the type of day we actually have out there on Sunday. When we started to put the game plan in on Tuesday or Wednesday, we weren’t as committed to playing in the snow, precipitation, that kind of a game where we felt like the close formations might give us some advantages. We gravitated to that by the end of the week by Friday, even the Saturday walkthroughs and Sunday morning with a little bit more emphasis on that. But some of those plays were plays that we didn’t put in until Friday or Saturday. I don’t know if I said that but that’s what I meant to say.

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Now, would you care to retract your moronic comments, or do you insist on continuing to act like an ass?

Belichick said:

"Maybe I said that, but let me rephrase it."

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He re-clarifies his meaning, because he isn't in agreement with the reporter and doesn't agree with that wording. And that makes him a liar... how? You must be ecstatic your big brother just hired you for the Broncos out of HS.

maverick4 said:

He re-clarifies his meaning, because he isn't in agreement with the reporter and doesn't agree with that wording. And that makes him a liar... how? You must be ecstatic your big brother just hired you for the Broncos out of HS.

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Now you can't comprehend what you read? He's said it on several times. What he's clarifying is the rest of the statement:

Q: You said plenty of times that your game plan changes week to week and you said that you implemented those plays for Hochstein on Friday and Saturday.
BB: Maybe I said that, but let me rephrase it. At the end of the week, we put in plays that were more oriented to the type of day we actually have out there on Sunday. When we started to put the game plan in on Tuesday or Wednesday, we weren’t as committed to playing in the snow, precipitation, that kind of a game where we felt like the close formations might give us some advantages. We gravitated to that by the end of the week by Friday, even the Saturday walkthroughs and Sunday morning with a little bit more emphasis on that. But some of those plays were plays that we didn’t put in until Friday or Saturday. I don’t know if I said that but that’s what I meant to say.

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Seriously, are you this incapable of reading, or are you just so pathetic that you'll try to weasel out of admitting you were wrong about yet another claim?

So, let's recap:

You lied about reading the article, or continue to show an amazing inability to comprehend the written word.

You claimed McDaniels used a term that the reporter did not attribute to him.

You claim that McDaniels doesn't change the game plan (well, you conceded just "A handful of instances, over 4 years of offensive play calling") and lied about it, when Belichick has publicly talked about changing the game plan every week.

You now show either a stunning lack of reading comprehension or an almost sociopathic willingness to lie with the proof of your lie being right in front of your face.


You're having one hell of a night.....

maverick4 said:

This thread is about a claim McDaniels made in a Denver paper that he is bringing is his "amoeba", "chameleon" offense to the Broncos.

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The problem here is that you have a reading comprehension issue. The WRITER of the article is the one who called it the "AMOEBA" offense and the WRITER of the article is the one who attributed the name to the Boston media.

maverick4 said:

That claim is complete baloney.

This thread is not about who scores a bunch of points. Mike Martz previously coached the highest scoring offense ever and that's not the point. Mike Martz enjoyed HOF talent at every position and used a very set, predictable, explosive system featuring mostly passes to his RB, slants, and in cuts. Similarly, McDaniels enjoyed HOF talent and used a very PREDICTABLE, explosive offense using mostly 3WR shotgun sets.

McDaniels claim to a recent Denver paper is horsesh*t, hence the challenges to this claim.

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What is horsesh!t is your continuing hatred and obsession with Josh McDaniels and you attributing something to him that wasn't said. You really should have stopped while you were behind.. All you've done is make yourself look bad.

Some more from BB:

Bill Belichick Conference Call - 10/6/2008

Q: Can you talk about the running back situation? Do you see yourself using Kevin Faulk and Sammy Morris more often than Laurence Maroney?

BB: No. With the running backs and our offensive game plans, you know those change and fluctuate week to week and even sometimes within the game. So depending on how we have our personnel grouped for a particular game or the situations that come up, it could be different players doing the same thing or it different players doing different things on a week to week basis.

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maverick4 said:

So calling the same pass play with the same formation is by definition unpredictable because the QB and receivers can adjust based on what they see?

Please just admit that you are McDaniels little baby brother he just hired to join him in Denver. You are a major ball-washer and that argument makes no sense. Calling the same formations and plays is not unpredictable as you claim just because the QB and WR's can ad lib at the line.

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You are the last person to be calling anyone a ball washer. You're just plain IGNORANT on the subject and don't understand that things are NOT black and white.

Its been brought up to you that the Patriots have HUNDREDS of different plays. Just because they line up in the same formation, that doesn't mean the play is predictable. In fact, one of the things I remember them mentioning is that EACH of receivers can run anywhere from 3-6 different routes out of any given formation. That means that there can be anywhere from 9 to 216 different plays from ONE passing formation. Depending on the read by the receiver.

The Pats offensive play book is something like 5 or 6 inches thick. Its one of the thickest, if not the thickest in the league.

Its fact that each and every week they chose different plays based on the team they were facing. Brady was on record as saying so. Others have said so.

You just need to get over yourself and realize that McDaniels is gone and you're gonna need to get a new life and start complaining about O'Brien.

OH, btw, did I mention that Brady has the right to audible to a different play any time he wants to? Maybe BRADY is the predictable one? Did you ever stop to think of that? Of course not. Because that would mean you'd have to change your thinking and stop blaming everything on McDaniels.

maverick4 said:

The offense DIDN'T change week to week. Reiss posted game charts after every game, we used one major 3WR shotgun formation as the pre-dominant plays every single week!

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Thank you for proving that you don't know what you are talking about here. Reiss didn't post GAME CHARTS. He posted Positional groupings. You clearly don't understand the difference between a chart and a run down of the positional groupings. Just because you are ignorant and assume that it means the SAME PLAY was called, it doesn't mean that the rest of us think that. In fact, most of us KNOW that isn't the case.

Hell, I can think of 4 different 3 WR Shotgun formation sets that the Pats used. And each WR has 3-6 different routes they can run depending on the pre-snap read.

maverick4 said:

McDaniels is full of crap for trying to pretend he changes his offense to his opponent. You have admitted in this thread, and countless past threads, that he basically dares his opponents to beat the plays that they know are happening. That is the opposite of changing your offense, that is stubbornly using your own system and knowing your talent is good enough to usually beat the defense.

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YOU are full of crap. Because you don't understand the difference between a WRITER saying something and a Offensive Coordinator saying something. You also don't understand the difference between a Game Chart and a listing of positional groupings.

No wonder you don't have a clue.

maverick4 said:

Of course receivers run different routes and there are different assignments for the same formation, but there are only so many iterations from the same formation.

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If you give each receiver 6 different routes, that is 216 DIFFERENT iterations. And that is just from ONE formation. And that is not including the potential of them running NO ROUTE and setting up a screen.

maverick4 said:

If a guy ran the West Coast offense (with its many variations within formations) and went to a new team, he would be bringing that offense with him.

McDaniels ran a spread offense. He never ran an 'amoeba' offense that shifted and adapted based on the opponent. So WHY is he claiming something otherwise?

Doing scouting and recognizing which defender to pick on that week is not an 'amoeba' offense, that is basic, standard scouting and game planning.

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You clearly don't understand what McDaniels ran so you shouldn't be commenting on it.

I can play too

McDaniels: Like his counterpart on defense, McDaniels insists his play-calling hasn’t been affected by the changes in personnel, particularly in the backfield, he’s had to deal with this year. “No, there hasn’t really been a difference in the way we’re calling the game."
Despite changes, Pees, McDaniels haven't changed

McDaniels: "We don’t really change our game plan that much unless the wind or rain would tell us to do that."
Josh McDaniels Locker Room Interview

Belichick: Let me just say in general terms, I think it’s hard to change everything every week. I think you can change certain elements from week to week but it’s hard to change everything every week.
Bill Belichick Press Conference - 11/28/2008

maverick4 said:

I can play too

McDaniels: Like his counterpart on defense, McDaniels insists his play-calling hasn’t been affected by the changes in personnel, particularly in the backfield, he’s had to deal with this year. “No, there hasn’t really been a difference in the way we’re calling the game."
Despite changes, Pees, McDaniels haven't changed

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Ummm..... finish the quote:

“No, there hasn’t really been a difference in the way we’re calling the game. The fact that we’ve been able to maintain our balance and we’ve never lost confidence in our running game … that’s always something we feel very stern about. We need to run the ball on a weekly basis. We need to have effective balance, so that [opponents] have to defend everything.

“We’re going to stay committed to doing both things, throwing it and running it. We’ve had some good production from the running game, but I don’t see where we’ve changed our philosophy in any way. We’re trying to do whatever we feel is the best thing to do to win that week.”

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maverick4 said:

McDaniels: "We don’t really change our game plan that much unless the wind or rain would tell us to do that."
Josh McDaniels Locker Room Interview

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Again, the whole quote:

Q: How much of a factor is snow in the passing game?

JM: Snow is not really a huge factor in that to tell you the truth. It is more about the wind and whether or not the ball is significantly wet. Neither of those things were a factor today. The wind really never picked up very much. As long as it is snowy, you feel like the offense has an advantage because of the footing because we know what we are doing and they have to react to us. We don’t really change our game plan that much unless the wind or rain would tell us to do that.

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maverick4 said:

Belichick: Let me just say in general terms, I think it’s hard to change everything every week. I think you can change certain elements from week to week but it’s hard to change everything every week.
Bill Belichick Press Conference - 11/28/2008

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And, one more time, fleshing out the quote:

Q How do you become a game plan coach? When did you see the benefit to becoming an offense or defense that changes week to week and does it take awhile to build a base to be that kind of team?

BB: It’s a broad question. It’s a hard thing to answer. In some respects there’s not necessarily one straight answer to it. You can do elements of both. Let me just say in general terms, I think it’s hard to change everything every week. I think you can change certain elements from week to week but it’s hard to change everything every week. Some teams will run – if they are going to change certain things then other things stay the same. Like maybe their two minute offense, their goal line offense, their red area offense, or their third down offense. Then they change something else like their first down offense or they change their third down offense but they keep their running game the same, or they change their running game but they basically keep their red area the same. It’s hard to change your entire offense every week but I think if you play a 3-4 team then these are the runs we’re going to run against a 3-4 team. If you play a 4-3 over and under team well here are the runs we’re going to run against a 4-3 over and under. They might be completely different

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Care to try finding some quotes that actually support your argument, or do you want to keep pulling quotes that undercut your own assertions?

maverick4 said:

I can play too

McDaniels: Like his counterpart on defense, McDaniels insists his play-calling hasn’t been affected by the changes in personnel, particularly in the backfield, he’s had to deal with this year. “No, there hasn’t really been a difference in the way we’re calling the game."
Despite changes, Pees, McDaniels haven't changed

McDaniels: "We don’t really change our game plan that much unless the wind or rain would tell us to do that."
Josh McDaniels Locker Room Interview

Belichick: Let me just say in general terms, I think it’s hard to change everything every week. I think you can change certain elements from week to week but it’s hard to change everything every week.
Bill Belichick Press Conference - 11/28/2008

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No, actually, you've proven incapable of playing. None of those quotes, unless you purposely take them out of context, support your flawed idea that McDaniels runs a predictable offense. None of them. But, its typical of someone who has lost an argument to try and claw and scratch and find SOME modicum of being right. Unfortunately, to everyone else, it just look futile and laughable.