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Zolak: Thomas and Springs are the "bad apples" in the room


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Burgess: It's on me

TheDynasty is right. He said that WEEI had the quote posted at 2:06pm, and it pretty clearly did. You said "WEEI didn't get it posted until after 3 PM ET (3:17 according to their Website)." You're wrong, as the link above shows.

I was referring to the video. He was referring to the text. I acknowledged that in my other post. Nice try though. Only a few minutes late and quite a bit of money short..
 
The problem with you people is you have no concept and many of you bounce to the tune of the mediots... It's a joke.

There is no doubt that the media can and will twist things around to 'spin' their columns. I believe about 50% of what they write.

AD's biggest mistake (besides being late) was trying to justify it to the media. This issue was clearly a no win situation.
 
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Thomas's biggest mistake was to talk to the media. Many, many, many veterans have been late and skipped proacticed over the years. Kindergarten rules are for well newbies and rookies.
 
So first you say that Burgess and Guyton havent spoken yet, then you say that they spoke before you posted, then you say it was posted at 3:17, now you say that we were referencing 2 different things. All of which were wrong. You are just digging your self a bigger hole.

It's called correcting myself. I can admit when I make mistakes. Sorry that its a foreign concept to you.

Did I speak out of turn when I said that Guyton, Moss, and Burgess hadn't spoken? Yes, but only partially. Moss hasn't spoken. Guyton didn't really address it other than to say he was sent home. And Burgess said he was disappointed in himself. That being said I watched the video and I was not wrong in saying that they got it posted at 3:17. Until you mentioned the guy's name, I had no idea who Mike Petraglia was as I typically only go to WEEI for Chris Price.

BTW, you still haven't provided a link to MOSS addressing it even though you claimed ALL of the said it.

There are not 2 separate issues. You're saying that tardiness has been an issue all year long and finally BB decided to take action on it now? I dont think BB would let tardiness go at any point in the season. You are kidding, right? You are really searching now.

Yes, they are two separate issues. On one hand, we have a single solitary incident of tardiness by four players. On the other, we potentially have an unknown number of tardies by an unknown number of people so far during the year that culminated in the four being tossed out. As Bruschi said, this was the first time under Belichick that he knew of players being told to leave. That's why I asked the question. One that only BB could answer.

And, considering it is an INTERNAL issue, normally, there is no way of knowing how much BB did or didn't tolerate. For you to sit there and claim otherwise is you claiming you have some internal knowledge that no one else does. And that's a crock.

Guyton didnt address the situation because he didnt want to. AD certainly addressed it and said he got sent home because he was late. That obviously means that the other 3 were sent home for the same reason. You have no foot to stand on with this argument

AD saying it is NOT "all of them saying it", which was your original claim. Which you made at 1:37 PM, prior to Burgess and Guyton saying anything. Funny thing about that.

BTW, could you show me where I said that any of them were sent home for a reason OTHER than being late?
 
Given what we think we know, the issue seems a simple one.

Should Thomas and Springs be benched for the rest of the year because they have been beaten out as starters and have a lousy attitude? BTW, I trust you guys would ahve a great attitrude if you say Burgess poerforming like he does and starting.

We have a Super Bowl to win. The time for making business decisions on who is part of our future is in the offseason.

Even if Ninkovich has beaten AD out for reps and Ninkovich starts, Thomas should be there is case of injuries. In the end, we need to use the resources we have.

I have believed that Springs has indeed been injured. Perhaps I shouldn't believe Belichick. However, I am fine if Belichick has decided that Wheatley is more valuable as an active defensive back, since he is more valuable on special teams that Springs. After call, in this case, we have three healthy corners ahead of Springs. Springs IS DOING his job. He is a backup in case of injury. Wilhite and Butler passed him in the depth chartafter his injury and stayed ahead, just as we hoped would happen. Why should we then want to cut Springs. I'm glad we had him early in the season to give Butler time to develop. If Wheatley develops some in the offseason and/or we re-sign Bodden, then we should consider cutting Springs.
 
It's called correcting myself. I can admit when I make mistakes. Sorry that its a foreign concept to you.

You made a million misakes including saying that Burgess and Guyton hadnt spoken yet. Instead of admitting to not seeing it, you tried to come up with an excuse that they spoke after you posted. When I proved that wrong, you said that I said the time of the post was wrong, not even admitting that you were wrong. You are just making excuses, bad excuses I might add. You are not admitting a mistake.

Did I speak out of turn when I said that Guyton, Moss, and Burgess hadn't spoken? Yes, but only partially. Moss hasn't spoken. Guyton didn't really address it other than to say he was sent home. And Burgess said he was disappointed in himself. That being said I watched the video and I was not wrong in saying that they got it posted at 3:17. Until you mentioned the guy's name, I had no idea who Mike Petraglia was as I typically only go to WEEI for Chris Price.

Guyton was asked about it, and instead of addressing it moved on. He knew he was wrong, and is moving on. Why do you think Burgess is saying his was disappointed in himself? Obviously because he was late to a team meeting. The video being posted at 3:17 has nothing to do with your argument that they spoke after you posted. You posted after 6. The thing I was referring to was right on the main page in the "Just In" section on the left side. It was posted a little after 2. Thats great that you only go to WEEI for Price, but this link was posted right on the main page. It isnt like you had to go searching for it.


BTW, you still haven't provided a link to MOSS addressing it even though you claimed ALL of the said it.


Yes, they are two separate issues. On one hand, we have a single solitary incident of tardiness by four players. On the other, we potentially have an unknown number of tardies by an unknown number of people so far during the year that culminated in the four being tossed out. As Bruschi said, this was the first time under Belichick that he knew of players being told to leave. That's why I asked the question. One that only BB could answer.

I never said that Moss addressed it. When I said ALL I meant all of the players that have spoke. Where is your source that there could potentially be an issue of tardieness with this team that has been occuring all season? BB would never ever tolerate tardiness for any team meeting or practice. Whether its mini camp or the week before the Super Bowl. If tardiness was an issue, someone would have already been fined this year for it.

And, considering it is an INTERNAL issue, normally, there is no way of knowing how much BB did or didn't tolerate. For you to sit there and claim otherwise is you claiming you have some internal knowledge that no one else does. And that's a crock.

Mike Reiss wrote an article today about how BB sent a message to the team on Monday:
"It's going to take more commitment for us to get where we need to go. More film work. Coming in a little early. Leaving a little later. Not running out of the building." That is what one player heard in the team meeting room that day, so he wasn't surprised at what unfolded Wednesday when four players showed up late because of ice and snow and were told to leave the facility with words that wouldn't be fitting to reprint on a family Web site.

This is what I meant when I said this is the reasoning for BB sending the players home. Two days before he said that he wanted more film work, comminitment and coming in early and leaving later. If 4 players come in late after he says this, you can see why he was a little ticked off and sent them home.

AD saying it is NOT "all of them saying it", which was your original claim. Which you made at 1:37 PM, prior to Burgess and Guyton saying anything. Funny thing about that.

BTW, could you show me where I said that any of them were sent home for a reason OTHER than being late?

I actually posted that at 2:37 PM which was after they spoke, and the "all of them saying it" was being referred to all of the people who spoke, NOT Moss.

You have been saying this whole time that they could have been sent home for previous tardiness' throught the season and that was why they were sent home OTHER than being late on Wednesday.

Honestly,you're a joke. You dont even have your facts straight before you post.
 
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Springs team is 7-5 maybe he just doesnt know how to act. Maybe he is happy to be above .500 He was a Deadskin afterall

As me sainted Irish mudder would say "Adalius can kiss a fat goose goose in the #$%"
 
You made a million misakes including saying that Burgess and Guyton hadnt spoken yet. Instead of admitting to not seeing it, you tried to come up with an excuse that they spoke after you posted. When I proved that wrong, you said that I said the time of the post was wrong, not even admitting that you were wrong. You are just making excuses, bad excuses I might add. You are not admitting a mistake.

I am human. I've never claimed otherwise. You, on the other hand, made your comments PRIOR to Burgess and Guyton having actually talked (you posted it at 1:37 ET). I called you out on it, though it was after they talked.

There aren't any excuses. It's called FACTS. It's called reality.

I did admit to my mistake. You just don't understand it.


Guyton was asked about it, and instead of addressing it moved on. He knew he was wrong, and is moving on.

Read your own friggin post. YOU claimed Guyton admitted to it. He did no such thing.

Why do you think Burgess is saying his was disappointed in himself? Obviously because he was late to a team meeting. The video being posted at 3:17 has nothing to do with your argument that they spoke after you posted. You posted after 6.

The video posted at 3:17 has everything to do with my argument. THAT is what I watched. I did NOT read the excerpt that WEEI had that you referenced.

The thing I was referring to was right on the main page in the "Just In" section on the left side. It was posted a little after 2. Thats great that you only go to WEEI for Price, but this link was posted right on the main page. It isnt like you had to go searching for it.

I don't go to the WEEI website via their main page. I have Price's page (It Is What It Is) book marked. That's how I pulled the video up. So, how would I have seen the "This Just in" on the MAIN PAGE??

I never said that Moss addressed it. When I said ALL I meant all of the players that have spoke. Where is your source that there could potentially be an issue of tardieness with this team that has been occuring all season? BB would never ever tolerate tardiness for any team meeting or practice. Whether its mini camp or the week before the Super Bowl. If tardiness was an issue, someone would have already been fined this year for it.

So, what you typed and what you meant were two totally different thing? And you claim I am making up bad excuses? What a joke. No one here is a mind reader. If you read your post, you never differentiated who you were referring two prior to you saying ALL.

Next, who said I had a source? Or are you just not capable of thinking beyond what the mediots put up? Can you not put two and two together when Bruschi comes out and says that no one in his time was ever sent home like that? That MAYBE something more is going on?

Who is YOUR source that the ONLY reason they were sent home was because of their tardiness on Wednesday? Because NONE of the media, nor Burgess nor Guyton nor Thomas said that their tardiness was the ONLY reason.

Mike Reiss wrote an article today about how BB sent a message to the team on Monday:
"It's going to take more commitment for us to get where we need to go. More film work. Coming in a little early. Leaving a little later. Not running out of the building." That is what one player heard in the team meeting room that day, so he wasn't surprised at what unfolded Wednesday when four players showed up late because of ice and snow and were told to leave the facility with words that wouldn't be fitting to reprint on a family Web site.

This is what I meant when I said this is the reasoning for BB sending the players home. Two days before he said that he wanted more film work, comminitment and coming in early and leaving later. If 4 players come in late after he says this, you can see why he was a little ticked off and sent them home.

Again. That may be the ONLY reason, but it may not be. You don't know. It's your GUESS. Are you the only poster allowed to GUESS?

Now, I refer you to Tedy Bruschi, AGAIN. Who said that he's never heard of a player under Belichick being sent home like that. Bruschi would know better than anyone if a player in the last 10 years had been sent home like that.

I actually posted that at 2:37 PM which was after they spoke, and the "all of them saying it" was being referred to all of the people who spoke, NOT Moss.

Clearly says 1:37 in the thread. Just like my post rebuttal to it says 5:28.

You have been saying this whole time that they could have been sent home for previous tardiness' throught the season and that was why they were sent home OTHER than being late on Wednesday.

WRONG. I stated that we didn't know the real reason they were sent home. That we, the fans, didn't know if it was for this one transgression or to send a message about tardiness from the entire year. I never stated that it was tardiness through out the year by those four. You talk about having my facts straight and you can't even quote me properly from the same thread?


Honestly,you're a joke. You dont even have your facts straight before you post.

This coming from YOU who who posted that all of them had said something. Hell, even Guyton didn't say anything other than he was focused on Carolina. That's neither an admission of guilt or innocence. Yet you think it is for some inane reason.

It's clear that I made a couple of errors and should have checked out WEEI before responding to your post from 1:37. As I stated earlier, I am human. Are you?
 
All this fighting means one thing................



I'm going shoe shopping!


ClevelandBrown-764538.jpg
 
Thomas's biggest mistake was to talk to the media. Many, many, many veterans have been late and skipped proacticed over the years. Kindergarten rules are for well newbies and rookies.

Unless BB sat this team down Monday and said......... we all need to do better, work harder, get in earlier, etc.... til we get this right.

If the very next practice, 4 guys have the balls to show up late........... (basically saying eff you coach), then he is completely justified. The real controversy here is not that BB sent players home, it's that they showed up late in the first place. That is a much more ominus ssign to me then what BB did.
 
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Given what we think we know, the issue seems a simple one.

Should Thomas and Springs be benched for the rest of the year because they have been beaten out as starters and have a lousy attitude? ...
We have a Super Bowl to win. The time for making business decisions on who is part of our future is in the offseason.

Even if Ninkovich has beaten AD out for reps and Ninkovich starts, Thomas should be there is case of injuries. In the end, we need to use the resources we have.

Well reasoned. I think that BB will be thinking along similar lines.
 
Neither Burgess nor Guyton had spoken out when I made the post. Burgess did, saying that he was disappointed in himself. Guyton only said he was sent home. He did NOT say anything otherwise, in that regard. He said it was behind him and he was focusing on Carolina.

I have said that AD deserved to be punished, just like the other 3. However, that doesn't explain the idiotic vitriol prevalent on the board today.

The point is the man has all the money in the world. BB wants people who study film and are prepared. Prepare for situations that's what made the super bowl teams. Springs is long in the tooth and AD got his money and will be sent packing. Is it so hard to think outside the box for ad to say practice starts at 8AM with the snow he may need to leave earlier?
 
Actually, it's been determined that the Film Study was AFTER he went home. Not before. There is no "continuously spouting off" about it.

If people stopped making him a scapegoat for the entire season other people wouldn't have to defend him.

We have no way of proving why AD was late at all. That's been part of my argument. That people acting like he blew off what BB said are just being plain stupid about it.

I'm not making him a scapegoat for the entire season. There's plenty of blame to go around. However, if you can make an argument for why he's earning his exorbitant paycheck (28 tackles, 3.0 sacks on the season - 1.0 in the last four games), then I would like to hear it.
 
I am human. I've never claimed otherwise. You, on the other hand, made your comments PRIOR to Burgess and Guyton having actually talked (you posted it at 1:37 ET). I called you out on it, though it was after they talked.

There aren't any excuses. It's called FACTS. It's called reality.

I did admit to my mistake. You just don't understand it.

Our times are messed up and thats where you're confused. Your times are one hour behind mine. Yours says that I made my first comments at 1:37, but I actually made them at 2:37. You said you responded at 5:30, but on my thread it says you commented at 6:30. I can see where you got confused.

So, what you typed and what you meant were two totally different thing? And you claim I am making up bad excuses? What a joke. No one here is a mind reader. If you read your post, you never differentiated who you were referring two prior to you saying ALL.

When I said ALL I was referring to the people who actually spoke today. Anyone that kept up with the days events clearly was aware that Moss didnt speak and could tell that I only meant AD, Guyton and Burgess.

Next, who said I had a source? Or are you just not capable of thinking beyond what the mediots put up? Can you not put two and two together when Bruschi comes out and says that no one in his time was ever sent home like that? That MAYBE something more is going on?

Who is YOUR source that the ONLY reason they were sent home was because of their tardiness on Wednesday? Because NONE of the media, nor Burgess nor Guyton nor Thomas said that their tardiness was the ONLY reason.

Again. That may be the ONLY reason, but it may not be. You don't know. It's your GUESS. Are you the only poster allowed to GUESS?

Now, I refer you to Tedy Bruschi, AGAIN. Who said that he's never heard of a player under Belichick being sent home like that. Bruschi would know better than anyone if a player in the last 10 years had been sent home like that.


My source is Mike Reiss and my own brain. Reiss is the best in the business when it comes to Patriots coverage. Reiss wrote an article detailing that strong message that BB sent to the team about being more dedicated and putting more effort in. Then when 4 players show up late to the next team meeting hes obviously going to take some action.

When Bruschi says no one was sent home before, did he ever say that BB gave a such a strong message to the team and then at their next team meeting players were late? If BB gave that message to one of the teams that Bruschi played on I dont think any players would ever be late to another team meeting, BB would not have to take any action.

If tardiness was an issue with this team, we would have already known about it because there would have been fines prior to Wednesdays event. Anyone that follows the Patriots knows that BB is a no nonsense type of guy and is not going to tolerate tardiness at any point in the season.

As for Guyton not addressing the situation and speaking of Carolina. Are you really going to sit there and tell me that he was sent home for reasons other than he was late. Why wouldnt he not want to talk about it if there were other reasons? He didnt want to talk about because he didnt want to elaborate on it, which is what BB would have wanted and probably because he was embarassed by it.

It's clear that I made a couple of errors and should have checked out WEEI before responding to your post from 1:37. As I stated earlier, I am human. Are you?

Yes I am human, and you finally admitted to your misatkes in this post. I already went over the 1:37 and 2:37 post mix up. I will say that is not your fault.
 
Looks like Springs will play today. Unlike Thomas.
 
Why is Spring a bad apple? What did he do?

Word up is that Springs posted lots of crap on Patsfans using the screen name NEPatriot or something. Just a rumor.
 
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