Discussion in 'PatsFans.com - Patriots Fan Forum' started by carolinatony, Apr 30, 2007.
I give it a 7.
If we had drafted a LB or two it would be higher.
7 maybe 8. Meriweather,Welker and Moss were superb and deserve a 10. But you are right they needed a LB. I liked the Kareem Brown pick on the 2nd day. I'm not worrying too much on the LB,I'm sure there is a plan in place or they just don't see it as an issue at all.
If we consider Welker a #2 and Moss a #4, with Meriweather a #1 and the #3 in the bank for next year and anonther #1 in the bank also I would give it a, 9..
Someone in another post said C- without Moss and Welker and an A with them. I agree.
Looking purely at the players picked from college I give it a 4.
- 1 pick in the top 130
- 3 offensive lineman (WTF)
- ILB in round 7 (injury past, undersized and slow)
- CB from Notre Dame (?)
9 out of 10.
We get Meriweather, Welker, and RANDY MOSS.
Dude Moss runs a faster 40 than Calvin Johnson and he just turned 30 years old. The guy's skills are unreal and not only does he have the physical tools but he also has a lot of experience and is a proven receiver in this league.
Everything else is gravy after that.
And no, reaching for a linebacker at 28 was not worth it.
Instead we got a future 1st and a high 4th in this year's draft.
NOW, if you will recall that we used that same high 4th from the 49ers to TRADE FOR Moss, then you'll understand how excellent this draft was.
The only reason I can't give it a 10 yet is that we have yet to see how these guys fit into our team chemistry-wise, but they all address very real needs and are very talented players. And yes despite me mentioning only 3 players of note we did draft 2 linebackers. Look hard, you'll find em.
It's almost too weird a draft to be graded. How do you weigh a 1-year deal for Randy Moss vs. a 4-year deal for, say, Zak DeOssie?
The Pats do seem to have gotten good value for their top handful picks, which is the primary measure you can realistically use. (Who really knows whether Mike Elgin is worth #247?) Meriweather looks like a solid player at a position of need at #24, Randy Moss + SF's 2008 is nifty for #28, and Welker looks like a stroke of genius compared to the WRs taken after #60. After that, eh. Trading forward #91, ok, I guess they like the look of that draft better. Some maneuvering up in the 4th might have yielded some nice players too. But overall: B+, nice work. Add in the earlier FA signings and the whole offseason has to get a solid A.
p.s. sign an ILB already
Given what we can know, I'd give us a 9. Here's why.
1) I think that Piolichick's board didn't show any prospects they rated as First Rounders in positions they wanted to fill by the time 28 came around. So, since they already had a boatload of late choices, the trade to SF was brilliant. If you believe that the niners overachieved last season, that could translate into a top ten pick in 08. So, big points.
2) "In Bill I trust." The consensus is that Meriweather was a low first round pick, if he didn't have the character issues. BB spent a lot of time working him out and getting to know both his situation and the people around him who know him well. So, if we're gonna dance with the one that brung us this far, we have to take this pick on trust. Serious points, with maybe a half point deduction for the questionmark.
3) "In Bill I trust (see above)." Moss for a Fourth Round pick could go down as one of the great draft trades of all time. I also give a lot of weight to the "Troy Brown" factor here. During his interview over the weekend, Moss said that he refers to himself as "the second best receiver ever to come out of Marshall." To me this means that the Patriots will move heaven and h&*l to bring Troy back this year, as well. So, serious points again, with no deduction. Risk is the name of the game, with any pick.
4) Clearly, we didn't use low picks for LB's. Here, I conclude that Piolichick decided that the current cadre, buttressed by AT, has at least one more good year left in it and that there may be some hidden gems in the higher round picks. Also, I doubt they've made their last offseason move at this position. Think "Junior Seau." So, a half point deduction due to my anxiety.
You know I never even thought about it that way..I would have orginally graded it a 7.5 but now that you said it like that, I grade it a 8.5 .
Question(s): Anyone think Merriweather is groomed to play CB? Do you think this solidfies the move of Wilson To CB?
The offseason as a whole gets an B+, only because i am selfish and want a big bad ILB.
I can't give this draft anything higher than a 6.5 and that is considering Moss and Welker.
1) The Pats got taken on their trade out of the 1st round. BB didn't get even close to the value that Dallas paid and Dallas only moved up 11 spots. San Fran, if you go by the way Belichick has described future picks (they are the equivalent of one round less in the current year and you treat them as a mid round pick of that round), moved up some 22 spots and only paid about half what Dallas did.
2) At some point they are going to have to invest in a quality LB in the draft. They already got burned once by relying solely on free agency. They lucked out last year with Seau being available and willing to come to the Patriots.
3) While they added Richardson, Rogers and Lua, did they really address the long term needs at LB and CB? Richardson looks to be a work-out warrior but could make his mark on special teams. Maybe the Pats can correct the bad techniques that plague Richardson and he'll become a good #3 CB in a couple years..
Rogers is a conversion project if you believe he's going to be moved inside. If he can make the move and be productive, great. The Pats have needed a SILB since Johnson went down. Lua also projects to the SILB position. They could give the Pats a strong 1-2 punch there.... However, Rogers could also be an OLB. He has some speed and ability out there. He might end up being another Mike Vrabel.
4) 3 O-linemen???? Ok, I understand picking up someone like an Oldenburg because of the questions at OT with Kaczur, O'Callaghan, and Britt. But why Elgin when you have Koppen just re-signed to a long term deal. You have Hochstein, Yates (newly re-signed) and Mruczkowski. I know Mruczkowski has been given his walking papers a couple times already, but why tender him if you aren't planning on keeping him. That tender is a guaranteed contract.
5) I understand the picking of Kareem Brown. He supposedly can be someone like Mike Wright and line up at NT or DE. He should mean the end of the failed Marquis Hill project. The question will be whether Brown can also knock LeKevan Smith off the roster.
6) The trade of the 3rd round pick to Oakland. When you look at what other teams were getting, how did the Pats not get more? Even if it meant another pick in 2008.
If you were just judging this draft on the college players you just added, I'd have to give this draft a D. The Merriweather pick was decent enough in that we got a player who fills a need and is close enough to a first round grade to merit the pick. However the other 8 picks were garbage. Few addressed any needs and most won't make the team. I think the best we can hope for is that 2-3 of the eight second day picks will be on the roster 3 years from now... and that is not a good draft.
That being said, added Welker and Moss, plus getting 2 additional first day picks would elevate the draft to an B+, IF your grade included these factors, but if you are just counting the talent you just acquired from the college ranks, this draft was just bad...as of the day after the event.
well it was productive i'd say
the rams are looking better, the seahawks....hopefully the madden curse will move away from alexander, and the cards are an up and coming team
just hoping the signing/trade of darrell jackson will hurt the niners more than it will help them, although i dont see how that is possible considering their receiving corps....
hoping that the 06 season was just a fluke for the niners,
that is their 07 season, they open up with 3 out of the first 4 games with their division rivals, and a game vs the steelers in week 3....tough start for the niners
looking at their schedule, they have a tough one, which project well for the pats,
we coudl be looking at a possible top 10 pick(reach) or a middle round pick(i think is more likely), and our own pick in the 1st round, our own in the 2nd, and a prettymuch top 10 pick in the 3rd round thanks to the raiders, which has near value as a late 2nd round pick, (opening up trade possibilities to the late 1st or early 2nd round picks- or more 1st day picks, along with another possibilty to trade for a 2009 first round pick..lol) and our own 3rd round pick
thats 5 picks guaranteed in the 1st day....
looks great to me....
short term its....like a 7...but long term, i'd say the pats walked out with the best senario
You have to consider: If, as Patfanken feels, you give this draft a "D", in fairness you have to recognize this was undoubtedly a reflection of the talent level was that was available in this draft, which you could argue was worthy of a "C-" without too much difficulty.
The Pats announced well in advance of the draft their intention to move down this year, or even better, out. They'll be good enough to entertain their fans this year, and next year's draft is a whole new ball of wax, so anything's possible.
They are still dominating drafts like the old Niners used to do under Walsh, and it shows no signs of abating.
Given what transpired this weekend, I can't give them less than an 8.
Let's see, we got Merriweather in the first round (which I was rooting for,) Wes Welker in the second round, and Randy Moss in the fourth round. Then some other guys I do not really know, but I am sure I will get to know in the coming months, as we pick over the bones of this draft.
Guys, you can't grade a draft for a couple years, in most cases. But this one comes with much more past performance, if you count who we got using our draft.
I like the guy that wanted to grade the offseason in general, instead of the draft. I can't go under an "A" here. I know the comment was made that we did not pick up a dominant ILB... all we did was pick up a dominant outside linebacker. So we'll have to get by with a linebacking corps of AD, Colvin, Bruschi, and Vrabel as starters, with Seau and some JAGs as backups.
It's really hard to grade an offseason under an "A" because we still have backups as backups, rather than other teams' starters as backups.
Did we do a couple things to get better? I think so LOL.
The Dillon departure - much as I loved him - was prompted by his obsolescence. He was no longer the 20-25 carry/game guy he wanted to be, because we had replaced that production. I do not see a problem with Maroney filling that void, and I do not see him having to do it alone either. The zone blocking scheme will really help fit what the team does in the running game, to what Maroney is best suited to. Does it work? We find out in September. Just like we found out with Corey, if he would fit. And of course, LM will be the #1 beneficiary of a supercharged WR corps.
Receivers? Anybody want to try to convince me that Moss, Stallworth, [winner of the sweepstakes in Camp], isn't better than Caldwell/Gaffney/Brown? Come on now.
QB - I know we should have traded up, but I think we'll get by.
Secondary - Rodney is either back, or he is back until the next injury... it's sad but true. Age catches up to us all. The good news: we're getting ready for the inevitable. Hit Stick looks like he can do it all, including fill the free safety role, if strong safety is not the greater area of need. I personally look forward to seeing the pain inflicted if both are on the field at the same time.
LB, we've covered above. Yes, one more dominant ILB would be great... but I am really not complaining about LB or anything in our front 7. By the way, the days of "the Pats just get enough pressure to make a QB think..." are over. If we want to be mini-Blitzburgh one week, for one guy, we have the flexiBILLity to do it. If we want to sit back and let them make a mistake, we can do that...oh, and by the way, we've added that to the second least points allowed defense of 2006.
Offseasons can only be judged "on paper." So let's give them the "on paper" grade they deserve: A, with no reservations.
Looking forward to the real "tests,"
I would give our draft a 7.5
We got Meriweather which was great.
Welker for a second is okay.
Moss for a 4th is awesome.
Our trade w/49rs was decent. The 49rs could be decent, but the 2008 draft should be better. Even the 24th pick next year would be a really good value.
I really like the 3rd rnd trade with the raiders. They will suck hardcore!
I don't know what to make of everyone else. The NT we got seems decent, and we always seem to be able to find guys for our OL.
I was really hoping for a LB and CB that could contribute this year. I don't think we got one in the draft.
Of course, it's impossible to grade a draft this soon. I have faith in BB. It just seems he hated the players in this draft class.
Why do I keep seeing people say Meriweather was close to a first round grade, so it was a decent pick? Meriweather was a top 15-20 talent who only fell because of his overblown character issues.
If you separate the trades they made it was a below average
draft for them.Outside of Merry and Brown there isnt any
player there that has a chance to make this roster.
I am being picky, but SS is a need. Harrison is an injury away. Sanders is purely backup material and everyone knows this. After the Championship game, how many time do I have to painfully watch James Sanders pull up on the one an step aside to let Adai score. If I am DB coach, he's cut! No way is James Sanders an NFL starter.
You had two we missed who would start immediately over Sanders. Justin Rogers was taken at #180 (?) and SS Wendling, a third rounder on some boards and rated higher than Picatelli and Weddle on others was taken #183 by the Bills.
We then take Mike ("are you kidding me") Richardson at #202 with Darren Stone (minimum forth rounder on boards) at #203.
Immediate starters over Sanders IMO. It will be Probably Wilson and Harrison anyway at safeties, but I think that was a slip up. They did not see those guys or thought they would be gone. Don't give me, the others were rated higher crap! One or both could have made a big difference IMO. One is a tackler, the other is more of a defender but both intimidate, and neither are James (for the sake of the Lord) Sanders.
I like what they did with trades etc., but if you don't include them, maybe a "D" (D because you have to trust SP. F otherwise) on second day. An "A" on the first day because Merriweather was a need (read NEED not BPA) and they got a huge leg up in 2008, a better draft as it appears.
The one good thing. It will be easier to cut these JAG's this year, because the draft included Welker and Moss and some good 2008 choices.
I predict not one of the picks on second day makes the Roster IMO. Anyone think differently?
I think Richardson was drafted to give a little love to Charlie W. It looks better to say, "see how many ND players were drafted" when you recruit. I predict he is the first DC cut.
Now I need Miguel here. Does the fact we took only one first day pick and the others on the second day will not make the club, change our CAP profile to sign Samuel?
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