manxman2601
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CLICK HERE to Register for a free account and login for a smoother ad-free experience. It's easy, and only takes a few moments.Thanks mate, its good to see you again. It really did take me a while to get back into draft mode, but a few days away from the start of the college season and I am excited now. I can't wait to see what this board can come up with over the next few months because we have a lot of creative people that know a lot about football. I look forward to seeing what you have in store for us this year because its always a lot of fun and a great learning experience reading your work.
Cheers buddy
Time for a another run at a mock now that the first 53 man roster and practice squad are out, and some of the strengths/weakness of the team are more evident. I'm assuming Tyrann Mathieu doesn't come out in 2013, and right now I'm happy waiting and seeing how Tavon Wilson and Jake Ebner develop at safety, so DB is not a focus of this mock. Neither is RB, as I want to see how the young kids do this year, and Jeff Demps is in the wings for 2013. As always, this is just throwing darts and kicking the tires on prospects of interest, and I'm assuming that the Pats pick at 32 in each round. I've also incorporated some prospects of interested from other folks' mocks.
*** Trade: The Pats trade #32 for a 2013 mid-2nd round and 3rd round picks. Brother Manx has suggested that guys like Dion Jordan and Jesse Williams aren't clear 1st round picks right now. That could change, but for now I agree. I still love their upside and versatility, so I could see BB trading back from 32. Unless someone is willing to offer a 2014 1st the way New Orleans did with the #28 pick in 2011, a 2nd and 3rd would seem reasonable.
2a. Dion Jordan, DE/LB/"DB", Oregon. 6'6" 245#.
Hybrid Beast! The "Preying Mantis" is a rare animal, a 6'6" guy with great explosion and quickness off the edge who is unreal in space. He came to Oregon as a WR, converted to TE, and then to DE. He is so agile in space that the Ducks sometimes use him to play press CB and to cover slot receivers. He spends most of his time playing out of a 2 point stance, even when he is on the line. Jordan is not stout enough to be a full time edge setter, but he has good core strength for his size. The Pats could move him around, including playing DB in "big nickel" packages. With his length, speed and agility, Jordan could be a unique weapon in a defense which already has playmakers like Chandler Jones and Dont'a Hightower.
2b. Jesse Williams, DT, Alabama. 6'4" 330#.
Beast! Star Lotulelei and Johnathan Hankins will likely be out of reach in 2013, but there is still plenty of depth and talent at the DT position. Williams could be a steal, and may have as much upside as either of those guys. An Australian transplant and JUCO transfer by way of Arizona, Wiliams played 3-4 DE for the Tide in 2011 but is taking over at NT for Josh Chapman in 2012. A former rugby player, Williams has tremendous strength and terrific movement skills for his size. He is a weight room fanatic with incredible core strength, who recently benched 600 lbs (Dontari Poe, who led the 2012 Combine at the bench press, had a best of 500 lbs. at Memphis), and very little body fat. Best quote: "I stopped looking for the monster under the bed when I realized the monster was me." Williams has enough agility and athleticism to play outside in the 3-4 and probably play 4-3 LDE as well, and enough strength and size to play 3-4 NT, 4-3 NT and 4-3 DT. Getting Williams might require a trade up in the 2nd round.
3a. Mark Jackson, OT/OG, Glenville St. 6'5" 328#.
Sleeper! Rated the #7 center in the country by Rivals coming out of high school and signed by Illinois, Jackson subsequently transferred to a small school and has been flying under the rader. A big kid with excellent footwork for his size, Jackson has positional versatility at tackle, guard and center. He's still a bit under the rader, but with a strong season he'll probably be a top 100 pick, and could even sneak into the 2nd round. I could see him becoming a Brian Waters kind of player at guard, with potential at RT as well. He could even be moved back to center. Tennessee OL Dallas Thomas could be an option here as well, if he lasts that long. I'd be happy with either.
I'm assuming that Brian Waters is gone after 2013 (at the latest). Logan Mankins and Dan Connolly are on the wrong side of 30. Ryan Wendell has made strides this preseason and Donald Thomas and Nick McDonald are works in progress. Marcus Cannon could move to the interior OL. But there is still room for at least one quality interior OL prospect, hopefully with the footwork to succeed Logan Mankins down the road. Mark Jackson and Marcus Cannon would give the Pats a huge combination of bookend guards for the future to pair with massive tackles Nate Solder and Sebastian Vollmer.
3b. James Hurst, OT, North Carolina. 6'7" 310#.
Sleeper! A Brother Manx find, Hurst is a big man with a lot of athleticism and good footwork. Sebastian Vollmer is in a contract year and his back issues are enough of a concern to keep the team from aggressively pursuing an extension at this time. Marcus Cannon is still a major question at RT. Hurst would make a nice swing tackle behind Solder and Vollmer, allowing Marcus Cannon to be moved to RG as Brian Waters presumably will be gone after 2013 (assuming he comes back this year), and a nice insurance policy in case Vollmer moves on after this year. Hurst has enough power to play RT and enough footwork and agility to play LT.
4. David Bass, DE, Missouri Western St.. 6'5" 280#.
Super Sleeper! Mackenzie Pantoja has recently profiled Bass, who has an intriguing combination of size, length, long arms, verticity, instincts and processing speed. Pantoja writes: "I have never before scouted a player who is tremendous at so many different things needed to stop the pass" and "I’m not sure if I could design a player better suited to cover the NFL’s new breed of 'super tight ends' (Gronk, Graham, etc.)". A 280# LDE who can drop back into coverage from a 3-point stance and cover a TE or a slot WR in addition to rushing the passer, clogging the passing lanes and setting the edge would be a tremendous weapon - so much so that Bass got me to pass on Margus Hunt in the 1st round in favor of Dion Jordan. A DE group of Fanene/Bass/Bequette at LDE and Chandler Jones/Bequette/Cunningham at RDE would have terrific depth and versatility.
5. Brandon Moore, DT, Texas. 6'5" 335#.
Super Sleeper Beast! Moore was recruited by Nick Saban to Alabama, and left the team for disciplinary reasons before transferring to Texas to be reunited with his old line coach. A huge kid with terrific athleticism, Moore has reportedly been dominant in Spring practices. With VInce Wilfork turning 32 in 2013 and Myron Pryor and Ron Brace UDFAs after this year a second interior lineman would be a nice addition. A front line of Wilfork, Williams, Love, Brace, Deaderick, Pryor/Forston and Moore would be a very strong group. I'm guessing that a deep DT class and his past disciplinary issues could push Moore down a bit. Other nice day 3 alternatives include Georgia Tech DT TJ Barnes and Tennessee-Martin DT Montori Hughes.
7. Luke Marquardt, OT, Asuza Pacific. 6'8"+ 320#.
Super Sleeper! Marquardt is an enormous prospect with a basketball background and terrific size and athleticism from a small school, much like Jared Veldheer in 2010. Plus he's coached by HOF OT Jackie Slater, so he should get a good grounding in the fundamentals. BB has a nice relationship with Slater, one of the reasons he took Matt Slater in 2008. Marquardt would make a terrific developmental OT. A squad of Solder, Vollmer, Hurst and Marquardt would be a nice tackle group.
I'd like to figure out how to pick up a day 2-3 WR or maybe a TE. Michael Williams and Levine Toilolo still intrigue me, and possibly Joseph Fauria. But that's for another day.
I love it...but I demand that Michael Williams rockin the Elvis this time next year.
Brother Mayo
An excellent mock which would make me very happy. I know you see this as a trenches draft but I personally would like to see at least one skill player drafted - secondary or WR. I also suspect, as much as I like him, that Dion Jordan wouldn't be a first Patriot pick because of the reason you outlined, namely that he's not strong enough. I think BB will want the first pick to be an every down capable player and I'm not sure Jordan is. Those of course are just my meager opinions and not intended to denigrate what is an excellent mock and one that would make me happy.
One thought - watching the 'Bama game last night, what about Quinton Dial as one of the 3-4 type guys you've got? At 6'5, 304 lbs and with that Saban coached pedigree, he looks to be ideal as a late round Pats flyer.
And many thanks for the credits.
The Alabama RT Fluker looked good but he might be a 2014 guy. I liked the DB Milliner a lot.
Time for a another run at a mock now that the first 53 man roster and practice squad are out, and some of the strengths/weakness of the team are more evident. I'm assuming Tyrann Mathieu doesn't come out in 2013, and right now I'm happy waiting and seeing how Tavon Wilson and Jake Ebner develop at safety, so DB is not a focus of this mock. Neither is RB, as I want to see how the young kids do this year, and Jeff Demps is in the wings for 2013. As always, this is just throwing darts and kicking the tires on prospects of interest, and I'm assuming that the Pats pick at 32 in each round. I've also incorporated some prospects of interested from other folks' mocks.
*** Trade: The Pats trade #32 for a 2013 mid-2nd round and 3rd round picks. Brother Manx has suggested that guys like Dion Jordan and Jesse Williams aren't clear 1st round picks right now. That could change, but for now I agree. I still love their upside and versatility, so I could see BB trading back from 32. Unless someone is willing to offer a 2014 1st the way New Orleans did with the #28 pick in 2011, a 2nd and 3rd would seem reasonable.
2a. Dion Jordan, DE/LB/"DB", Oregon. 6'6" 245#.
Hybrid Beast! The "Preying Mantis" is a rare animal, a 6'6" guy with great explosion and quickness off the edge who is unreal in space. He came to Oregon as a WR, converted to TE, and then to DE. He is so agile in space that the Ducks sometimes use him to play press CB and to cover slot receivers. He spends most of his time playing out of a 2 point stance, even when he is on the line. Jordan is not stout enough to be a full time edge setter, but he has good core strength for his size. The Pats could move him around, including playing DB in "big nickel" packages. With his length, speed and agility, Jordan could be a unique weapon in a defense which already has playmakers like Chandler Jones and Dont'a Hightower.
2b. Jesse Williams, DT, Alabama. 6'4" 330#.
Beast! Star Lotulelei and Johnathan Hankins will likely be out of reach in 2013, but there is still plenty of depth and talent at the DT position. Williams could be a steal, and may have as much upside as either of those guys. An Australian transplant and JUCO transfer by way of Arizona, Wiliams played 3-4 DE for the Tide in 2011 but is taking over at NT for Josh Chapman in 2012. A former rugby player, Williams has tremendous strength and terrific movement skills for his size. He is a weight room fanatic with incredible core strength, who recently benched 600 lbs (Dontari Poe, who led the 2012 Combine at the bench press, had a best of 500 lbs. at Memphis), and very little body fat. Best quote: "I stopped looking for the monster under the bed when I realized the monster was me." Williams has enough agility and athleticism to play outside in the 3-4 and probably play 4-3 LDE as well, and enough strength and size to play 3-4 NT, 4-3 NT and 4-3 DT. Getting Williams might require a trade up in the 2nd round.
3a. Mark Jackson, OT/OG, Glenville St. 6'5" 328#.
Sleeper! Rated the #7 center in the country by Rivals coming out of high school and signed by Illinois, Jackson subsequently transferred to a small school and has been flying under the rader. A big kid with excellent footwork for his size, Jackson has positional versatility at tackle, guard and center. He's still a bit under the rader, but with a strong season he'll probably be a top 100 pick, and could even sneak into the 2nd round. I could see him becoming a Brian Waters kind of player at guard, with potential at RT as well. He could even be moved back to center. Tennessee OL Dallas Thomas could be an option here as well, if he lasts that long. I'd be happy with either.
I'm assuming that Brian Waters is gone after 2013 (at the latest). Logan Mankins and Dan Connolly are on the wrong side of 30. Ryan Wendell has made strides this preseason and Donald Thomas and Nick McDonald are works in progress. Marcus Cannon could move to the interior OL. But there is still room for at least one quality interior OL prospect, hopefully with the footwork to succeed Logan Mankins down the road. Mark Jackson and Marcus Cannon would give the Pats a huge combination of bookend guards for the future to pair with massive tackles Nate Solder and Sebastian Vollmer.
3b. James Hurst, OT, North Carolina. 6'7" 310#.
Sleeper! A Brother Manx find, Hurst is a big man with a lot of athleticism and good footwork. Sebastian Vollmer is in a contract year and his back issues are enough of a concern to keep the team from aggressively pursuing an extension at this time. Marcus Cannon is still a major question at RT. Hurst would make a nice swing tackle behind Solder and Vollmer, allowing Marcus Cannon to be moved to RG as Brian Waters presumably will be gone after 2013 (assuming he comes back this year), and a nice insurance policy in case Vollmer moves on after this year. Hurst has enough power to play RT and enough footwork and agility to play LT.
4. David Bass, DE, Missouri Western St.. 6'5" 280#.
Super Sleeper! Mackenzie Pantoja has recently profiled Bass, who has an intriguing combination of size, length, long arms, verticity, instincts and processing speed. Pantoja writes: "I have never before scouted a player who is tremendous at so many different things needed to stop the pass" and "I’m not sure if I could design a player better suited to cover the NFL’s new breed of 'super tight ends' (Gronk, Graham, etc.)". A 280# LDE who can drop back into coverage from a 3-point stance and cover a TE or a slot WR in addition to rushing the passer, clogging the passing lanes and setting the edge would be a tremendous weapon - so much so that Bass got me to pass on Margus Hunt in the 1st round in favor of Dion Jordan. A DE group of Fanene/Bass/Bequette at LDE and Chandler Jones/Bequette/Cunningham at RDE would have terrific depth and versatility.
5. Brandon Moore, DT, Texas. 6'5" 335#.
Super Sleeper Beast! Moore was recruited by Nick Saban to Alabama, and left the team for disciplinary reasons before transferring to Texas to be reunited with his old line coach. A huge kid with terrific athleticism, Moore has reportedly been dominant in Spring practices. With VInce Wilfork turning 32 in 2013 and Myron Pryor and Ron Brace UDFAs after this year a second interior lineman would be a nice addition. A front line of Wilfork, Williams, Love, Brace, Deaderick, Pryor/Forston and Moore would be a very strong group. I'm guessing that a deep DT class and his past disciplinary issues could push Moore down a bit. Other nice day 3 alternatives include Georgia Tech DT TJ Barnes and Tennessee-Martin DT Montori Hughes.
7. Luke Marquardt, OT, Asuza Pacific. 6'8"+ 320#.
Super Sleeper! Marquardt is an enormous prospect with a basketball background and terrific size and athleticism from a small school, much like Jared Veldheer in 2010. Plus he's coached by HOF OT Jackie Slater, so he should get a good grounding in the fundamentals. BB has a nice relationship with Slater, one of the reasons he took Matt Slater in 2008. Marquardt would make a terrific developmental OT. A squad of Solder, Vollmer, Hurst and Marquardt would be a nice tackle group.
I'd like to figure out how to pick up a day 2-3 WR or maybe a TE. Michael Williams and Levine Toilolo still intrigue me, and possibly Joseph Fauria. But that's for another day.
Time for a another run at a mock now that the first 53 man roster and practice squad are out, and some of the strengths/weakness of the team are more evident. I'm assuming Tyrann Mathieu doesn't come out in 2013, and right now I'm happy waiting and seeing how Tavon Wilson and Jake Ebner develop at safety, so DB is not a focus of this mock. Neither is RB, as I want to see how the young kids do this year, and Jeff Demps is in the wings for 2013. As always, this is just throwing darts and kicking the tires on prospects of interest, and I'm assuming that the Pats pick at 32 in each round. I've also incorporated some prospects of interested from other folks' mocks.
*** Trade: The Pats trade #32 for a 2013 mid-2nd round and 3rd round picks. Brother Manx has suggested that guys like Dion Jordan and Jesse Williams aren't clear 1st round picks right now. That could change, but for now I agree. I still love their upside and versatility, so I could see BB trading back from 32. Unless someone is willing to offer a 2014 1st the way New Orleans did with the #28 pick in 2011, a 2nd and 3rd would seem reasonable.
2a. Dion Jordan, DE/LB/"DB", Oregon. 6'6" 245#.
Hybrid Beast! The "Preying Mantis" is a rare animal, a 6'6" guy with great explosion and quickness off the edge who is unreal in space. He came to Oregon as a WR, converted to TE, and then to DE. He is so agile in space that the Ducks sometimes use him to play press CB and to cover slot receivers. He spends most of his time playing out of a 2 point stance, even when he is on the line. Jordan is not stout enough to be a full time edge setter, but he has good core strength for his size. The Pats could move him around, including playing DB in "big nickel" packages. With his length, speed and agility, Jordan could be a unique weapon in a defense which already has playmakers like Chandler Jones and Dont'a Hightower.
2b. Jesse Williams, DT, Alabama. 6'4" 330#.
Beast! Star Lotulelei and Johnathan Hankins will likely be out of reach in 2013, but there is still plenty of depth and talent at the DT position. Williams could be a steal, and may have as much upside as either of those guys. An Australian transplant and JUCO transfer by way of Arizona, Wiliams played 3-4 DE for the Tide in 2011 but is taking over at NT for Josh Chapman in 2012. A former rugby player, Williams has tremendous strength and terrific movement skills for his size. He is a weight room fanatic with incredible core strength, who recently benched 600 lbs (Dontari Poe, who led the 2012 Combine at the bench press, had a best of 500 lbs. at Memphis), and very little body fat. Best quote: "I stopped looking for the monster under the bed when I realized the monster was me." Williams has enough agility and athleticism to play outside in the 3-4 and probably play 4-3 LDE as well, and enough strength and size to play 3-4 NT, 4-3 NT and 4-3 DT. Getting Williams might require a trade up in the 2nd round.
3a. Mark Jackson, OT/OG, Glenville St. 6'5" 328#.
Sleeper! Rated the #7 center in the country by Rivals coming out of high school and signed by Illinois, Jackson subsequently transferred to a small school and has been flying under the rader. A big kid with excellent footwork for his size, Jackson has positional versatility at tackle, guard and center. He's still a bit under the rader, but with a strong season he'll probably be a top 100 pick, and could even sneak into the 2nd round. I could see him becoming a Brian Waters kind of player at guard, with potential at RT as well. He could even be moved back to center. Tennessee OL Dallas Thomas could be an option here as well, if he lasts that long. I'd be happy with either.
I'm assuming that Brian Waters is gone after 2013 (at the latest). Logan Mankins and Dan Connolly are on the wrong side of 30. Ryan Wendell has made strides this preseason and Donald Thomas and Nick McDonald are works in progress. Marcus Cannon could move to the interior OL. But there is still room for at least one quality interior OL prospect, hopefully with the footwork to succeed Logan Mankins down the road. Mark Jackson and Marcus Cannon would give the Pats a huge combination of bookend guards for the future to pair with massive tackles Nate Solder and Sebastian Vollmer.
3b. James Hurst, OT, North Carolina. 6'7" 310#.
Sleeper! A Brother Manx find, Hurst is a big man with a lot of athleticism and good footwork. Sebastian Vollmer is in a contract year and his back issues are enough of a concern to keep the team from aggressively pursuing an extension at this time. Marcus Cannon is still a major question at RT. Hurst would make a nice swing tackle behind Solder and Vollmer, allowing Marcus Cannon to be moved to RG as Brian Waters presumably will be gone after 2013 (assuming he comes back this year), and a nice insurance policy in case Vollmer moves on after this year. Hurst has enough power to play RT and enough footwork and agility to play LT.
4. David Bass, DE, Missouri Western St.. 6'5" 280#.
Super Sleeper! Mackenzie Pantoja has recently profiled Bass, who has an intriguing combination of size, length, long arms, verticity, instincts and processing speed. Pantoja writes: "I have never before scouted a player who is tremendous at so many different things needed to stop the pass" and "I’m not sure if I could design a player better suited to cover the NFL’s new breed of 'super tight ends' (Gronk, Graham, etc.)". A 280# LDE who can drop back into coverage from a 3-point stance and cover a TE or a slot WR in addition to rushing the passer, clogging the passing lanes and setting the edge would be a tremendous weapon - so much so that Bass got me to pass on Margus Hunt in the 1st round in favor of Dion Jordan. A DE group of Fanene/Bass/Bequette at LDE and Chandler Jones/Bequette/Cunningham at RDE would have terrific depth and versatility.
5. Brandon Moore, DT, Texas. 6'5" 335#.
Super Sleeper Beast! Moore was recruited by Nick Saban to Alabama, and left the team for disciplinary reasons before transferring to Texas to be reunited with his old line coach. A huge kid with terrific athleticism, Moore has reportedly been dominant in Spring practices. With VInce Wilfork turning 32 in 2013 and Myron Pryor and Ron Brace UDFAs after this year a second interior lineman would be a nice addition. A front line of Wilfork, Williams, Love, Brace, Deaderick, Pryor/Forston and Moore would be a very strong group. I'm guessing that a deep DT class and his past disciplinary issues could push Moore down a bit. Other nice day 3 alternatives include Georgia Tech DT TJ Barnes and Tennessee-Martin DT Montori Hughes.
7. Luke Marquardt, OT, Asuza Pacific. 6'8"+ 320#.
Super Sleeper! Marquardt is an enormous prospect with a basketball background and terrific size and athleticism from a small school, much like Jared Veldheer in 2010. Plus he's coached by HOF OT Jackie Slater, so he should get a good grounding in the fundamentals. BB has a nice relationship with Slater, one of the reasons he took Matt Slater in 2008. Marquardt would make a terrific developmental OT. A squad of Solder, Vollmer, Hurst and Marquardt would be a nice tackle group.
I'd like to figure out how to pick up a day 2-3 WR or maybe a TE. Michael Williams and Levine Toilolo still intrigue me, and possibly Joseph Fauria. But that's for another day.
Mayo, I'm wondering how you'd potentially revise this based on the info gained from game 1.
I'm not sure BB would want to keep 4 rookie DL's and 3 rookie OL's on the roster (essentially all the backups would be rookies). I would expect a WR, DB and possibly a QB drafted to reduce the number of rookies in one position.
I'm not sure BB would want to keep 4 rookie DL's and 3 rookie OL's on the roster (essentially all the backups would be rookies).
Great job, Brother Wilfork. I particularly like the Michael Williams and Seantrel Henderson picks. Barrett Jones is obviously a perfect fit assuming he's available and the Pats choose to go in that direction.