Worst BB coached game??

[1960Pats]

This game could have been one of his worst games, but his worst moment was without a doubt the multi-dumbensional 4th and 2 call in Indy in 09. I'm new here and I'm sure that was re-hashed here at the time, but that was idiotic in a number of ways and could have cost the team another LomBrady trophy.

 

[PATSYLICIOUS]

The final sequence was probably the worst management I've seen in BB's time here. Being that passive goes completely against what I've admired him for.

As for the whole game who knows. I did think the defense was brilliant so he has to get some credit for that. It may have been JMD's worst game though.

 

[PatsSox363804]

I thought a lot of the play calling was questionable (pitch to Woodhead on 3rd down to knowck us out of field goal range really stands out here) but at the end of the day it was the lack of execution and that's on the palyers.

-Welker dropped a pass for a first down which immediately led to a blocked punt

-poor blocking on said punt

-Brady throwing a pass without a clear lane on the first play leading to an INT

-Lloyd dropping a ball that hit him in the chest killing a drive

-Gronk having the deep TD pass hit him in the hands

-Arrington missing the tackle on Heap and then Gregory's personal foul

Key plays in all 3 phases cost them this game. I'd put most of the blame on the offense and almost none on the defense except for the arrington/gregory sequence but that was a huge moment in the game as well which led to Arizona's only real TD drive.

The good news is that all of this is correctable.

 

[Patriot_in_NY]

I don't know how the coaches get the blame for this one. You didn't need anything fancy to beat the Cardinals. The players didn't execute on offense. It's that simple. Dropped balls at key times, poor passes, non-existent pass protection at times...sorry, this one's on the players IMO.

Losses are always about poor execution, even marginal or crappy game plans can be overcome with talent and pinpoint execution. Then there is always play-calling that can be argued in this situation or that. When it comes down to purely "bad coaching" in a game, you can boil it down to 2-3 specific things, such as clock management and adjustments.

Personally, I think we made the right adjustments on offense and we did have some success later in the game. That success was often negated by poor execution, but we certainly found what was working against that D. So we are good there.

I did think some of the clock management stuff was suspect. Obviously the last drive. We had plenty of time and certainly could have gained another 10-15 yards for Gost. Yeah, we have a generally reliable kicker but a 43 yarder is not a chip shot by any stretch. Had we given him a 25-30 yarder, the outcome might have been different. Maybe we wouldn't have got those yards, but I found it perplexing that we did not even try.

We did a similar thing at the half. We marched 30 yards pretty easily, had about 45 seconds on the clock with 2 timeouts, at roughly mid-field. We just sat down. We could have easily given it a couple shots to get it in field goal range, but instead, we elected to call it a half and go into the locker room tied at 6. That's not the type of ball we are used to seeing in NE.

 

[ThatllMoveTheChains!!!]

The final sequence was probably the worst management I've seen in BB's time here. Being that passive goes completely against what I've admired him for.

As for the whole game who knows. I did think the defense was brilliant so he has to get some credit for that. It may have been JMD's worst game though.

I'm not sure if you can blame the offensive play calling when you repeatedly had guys open deep, but still ended up 2 for 9 on deep balls in the game. Poor execution in the passing game overall and horrible execution on the deep stuff was the story of this game.

 

[goheels22002]

I thought a lot of the play calling was questionable (pitch to Woodhead on 3rd down to knowck us out of field goal range really stands out here) but at the end of the day it was the lack of execution and that's on the palyers.

-Welker dropped a pass for a first down which immediately led to a blocked punt

-poor blocking on said punt

-Brady throwing a pass without a clear lane on the first play leading to an INT

-Lloyd dropping a ball that hit him in the chest killing a drive

-Gronk having the deep TD pass hit him in the hands

-Arrington missing the tackle on Heap and then Gregory's personal foul

Key plays in all 3 phases cost them this game. I'd put most of the blame on the offense and almost none on the defense except for the arrington/gregory sequence but that was a huge moment in the game as well which led to Arizona's only real TD drive.

The good news is that all of this is correctable.

Add the missed 43-yard field goal to your list. No reason for that after a stellar day for Gostkowski.

 

[ThatllMoveTheChains!!!]

-Brady throwing a pass without a clear lane on the first play leading to an INT

Little has been made of this one because it happened so early in the game, but it was definitely one of the most important miscues of the game. You have a team looking for validation by beating the best, and you serve up a big confidence boost on the first offensive snap trying to make a throw you should only be attempting if you absolutely need to...

 

[goheels22002]

I think game plan, personnel and execution have been the problem for the Patriots, and that's in both games. After the first game, I pointed to what I thought was just a mediocre performance by the offense, and I was told I was reading it wrong.

This second game was just the furtherance of the pattern, likely due in fair part to the LT, RG, RT and TE issues.

Execution is first on my list - the blocked punt, numerous dropped passes, 4 sacks, 8 penalties for 60 yards, the missed 43 yarder after Gostkowski nailed one from ten yards further away, and the interception to open the game. That's without even trying to review this game.

It does not matter what Josh is calling in from the sidelines, if the offense is going to screw up this much.

The Offensive Line definitely was outplayed yesterday. The blocked punt was an alignment issue, not one guy getting beat. How does that happen?

All the drops were killers - Gronk, LLoyd and Welker all had crucial drops on balls that hit their hands.

 

[PATSYLICIOUS]

I'm not sure if you can blame the offensive play calling when you repeatedly had guys open deep, but still ended up 2 for 9 on deep balls in the game. Poor execution in the passing game overall and horrible execution on the deep stuff was the story of this game.

Oh yeah, I never said the execution didn't deserve part of the blame. It was plenty of blame to go around and I don't pinpoint any one in particular. All I'm saying is the play calling was probably the worst I've seen from JMD.

 

[mb6592]

...Brady centers the ball with :44 to go. This lack of execution is on McDaniels. It was an ultra-conservative call by JM. Instead of putting the ball in the hands of his best player, Brady, he opts for setting up the kick. Play doesn't matter due to a false start by Gronk, and we move back five yards and put :46 seconds back on the clock. This down was maddening to me. Brady, while no doubt not having his best day, is still the best option. There was time to run at least 2 plays in the middle of the field and then spike the ball.

Replay first down, and McD calls the same play, ditto above, minus the knucklehead false start by Gronk.

Next play, Brady spikes the ball with :06 left. 40 seconds wasted. Then Ghost pulls it left. If Gronk, McDaniels or Ghost execute, game over.

Maddening.

We've talked about the decision to center the ball in another thread set up about it and this is my stance; either you run the ball and risk a turnover and further loss of yardage (and the O Line weren't spectacular blocking for he run) , you drop back in a game where Brady has been harassed all day long and risk a turnover/sack or you center the ball for your kicker who has made four FGs of 30+ yards and three of which were 40+ and two of those were over 50!

You aren't guaranteed the ball to be centred when you run a play so they put heir faith in their hot footed kicker with a middle of the field shot...and he choked.

and he choked? UK_Pat37, I think you're wrong on this. The best part of Belichick the coach - what separates him from many other coaches - is his philosophy of putting his players in positions where they can succeed. If McDaniels was responsible for centering the ball insead of getting closer, then Belichick should have called him out on it. I don't care how hot a kicker is during the game - 40+ yard field goals, with no time remaining, are not gimme's.

I always laughed at coaches who, with over 1 minute to go, would run it (or take a knee) when they reached the opponent's 25 yard line - in effect settling for a 40+ yard field goal and setting up their kickers for failure. Numerous games have been lost by 2nd rung coaches who made such mistakes. A 42 yard field goal with no time remaining is vastly different than the kicks Ghost was making earlier in the game. I never thought Belichick would make this mistake, especially with Brady at the helm. A 30 or less yarder is a gimme. A 35 yarder? Maybe. A 40 yarder is probably a 60-40 proposition. OK, with Ghost it's probably 70-30. But, even that kind of risk is unnecessary when you have Brady who almost certainly (90+%) will be able to get you an extra 10 yards or so with 1 minute remaining.

 

[Uncle Rico]

Lots of odd things — all covered here, from the final "drive" to Welker-Edelman to Dowling-Moore.

Did anybody hear BB's post-game press conference? The Q&A part was pretty standard, media asking few questions because they knew they wouldn't get answers and BB proving them right.

But what struck me was the opening statement -- Belichick sounded borderline upbeat. Almost reminded me of '08, after the Chiefs/Brady injury game. It was almost like he's looking forward to the challenge he knows is ahead of him. Maybe there's a better way to put it; maybe it's just my imagination. Anyone?

 

[PATSYLICIOUS]

Lots of odd things — all covered here, from the final "drive" to Welker-Edelman to Dowling-Moore.

Did anybody hear BB's post-game press conference? The Q&A part was pretty standard, media asking few questions because they knew they wouldn't get answers and BB proving them right.

But what struck me was the opening statement -- Belichick sounded borderline upbeat. Almost reminded me of '08, after the Chiefs/Brady injury game. It was almost like he's looking forward to the challenge he knows is ahead of him. Maybe there's a better way to put it; maybe it's just my imagination. Anyone?

I didn't hear it but I think there's lots of reason to be upbeat about this team. The defense appears to have shown that it's no longer a weakness, in fact it may be a strength of the team. And I'm pretty sure this offense is going to iron itself out eventually, especially if whatever's been keeping Welker on the sideline gets settled.

 

[Deus Irae]

Not until midway thru the 4th quarter. It was more of the same crap in the 3rd quarter and part of the 4th.

Not everyone sees it your way. If we all thought alike, it would be a boring world.

And, is it required to check with you by all others here before posting?

No, it's not required. It would be nice, though, if you would make truthful posts. You claimed McDaniels didn't adjust. It was patently obvious that he did adjust.

 

[Ivan]

Belichick has been outcoached from time to time but that wasn't one of those games imo, that one was lost on effort and execution. I think the Patriots allowed themselves to believe the hype and thought that was a win before taking the field, and it cost them. There was no sense of urgency until the very end and even then they made the mistake of thinking they had it in the bag when they didn't.

Look on the bright side, now no-one can talk about going undefeated.


Can't wait for next Sunday, the Ravens are going to have a great big hair across their collective asses, and they have many of them, and the Patriots will get one of their stiffest tests for the season, that game will tell us much more about what kind of team they have than the first 2. I like this defense but it is hard to judge their pass defense when Locker was mediocre and Kolb was sailing balls ten yards over the heads of his receivers.

 

[jsull87]

Getting stuffed. If anything Josh tried too hard to feature the run. Try watching the game before adding commentary.

I like the OP have faith in this team and am over the loss (even tho i hate losing)

But i do think there is a valid point regarding the coaching in this game and how it needs to be improved.

The Field Goal, Offensive Play Calling and preperation for the Arizona D seemed to not be to our usually high standards.

Usually against a dominant front (Stealers, Ravens, Jets) the pats get their best weapons on the field and spread the D out, helping the OL with the pass rush change it up every now and then to Woody/RB and feature hurry up quick effective passes. Now we have Lloyd who can run the intermediate to long routes this should have been even more prevalent

This theory was vindicated by the change to this in the late 3rd and 4th quarter drives where we moved the ball seemingly with ease.

We instead seemed to try and take these teams on at their strength... interior runs where the pats were quickly stuffed when crunch time came and they wanted to run and the defense knew it e.g third and short sweep to woody.

I am all for featuring the run game... but if you want to do that then you have to be able to execute it in these types of situations and it seems the pats really shot themselves in the foot with some of the calls.

As i said this is early and a learning experience plus some humble pie for both this offense and for JMcD.

Lets hope we come out and are more prepared next week.

 

[jsull87]

No, it's not required. It would be nice, though, if you would make truthful posts. You claimed McDaniels didn't adjust. It was patently obvious that he did adjust.

I think McDaniels did adjust in the late 3rd and 4th. My only opposition regarding the coaching and preparation yesterday would be that the Pats have a formula against Good 3-4 fronts which is spread them out make their OLB's try and chase our Offense when they sub into nickle mix in the run game and feature Gronk (which we did in the 2nd half and as we saw it worked).

My only thought is the adjustment made at half time would have been a logical game plan going in if you look at the ex steelers DC and where the Cardinals D is strong, Down the Middle.

 

[crawhammer]

Wow, you seem to know quite a bit about Belichick, smart coaching decisions, "garbage," etc. Please share more of your bright insights.

Moving Edelman ahead of Welker on the depth chart is a "smart coaching decision"? Only a moron would suggest that.

Seriously, by what measure has Edelman deserved a starting position on this team? Or Welker a demotion?

Edelman has exhibited marginal effectiveness in 3 full seasons. During the same timeframe, Welker's a 3-time pro bowler, 2-time all-pro, twice led the league in receptions (123 and 122 receptions respectively), averaged 1255 receiving yards, and scored 20 touchdowns.

So again, only a total fool (in this case, Bill "genius" Belichick) would move Edelman ahead of Welker on the depth chart.

 

[ausbacker]

This was nowhere near SB42.

 

[crawhammer]

Tune, don't get sucked in by some dude with minimal posts. He's clearly of the school that Brady made Belichick.

As a matter of FACT, Brady has made Belichick...

Belichick without Brady:
7 seasons, 51-62 regular season record, 0 division titles, 1 postseason (1-1 record), 0 Super Bowl championships

Belichick with Brady:
10 seasons, 124-35 regular season record, 9 division titles, 9 postseasons (16-6 record), 6 AFCCG appearances, 5 Super Bowl appearances, 3 Super Bowl championships

The disparity is plainly obvious.

Taking a closer look, Belichick began his tenure in New England with a 5-13 record. After Brady became the starting QB, the team went on a 14-3 run that culminated with their first Super Bowl championship. In total of course they would go on to win 3 of 4 Super Bowls. It's not just a coincidence that Belichick became a winner immediately after Brady became his starting QB.

 

[Boomer B]

As a matter of FACT, Brady has made Belichick...

Belichick without Brady:
7 seasons, 51-62 regular season record, 0 division titles, 1 postseason (1-1 record), 0 Super Bowl championships

Belichick with Brady:
10 seasons, 124-35 regular season record, 9 division titles, 9 postseasons (16-6 record), 6 AFCCG appearances, 5 Super Bowl appearances, 3 Super Bowl championships

The disparity is plainly obvious.

Taking a closer look, Belichick began his tenure in New England with a 5-13 record. After Brady became the starting QB, the team went on a 14-3 run that culminated with their first Super Bowl championship. In total of course they would go on to win 3 of 4 Super Bowls. It's not just a coincidence that Belichick became a winner immediately after Brady became his starting QB.

Obviously having Brady has attributed to many of those wins, but let's not act like Belichick didn't have a major part in them also.

Those Super Bowl teams were just as much about the defense as they were about Brady. Without Belichicks defensive schemes we don't beat the Rams in the Super Bowl and the Colts in their prime years. You also have to give Belichick credit in building the team as well as adapting to the changes in the NFL. When the league enforced the no contact rule with the WRs Bill adapted and went after Moss and Welker, completely changing the offence.

In my mind it took both Brady and Belichick to win those Super Bowls and all the games over the last decade. If either of them were missing from the equation we wouldn't have won any titles.