Will the Colts like living without a salary cap?

[ICSB]

Opening a new stadium must have improved their top line, but they can't afford to compete with genuinely successful teams like New England.

Based on what? The Colts have won 4 out of the last 5 games against NE. We beat the Steelers last year too. We can play with the best, are you kidding me? I don't even think the Pats are the team who will keep us from winning it all again, I think it's San Diego. We have been successful for years and in fact have won a Super Bowl more previously than New England has.

it will also put pressure on Indy to field a team that can compete with New England, even in an uncapped year.

What is this compete with NE thing you keep harping over? You make it sound like we are the Raiders or something. Not saying the Pats are not quite good, but give us a LITTLE credit here.

Ultimately I think its unclear whether the Colts benefit or not from an uncapped year.

How should I know? I am just a fan. I leave the cap junk to Polian. He is no moron.

With Dungy gone, I think they are likely to continue their slide towards mediocrity whether or not there is a cap in 2010.

Continue our slide? What is this continue thing? We won 12 games last year and Peyton won MVP. I know we went one and done. (there is San Diego again) We had plenty of issues including our run game and our run D. I think if we can work on those this offseason and have a good draft we will be in good shape. And Manning was in rough shape for the first half of last season.

And I find it amusing since this forum has always picked on Dungy and called him one and Dungy. Personally I felt it was time for him to go, I did not feel his heart was in it the last season or so and at times he was too conservative. He has nothing to do with our offense. But, the defense under Meeks and Dungy was poor against the run again and with Coyer I feel we will see some changes.

Dallas Clark at 13.9M cap hit, is ridiculous.
The Colts won several miracle games last year. This year their true talent will show. They might not even be a .500 team next season.

I think our true talent is not too bad. Manning, Wayne, Clark, Saturday, Freeney, Mathis, Sanders, Hayden. Sounds like decent talent to me. Sounds like some of the best in the league at their positions.

Yes I know we had some fun wins last year. But, that was last year and a tougher schedule IMO, next years schedule looks more favorable to me. Not to mention our franchise QB had two knee surgeries right before the season started and we had zero run game and lost our two biggest DTs to drugs and retirement. Our best DT is a guy we picked up off the TN practice squad last year.

Many will harp on Dungy leaving and I understand that but Caldwell has been waiting for some time to have this job. I have faith he will inspire the troops and do a good job. If Polian feels he is the right man for the job I feel confident. Not to mention the yearly "will Dungy leave" story got annoying to me.

 

[NEGoldenAge]

Based on what? The Colts have won 4 out of the last 5 games against NE. We beat the Steelers last year too. We can play with the best, are you kidding me? I don't even think the Pats are the team who will keep us from winning it all again, I think it's San Diego. We have been successful for years and in fact have won a Super Bowl more previously than New England has.

Actually, the colts were given one of those victories, they didn't actually win. League official admits: a bad call was made

They should not have been in the SB in the first place, and that would make 3 out of the last five.

I don't think the colts are going to suck, but they have yet to earn even a superbowl appearance under Manning.

 

[solman]

Based on what? The Colts have won 4 out of the last 5 games against NE. We beat the Steelers last year too. We can play with the best, are you kidding me? I don't even think the Pats are the team who will keep us from winning it all again, I think it's San Diego. We have been successful for years and in fact have won a Super Bowl more previously than New England has.

The operative word was "Afford". Based on the fact that New England had the second highest revenue in 2007 while Indianapolis was tied for third lowest revenue. As I noted in the original post, the Colt's new stadium (and their sweetheart deal on it) will almost certainly improve their financial situation. But when it comes to paying players in a (hypothetical and unlikely) uncapped world, Indy can't afford to compete with New England.

Continue our slide? What is this continue thing? We won 12 games last year and Peyton won MVP. I know we went one and done. (there is San Diego again) We had plenty of issues including our run game and our run D. I think if we can work on those this offseason and have a good draft we will be in good shape. And Manning was in rough shape for the first half of last season.

If you are happy with your team's performance, then I am happy for you.

And I find it amusing since this forum has always picked on Dungy and called him one and Dungy. Personally I felt it was time for him to go, I did not feel his heart was in it the last season or so and at times he was too conservative. He has nothing to do with our offense. But, the defense under Meeks and Dungy was poor against the run again and with Coyer I feel we will see some changes.

I like picking on Dungy, but I have also started a number of threads calling him a brilliant coach. I thought he got much more out of your team in 2007 and 2008 than they should have been capable of, and I gave him credit at the time.

I think our true talent is not too bad. Manning, Wayne, Clark, Saturday, Freeney, Mathis, Sanders, Hayden. Sounds like decent talent to me. Sounds like some of the best in the league at their positions.

I think Indy has a lot of talent (concentrated in a small number of over-compensated individuals). I would not be willing to bet even money on them going .500 or worse this year. But if I didn't already have two bets against the Colts this year, I would be willing to bet one dollar against two on this proposition.

 

[ICSB]

Some of you are right. Colts will suck next year. Their division is full of future dynasties and great QBs. All the Colts stars will break their legs in preseason. Caldwell will turn out to be an alcoholic and Polian will have to start coaching the team by November. The Colts schedule is insane. The NFC West looks like a break but it will be the best division in the NFC next year. The AFC East will be brutal beyond belief to even manage to get a single win from. Colts will also go 0-6 in the division too. Their draft will suck and most of their picks will be cut before training camp due to drug use and arrests.

Fans will be crying for Sorgi to start by December to finally get us to a respectable level. Manning will be horrible and will flip off reporters every week after games. He will also start smoking heavily to deal with anxiety over the salary cap and how the Colts just flat out stink and get lucky and the refs will start going against the Colts. Not like we ever earned a single win anyway but next year the refs will have put a lot of money on the Colts having a losing season.

But, at the very least Detroit went 0-16 so it will lessen the pain when the Colts do the same this year.

The Pats will go 19-0. Brady will clearly not miss a beat from his injury and throw 60 TDs. Fred Taylor will not miss a single game. Galloway will channel a young Jerry Rice. The Pats pass rush will send shivers down the spines of every QB in the league. One of the Pats new corners will become the new Ty Law!

Every game the Colts play in even at home will have heavy snow.



Put all your money on it. Colts 0-16. Pats 19-0!!!!

I am glad I know all this now (like every offseason) so I can better plan my Sundays to play golf or do something else.

 

[spacecrime]

Some of you are right. Colts will suck next year.

They didn't play all that well this past year, either, for that matter. had a few games fall to them in the early going.

Next year is next year.

If Dungy was as great as you guys kept saying he was, there will likely be a dropoff. Otherwise, it probably depends on the health of Sanders.

 

[workhorse]

Actually, the colts were given one of those victories, they didn't actually win. League official admits: a bad call was made

They should not have been in the SB in the first place, and that would make 3 out of the last five.

I don't think the colts are going to suck, but they have yet to earn even a superbowl appearance under Manning.

I thought it was Colts fans that were the ones that cry about the officials. BTW, the Colts were down 21-3 in that game give them some credit. There are blown calls in every game.

 

[ICSB]

They didn't play all that well this past year, either, for that matter. had a few games fall to them in the early going.

Next year is next year.

If Dungy was as great as you guys kept saying he was, there will likely be a dropoff. Otherwise, it probably depends on the health of Sanders.

We need DT help. We can't depend on Sanders to be our "run defense" or else we will see a repeat of last season and one and done again if we are lucky. We are in a run heavy division so its crucial we pick up a few DTs in the draft. I don't care if its the first round or they are UDFAs. Just a few bodies who can help stop the run and make Freeney and Mathis that much better. And take pressure off of Sanders, who is injury prone I realize and it does get frustrating. But, he better stay healthy next year because his backup, Bullitt is showing to be able to hold his own quite well. Bethea is a FA next year though.

And I do not necessarily expect a first round DT based on BPA so who knows. But, our best DT is currently a guy we picked up halfway through last season who was on the Titans PS.

On the other side the o line needs to get better. It may have been just too much youth and injuries there last season though.

I fully realize the Colts won't sniff a Super Bowl let alone do a thing in the playoffs if we don't improve the lines regardless if Caldwell is coaching us or Vince Lombardi.

Unforuntately we have terrible luck at DT. McFarland was a main reason we won the Super Bowl and blows out his knee. Corey Simon gets a mysterious illness. Pit**** retires after one season. Ed Johnson smoked pot and got busted.

 

[PatsFanSince74]

Two thoughts.

One, I think the Colts will have a tough time without the Cap since it is designed to benefit franchises exactly like their's and the Chargers', etc. Big Market teams like the Pats, Cowboys and, unfortunately, the Jests will be able to spend more freely, as long as the Ownerships are committed.

Two, in general, I don't think we should waste much energy worrying about how good or bad the Colts might or might not be. Personally, I agree with those who argue that they will always be good as long as Peyton is standing over Center. But, in general, I think we should take care of our own business and let other teams worry about themselves, except, of course, when we are playing them.

 

[solman]

Two thoughts.

One, I think the Colts will have a tough time without the Cap since it is designed to benefit franchises exactly like their's and the Chargers', etc. Big Market teams like the Pats, Cowboys and, unfortunately, the Jests will be able to spend more freely, as long as the Ownerships are committed.

The Jets (and Giants) are very valuable franchises. But they are middle of the pack in terms of revenue, and therefore how much they can profitably spend on players.

The new stadium may change things, but New Jersey taxpayers have been far less generous than their Indianapolis counterparts.

 

[NEGoldenAge]

I thought it was Colts fans that were the ones that cry about the officials. BTW, the Colts were down 21-3 in that game give them some credit. There are blown calls in every game.

True, there are blown calls in most games. However, this is the only instance that I'm aware of, where a rule that has been gone for over 20 years was invoked. It must be pure coincidence that it just happened to be the difference in the AFCCG. You can pretend to believe whatever you want, but you know, I know, and every coherent football fan knows that the Colts get the calls in the playoffs.

 

[godef]

I wonder if they have Minnesota on their schedule.

Not two years in a row. It'll be four season before they play them again.

 

[PatsFanSince74]

The Jets (and Giants) are very valuable franchises. But they are middle of the pack in terms of revenue, and therefore how much they can profitably spend on players.

The new stadium may change things, but New Jersey taxpayers have been far less generous than their Indianapolis counterparts.

Yeah, you're right about the numbers. Clearly the new stadium will impact things as well. Thanks, that's good news. And, I do think that the Pats will join the Cowboys, Redskins and Eagles as big spenders.

 

[workhorse]

True, there are blown calls in most games. However, this is the only instance that I'm aware of, where a rule that has been gone for over 20 years was invoked. It must be pure coincidence that it just happened to be the difference in the AFCCG. You can pretend to believe whatever you want, but you know, I know, and every coherent football fan knows that the Colts get the calls in the playoffs.

You know the tables were turned with the playoff game in Foxboro where the Pats' DBs were all over the Colts' receivers and it wasn't getting called at all. Any Colt fan that said something was a whiner.

BTW, Phil Simms is the one that call face guarding, not the ref. He called PI.

NFL Game Center: Play-by-Play - New England Patriots at Indianapolis Colts - 2006 20

 

[NEGoldenAge]

You know the tables were turned with the playoff game in Foxboro where the Pats' DBs were all over the Colts' receivers and it wasn't getting called at all. Any Colt fan that said something was a whiner.

BTW, Phil Simms is the one that call face guarding, not the ref. He called PI.

NFL Game Center: Play-by-Play - New England Patriots at Indianapolis Colts - 2006 20

Tables turned? That year, refs weren't calling a lot of PI, and BB took advantage. The next year the interpetation of the rule was changed because Poilan (a.k.a whiney DB), yet again, misused his influence.

The fact is, the refs later admitted to a mistake. Check the link I posted. This is a FACT that the officials have apologized for. I know, because I watched it and flipped out.... knowing that the rule hadn't existed in a very long time. Phil Simms is not a ref, and hasn't played in many years. He actually played when that rule was in effect, I believe.

Read the link mang, you'll learn.

PS- The ref's description of the infraction indicated it was because Hobbs wasn't looking at the ball. That is what face guarding is. Just because the ref used the definition of the term, and not the term iteself, does not change the fact.

 

[Deus Irae]

You know the tables were turned with the playoff game in Foxboro where the Pats' DBs were all over the Colts' receivers and it wasn't getting called at all. Any Colt fan that said something was a whiner.

BTW, Phil Simms is the one that call face guarding, not the ref. He called PI.

NFL Game Center: Play-by-Play - New England Patriots at Indianapolis Colts - 2006 20

1.) The rules were changed. Because of Polian.

2.) There was no contact on the P.I. call. That's why Simms was talking about face guarding. It was a horrible call by the official.

 

[workhorse]

1.) The rules were changed. Because of Polian.

They weren't changed. They were told they needed to make sure they enforced them. Nothing was added to the rule book.

 

[TrueBeliever]

Not quite the same thing, but a few years ago I got really tikked after reading an article about how Jim Irsay was whining about how hard his team had it playing in such a small market. Not that I'm up for uprooting another franchise, but if Irsay had it so tough in Indy why didn't he move the club to Los Angeles? The league would've bent over backwards eight ways from Sunday to secure a stadium there. Plus since the Colts actually are one of the more dominant clubs, they might have actually been able to pull in some fans in the notoriously apathetic L.A. fan base and make a go of it.

But no, he chose to stay in his small market, and that's fine, the league has found ways to make it work in small cities like Buffalo and Green Bay. But since he made his choice, he should quit *****ing about it, IMHO.

 

[solman]

Not quite the same thing, but a few years ago I got really tikked after reading an article about how Jim Irsay was whining about how hard his team had it playing in such a small market. Not that I'm up for uprooting another franchise, but if Irsay had it so tough in Indy why didn't he move the club to Los Angeles? The league would've bent over backwards eight ways from Sunday to secure a stadium there. Plus since the Colts actually are one of the more dominant clubs, they might have actually been able to pull in some fans in the notoriously apathetic L.A. fan base and make a go of it.

But no, he chose to stay in his small market, and that's fine, the league has found ways to make it work in small cities like Buffalo and Green Bay. But since he made his choice, he should quit *****ing about it, IMHO.

He stayed in Indy because they locals allowed him to rape them up the butt on this new stadium deal.

Good business for him, and the folks from Indy seem to like it.

 

[MassPats38]

They weren't changed. They were told they needed to make sure they enforced them. Nothing was added to the rule book.

See workhorse - if the Colts hit their decline and return to pre-Manning form this banter about luck and officials just wouldn't be a possibility. I would miss those arguments, something fierce. It just was not as much fun before Manning and the Colt's success.

I do wonder about life without Dungy. Love him or hate him, you cannot question his results as a head coach. Gruden should be sending him that 2002 trophy as that was Dungy's team as well. It all fell apart in Tampa Bay the longer Gruden remained as head coach. I am interested in seeing how Dungy's successor does in Indy (although Manning probably can run that offense without the coordinator or coach at this point - it is the off field personality stuff that can undo the on field performance that remains to be seen).

 

[coltsfan]

If you are happy with your team's performance, then I am happy for you.



I like picking on Dungy, but I have also started a number of threads calling him a brilliant coach. I thought he got much more out of your team in 2007 and 2008 than they should have been capable of, and I gave him credit at the time.



I think Indy has a lot of talent (concentrated in a small number of over-compensated individuals). I would not be willing to bet even money on them going .500 or worse this year. But if I didn't already have two bets against the Colts this year, I would be willing to bet one dollar against two on this proposition.

Well, 12-4 ain't bad at all. It would be great to win the SB, but only one team wins that. Everyone else goes home unhappy. But we had a great season IMO considering how lousy we started with Peyton's injury, Pit****'s "retirement", and Ed Johnson getting kicked off the team for smoking pot. We looked god awful the first few games, but got it turned around and were one of the best teams in the league by the end. We just got stuck with a tough matchup in the playoffs on the road, at night, against a talented team.

I agree that Dungy was good. We'll have to see if he will be missed or not. He was definitely a good defensive coach who got us ready to play on that side in big games. We'll see what Coyer can bring.

Who is "over-compensated"? We hear that every year from you guys. We heard it on Freeney, and then a lesser player in Jared Allen gets a bigger deal the next year, and then Haynesworth the year after that. Freeney is the best pass rusher in football, so he deserved that (Spare me the statistics, he dominates with a couple of jokes lined up next to him at DT, and faces FAR more double teams than guys like Ware and Allen bc of it. The last and only OT that has stopped him without help was when Orlando Pace was in his prime 3 years ago.).

Hayden got the same deals that Corey Webster and Chris Gamble got, and that Domique freakin' Foxworth got from the Ravens. Mathis is one of the few guys that Polian made an effort to sign before he hit unrestricted free agency, and is actually a good deal for the Colts bc of it. Saturday only signed for $4M a year. Sanders is the only one that can really be argued is being overpaid, and that's bc he gets hurt so much.