Will PATS be better or worst than last year?

[VJCPatriot]

I think 12-4 is a pretty realistic projection for this team. The big turnaround at WR will be key to the rebuilt offense. Our defense should also improve as some of our rookies hit that big second year of experience and hopefully take a leap forward in their sophmore years.

Overall we got an infusion of talent in the draft, and a couple of free agents. The only guys we lost of mention - Welker, Woodhead. Amendola isn't as good as Welker but hopefully his hands will be more reliable. And Vereen has just been waiting to step up into Woodhead's role. Vereen is bigger and more athletic than Woodhead. Ridley will be our goto workhorse. We get a real kick returner for once in Leon Washington.

The tight ends are the same except we get a little extra talent with Ballard added to the mix.

The defense is really where I hope for the most improvements. Talib, Dennard, Chandler, and Hightower will have another year in the system. And hopefully they reach that point where they know the system so well that they can just react. That I think is where the potential lies for a big improvement.

Meanwhile Wilson also brings veteran leadership to the secondary. Hopefully he becomes a key pickup for our defensive backfield. Better communication, better paying attention to assignments will help a lot.

Next consider our passrushers. Chandler Jones is poised for a huge breakout year. I expect double digit sacks if he stays healthy. If or When this happens, the key will be who keeps the defense honest on the other side of the line. Will it be Collins, Ninkovich, Armstead or maybe FA brought in after June cuts? Who knows. But we definitely need another passrushing presence and a legit LDE so that defenses won't just doubleteam Jones all game long.

If everything comes together, I could see a top 10 defensive unit emerging next year. Now that would be a VERY WELCOME sight come playoff time. We need a defense that the offense can lean on, to hold onto close leads, and not crack in the 4th quarter, 3rd and long, 4th and long, and in the clutch.

Sure this Pats team has questionmarks still, as does EVERY NFL team out there. But I'm optimistic and looking forward to what they can do. We might be a little slow out of the gate with all these new parts to integrate, but I expect them to finish strong in the second half of the season.

And when your competitors are the Dolphins, the Bills, and the Jets, well that does help make it easier. Who here thinks the Jets implode before game 8 of the season? I give em 6 games before they have to throw Geno Smith to the wolves. And it won't be pretty for the rookie QB.

 

[PYPER]

I think we'll be better. I thought our defense played much better the second half of the year. BB's defenses require players to think on their feet and recognize what is happening around them. The breakdowns we have, have more to do with youth and inexperience than talent. We've got plenty of talent. I expect the experience factor alone to lead to drastic defensive improvement.

SPECIAL TEAMS - Maybe a little bit better but not significantly so. I expect the main improvement to come from Ghost who was a bit off last year. Hopefully that proves to be an aberration and not a trend. Our coverage and return games were pretty good for the most part and I don't see that changing much. Maybe Washington adds a spark but I doubt it will be noticeably better.

DEFENSE - MUCH BETTER!

DL - better
The additions of Armstead and Kelly plus another year of seasoning for Deaderick and Love should lead to improvement. The only question mark is when do we see Big Vince start declining? I thought he seemed to be peaking the past two years. Will he continue to play at that level?

LB - Much better
I'm not sure Collins will be able to contribute more than depth during his rookie year but the return of Fletcher and the continued development of Jones (3-4?), Hightower, Spikes, and the unit as a whole has me pretty excited.

Secondary - Much better
Having Talib for a full season and the continued development of Dennard and T.Wilson shouild make this a much stronger unit. I also love what A. Wilson brings to the table as he's a big body we can utilize effectively in our sub packages. Unlike others, I'm high on Gregory but love him even more as solid depth behind McCourty. Anything from the rookies is icing on the cake.

OFFENSE - Questionable (lower floor but I think a higher ceiling, so to speak)

WR - Questionable Spot
This unit will likely determine whether the offense soars or fails. I didn't think our WR's were particularly good last year. Lloyd never seemed to click with Brady and Welker, despite his production, frustrated me throughout the year with his untimely drops. I'm excited by the potential of this new group but trying to remain realistic. There will likely be many bumps in the road before they become a cohesive unit. The one thing I'm most excited by is that all of these guys are thought to have good hands. If that turns out to be true, we may see the return of the clutch version of Mr. Brady.

TE - better
Gronk and Hernandez were rarely healthy at the same time last year so my guess is that it should only improve.

RB - worse
Our RB's were fantastic last season. It'll be hard for them to repeat that productivity.

OL - Questionable Spot #2
It all depends on health. Soldier is still on the upswing which should help. Mankins....probably not. Vollmer has been battling that back injury for two years. When healthy he might be the best RT in football. If not, bad for us. Cannon is still on the upswing so hopefully he'll contribute more good than bad. The rest of the guys seem like jags elevated by our system and coaching. As always, this unit can be a strength or a weakness, and sometimes both. I'd expect it to be about the same.

Summary:
We've got a young team returning 22 of 24 starters many of whom are still wet behind the ears. As such, we should be better. Having said that, I do expect some growing pains. The offense may not be as statistically productive, at least early on, but I believe they have greater potential to challenge the top defensive teams. It seemed to me that top defensive teams, like the Ravens and Steelers have figured us out in recent years. I believe Welker's departure was a blessing in disguise. In theory at least, the new additions will allow us to attack these teams differently and on paper at least, we've got some interesting matchups that may give us the advantage. Time will tell, but I think we'll be better off this year on offense, even if the stats don't agree.

 

[Sparetire]

I dont get it, the yes optioin is for the better or the worse?

I think that we can be alot better, but there are so many things that can effect a whole season. i'll go with worse just cause i dont wanna jinx us.

 

[DarrylS]

This team has been rebuilt in front of our eyes, the previous d backfield weaknesses have improved and the receiving corps has been retooled. The infusion of a lot of young talent has also made us faster...

We have gone from the one of the oldest on D and O, to one of the youngest on both..

IMO the addition of Adrian Wilson, bringing back Talib and another year of playing together in the D backfield is extremely beneficial.. at one point last year we had a d backfield that had combined NFL experience of less than 5 years total.


This team is good for 12 or 13 wins..

 

[Triumph]

IF the rookie wide receivers contribute, worse regular season but better in the playoffs. :first:

The Post season is usually where rookie fall off because of the length of an NFL season is almost double to that of a NCAA season.

There really isnt anyway to prepare for the rookie wall.

 

[PATSYLICIOUS]

They'll be better. History shows that since 2003, with Brady healthy and not in a recovery phase, 12-4 is usually the worst case scenario for us. And I feel this team on paper is better than most of those teams except the '03,'04,'07 versions.

 

[BB4PRez]

Over the coarse of the entire 16 game season ? 50/50

The team needs to be better in January - they have gotten younger to try to do that

 

[PATSYLICIOUS]

RB - worse
Our RB's were fantastic last season. It'll be hard for them to repeat that productivity.

This is likely true but I could also see Ridley taking his game to the next level and becoming a borderline elite back. He looked like a stud early in the season then kind of slowed down over the 2nd half. Still lots of potential there. Plus if Gronk, Vollmer, Mankins are actually healthy this year we could see a huge improvement in the run game. Also Vereen showed in the Houston playoff game that he could add a whole new dimension to the offense that Woodhead could not. So while Woodhead is a loss, the potential is there and it's more than reasonably possible to not only make up for him being gone, but upgrade the performance of 2012 at RB.

 

[patfanken]

OFFENSIVE LINE
We are returning the same starting line. They had injuries in the past. What you seem to be suggesting is that since there will be no injuries this year, they will be better. Again, I hope that you are correct.

You ignore the loss of Thomas because you seem to presume the health of the OL as well as the conversion of Cannon to OG. I certainly agree that if Cannon is good enough to start at RG, we have a BETTER OL. However, I have no confidence at all that this will happen.

I always applaud vet OL coming to camp. Occasionally one actually makes the team. We badly needed OT help before Vollmer re-signed. As it is, we have Vollmer, Solder, Cannon and Zusevics. All these in addition to Svitek.

So, for me, unless Cannon is truly shifting to OG, we are short an OG and have an extra OT.

So, I'm simply saying that the loss of Thomas as an OG is more important than the gain in getting competition at backup OT in Svitek.

2 points on the OL - what makes you SO sure that Cannon couldn't perform at RG. Is it because you don't think he has the talent, because that's an assessment that needs an explanation, or just that you think the Pats won't let him try because they want to keep him at OT. And if the goal is to have your best 5 offensive linemen on the field, you'd have to think the Pats are going to have to give Cannon a shot there.

Secondly you overstate the loss of Thomas. Do you really think he was that much of better player than McDonald, whose starts have always been as successful as Thomas' were. Between Mankins, Connolly, McDonald and Cannon, the Pats more than have the Guard position covered. Plus for the first time in 2 years Mankins had an off season where he wasn't rehabbing.

The Bottom Line, is that the loss of a back up OG is MORE than off set by the projected improvement of your young LT, the improved health of your all pro LG, the projected improvement of your 2nd year C, the improved health of your all pro RT, and either the improved health of your RG if Connolly ends up the starter, or improved physical play if Cannon is the starter. Plus between the addition of Svitek, McDonald, Zuvi, and Connolly/Cannon, plus the position flexibility of virtually all of our OLmen, gives us the kind of depth most teams can only dream about

Some of those improvements are marginal, some are more significant, but in the end the OL, as it stands right now, can only be viewed as a unit that should be better this season.

 

[BelichickFan]

This team has been rebuilt in front of our eyes, the previous d backfield weaknesses have improved and the receiving corps has been retooled. The infusion of a lot of young talent has also made us faster...

We have gone from the one of the oldest on D and O, to one of the youngest on both..

IMO the addition of Adrian Wilson, bringing back Talib and another year of playing together in the D backfield is extremely beneficial.. at one point last year we had a d backfield that had combined NFL experience of less than 5 years total.


This team is good for 12 or 13 wins..

Mike Loyko‏@NEPD_Loyko5 May
The Average Age of the 28 top players on the #Patriots defense is 25.2 years old .. crazy how young the team is.

Mike Loyko‏@NEPD_Loyko5 May
Take Adrian Wilson off the defense and the average age is 24.9 years old .. that has to be the youngest in the league.

verage age of the #Patriots offense (besides Brady) is 25.6 years old .. crazy young team

Mike Loyko‏@NEPD_Loyko5 May
Add in Brady's 35 years and the age of the Offense is still just 26 years old.

Slightly off topic, but if the new WR group works out with the youth on this team we should be good for a continued, lengthy run here if we can get the key players re-signed. This was the perfect time to being a guy like Wilson in with a non Wilson average age on defense under 25 years old. Hopefully Hightower, Jones and Collins were the correct final pieces to make this a competent or better defense going forward. Because we have one of the youngest teams out there. One the the youngest and one of the best :rocker:

As to the question, everyone we wanted is back except Welker, Lloyd and Woodhead (and they didn't want Lloyd back but he was a solid contributor).

I expect the Patriots to be a lot better unless the WR group blows. And we have enough talent that it should work out. Welker will be missed obviously. Lloyd might be missed a little. We had no other WR. I love Deion but . . . well I love Deion but I'm glad we've moved on. Other than that we should be better. The defense should be dramatically better - instead of starting over with a lot of new guys again, then having to rebuild the secondary over the bye week the defense will be able to pick up where it left off. Jones and Hightower should make the second year jump and we've added more with Wilson to help stabilize the secondary, the athleticism of Collins and Armstead (good athlete for a DT) and depth at CB with Ryan and hopefully Ras-I back although I won't count on that.

Short summary - if the WR group is good enough the offense should be as good as last year (assuming healthy Gronk) and the defense should be dramatically better.

 

[patfanken]

The more major pluses and minuses are at receiver. We HOPE for a major plus at TE with better health. This cannot be counted on, given that all 3 are recovering from injuries. As far as wide receiver. We had a huge amount of production for our wide receivers, Absent very dark rose colored glasses, AS OF NOW, the best estimate has to be that their production will be down from last year. Will Amendola really produce more than Welker? Will Dobson/Boyce really produce more than Lloyd/Branch? They may. Or, their production may be made up by the TE's.
.

Given the loss of actual production from Welker and Lloyd, it's easy to see how the WR position is being viewed as a large negative, especially when viewed through the prism of last year's offense. HOWEVER, it is my strong belief that THIS year's offense will be different. Last year, injuries forced the Pats to once again focus their offense around Welker, and it showed in his production. When healthy, I believe the Pats would MUCH rather spread the ball around more evenly, so that even if Welker were around his individual stats would have suffered.

Secondly, I would like to point out that no one here is questioning Amendola's abilities. Physically, he's a younger,. quicker (at this stage of his career), slightly bigger and faster version of Wes, with a larger catch radius. What we ALL question about DA is his ability to stay on the field. It's a legitimate issue, but one that cannot be answered until we actually get through this season, as he's had 2 years of relative good health, and 2 years where he's missed 20 games

Understand that its very important to the Pats getting deep into the playoffs that their offense become more diverse and less predictable. Otherwise they will always be in a position where a good playoff defense can take them out of their game if things don't go smoothly.

Outside of Gronk, and to a lesser degree, Hernandez, the Pats had NO WR's who could win a physical one on one match up with a DB, fighting for the ball last year. One of great myths of last year's AFCCG loss was the Ravens shut down the Pats offense. Allowing 420 yds of offense is NOT shutting a team down. The Pats were in the red zone 5 times without the aid of a TO, and only got in the endzone ONCE. THAT was the failure. Without Gronk, the Ravens could double both Welker and Hernandez. And Lloyd couldn't win the physical one on one battle.

Just look at the additions. Dobson, Boyce, Jenkins, and Jones are ALL bigger, stronger and more physical WR's Dobson and Jenkins in particular are both capable of winning those Boldin-like one on one fights for the ball, especially in the red zone. Jones and Boyce, while not tall, aren't short, and are much stronger than the guys they replaced.

Christ, the Ravens won a superbowl throwing to receiver who was almost always well covered. A guy who simply won the physical battle. The Pats FINALLY have recognized this missing skill set and this season, to a great degree, have set about to solve this discrepancy.

In the end, it will probably take more than half a season for the Pats to fully integrate all the new receivers, especially since 2 are rookies, but in the end they will be better for any slip ups over the course of the season. I'd rather sacrifice a couple of losses during the regular season to add 2 more wins in the post season.

 

[BadMoFo]

Does this poll even make sense.

Will Pats be better or worst than last year? Yes. They will be better or worst than last year.

Will Pats be better or worst than last year? No. They will not be better or worst than last year.

Will Pats be better or worst than last year? Maybe. They will be better or worst than last year.

Shouldn't the poll responses be better, worse (not worst), or not sure at this point?

 

[mgteich]

We both believe that we have a very strong OL, one of the best in the league. So we are both are nitpicking a bit. But that's fine.

With regard to RG, Connolly has shown that he is a better choice than Cannon. As was the case in last year's camp, Cannon will be given every opportunity to change Dante's mind.

I don't think that McDonald has shown himself to be as good as Thomas was. We'll see.

In the end, you have 2 projections at OG. You expect McDonald and Cannon to step up. Moreover, you presume the move of Cannon to OG (thus the 4 other OT's).

I would like to see a vet OG to compete with Cannon and others for the backup RG spot, perhaps even the starting spot, since everyone seems to want to replace Connolly.

2 points on the OL - what makes you SO sure that Cannon couldn't perform at RG. Is it because you don't think he has the talent, because that's an assessment that needs an explanation, or just that you think the Pats won't let him try because they want to keep him at OT. And if the goal is to have your best 5 offensive linemen on the field, you'd have to think the Pats are going to have to give Cannon a shot there.

Secondly you overstate the loss of Thomas. Do you really think he was that much of better player than McDonald, whose starts have always been as successful as Thomas' were. Between Mankins, Connolly, McDonald and Cannon, the Pats more than have the Guard position covered. Plus for the first time in 2 years Mankins had an off season where he wasn't rehabbing.

The Bottom Line, is that the loss of a back up OG is MORE than off set by the projected improvement of your young LT, the improved health of your all pro LG, the projected improvement of your 2nd year C, the improved health of your all pro RT, and either the improved health of your RG if Connolly ends up the starter, or improved physical play if Cannon is the starter. Plus between the addition of Svitek, McDonald, Zuvi, and Connolly/Cannon, plus the position flexibility of virtually all of our OLmen, gives us the kind of depth most teams can only dream about

Some of those improvements are marginal, some are more significant, but in the end the OL, as it stands right now, can only be viewed as a unit that should be better this season.

 

[37Harrison]

I say it's 50/50 at tis point. Too many "ifs" at this time to tell. Last year there really weren't as many "ifs" on offense but just as much on D. How many years have we been saying "the defense should be improved this year"?

No Welker and Gronk a question mark at this point. HUGE difference from last year. I am skeptical at best about our rookie WR's based on past experiences. Will Amendola be able to step up in Wes' spot? Can Amendola, Gronk and Ahern stay healthy and be on the field at the same time? Will the pass rush be improved? Same question abour the secondary...

While I am optimitic about the POTENTIAL of this years team, I will remain reserved until I see improvement on the field.

 

[mgteich]

I agree that spreading it out is Josh's plan, as it was last year. We needed WR additions. We needed to replace Branch with 1-2 physical receivers who could stretch the field and be red zone threats. So, Belichick certainly recognized the need and moved to address it. By blowing up the entire WR corps, he makes clear that there is no going back (as we did last year).

1) I would have preferred that the team spread it around with Welker (and even Lloyd) on the team. We still could have had 2 physical additions.

2) Our fall-back when there were injuries last year was to count much more on Welker.

3) Our fall-back this year is hope that the four question marks step up to the challenge.

4) For all the negatives, I would feel much better with Lloyd in camp, competing with Jones and Jenkins for the #4 spot (and higher if one of the rookies isn't ready).

5) For the first time in years, we go into the camps and preseason needing the reps as much as any other team. That is not a step forward.

Given the loss of actual production from Welker and Lloyd, it's easy to see how the WR position is being viewed as a large negative, especially when viewed through the prism of last year's offense. HOWEVER, it is my strong belief that THIS year's offense will be different. Last year, injuries forced the Pats to once again focus their offense around Welker, and it showed in his production. When healthy, I believe the Pats would MUCH rather spread the ball around more evenly, so that even if Welker were around his individual stats would have suffered.

Secondly, I would like to point out that no one here is questioning Amendola's abilities. Physically, he's a younger,. quicker (at this stage of his career), slightly bigger and faster version of Wes, with a larger catch radius. What we ALL question about DA is his ability to stay on the field. It's a legitimate issue, but one that cannot be answered until we actually get through this season, as he's had 2 years of relative good health, and 2 years where he's missed 20 games

Understand that its very important to the Pats getting deep into the playoffs that their offense become more diverse and less predictable. Otherwise they will always be in a position where a good playoff defense can take them out of their game if things don't go smoothly.

Outside of Gronk, and to a lesser degree, Hernandez, the Pats had NO WR's who could win a physical one on one match up with a DB, fighting for the ball last year. One of great myths of last year's AFCCG loss was the Ravens shut down the Pats offense. Allowing 420 yds of offense is NOT shutting a team down. The Pats were in the red zone 5 times without the aid of a TO, and only got in the endzone ONCE. THAT was the failure. Without Gronk, the Ravens could double both Welker and Hernandez. And Lloyd couldn't win the physical one on one battle.

Just look at the additions. Dobson, Boyce, Jenkins, and Jones are ALL bigger, stronger and more physical WR's Dobson and Jenkins in particular are both capable of winning those Boldin-like one on one fights for the ball, especially in the red zone. Jones and Boyce, while not tall, aren't short, and are much stronger than the guys they replaced.

Christ, the Ravens won a superbowl throwing to receiver who was almost always well covered. A guy who simply won the physical battle. The Pats FINALLY have recognized this missing skill set and this season, to a great degree, have set about to solve this discrepancy.

In the end, it will probably take more than half a season for the Pats to fully integrate all the new receivers, especially since 2 are rookies, but in the end they will be better for any slip ups over the course of the season. I'd rather sacrifice a couple of losses during the regular season to add 2 more wins in the post season.

 

[Pewsterbaby]

Tha Pats will be more better than last year.

Why? I dunno. I jus' like sayin' more better since ridiculous redundancy is one of my literary trademarks.

 

[PATSYLICIOUS]

Does this poll even make sense.

Will Pats be better or worst than last year? Yes. They will be better or worst than last year.

Will Pats be better or worst than last year? No. They will not be better or worst than last year.

Will Pats be better or worst than last year? Maybe. They will be better or worst than last year.

Shouldn't the poll responses be better, worse (not worst), or not sure at this point?

I guess the question is whether the Patriots will exist in 2013. I vote 'yes'

 

[NewFeep]

I think the D will be better than last year. The O will be a little less productive. What that translates to next year in terms of wins and losses, post-season success, I do not know. That is why I watch the games......