Will Ellis Hobbs Overtake Asante Samuel as the Number One Corner?

[bradmahn]

You don't have to wait and "see." I'll tell you what my response is - it is patently ABSURD that ANYONE would assert that Ellis Hobbs performed better at CB last year than Asante Samuel. You are delusional.

Asante had a solid year, an all-pro year, and Ellis Hobbs gave up receptions CONSTANTLY. The eye-test alone - and it's not the only barometer - tells us this.

All you (and anyone else who dogs Hobbs) has as an argument is the eyeball test. Try refuting the statistics with something a little more concrete than your eyes off of a network feed. I thinks it's pretty telling that the coaching staff decided to play Hobbs against Burress for the majority of the game. Granted, I could be wrong and they simply wanted Asante to defend against future Hall of Famer Amani Toomer.

If the eyeball test is what you want to go by, my eyes told me Hobbs outplayed Samuel down the stretch and Asante and the rest of the secondary appeared pretty mediocre without Hobbs against the Jaguars.

 

[patsox23]

All you (and anyone else who dogs Hobbs) has as an argument is the eyeball test. Try refuting the statistics with something a little more concrete than your eyes off of a network feed. I thinks it's pretty telling that the coaching staff decided to play Hobbs against Burress for the majority of the game. Granted, I could be wrong and they simply wanted Asante to defend against future Hall of Famer Amani Toomer.

If the eyeball test is what you want to go by, my eyes told me Hobbs outplayed Samuel down the stretch and Asante and the rest of the secondary appeared pretty mediocre without Hobbs against the Jaguars.

Hobbs gave up an absolute TON of completions last year. Did you not watch? Did you not see the constant first downs given up by this guy? And AS I MADE EXTREMELY CLEAR in my last post, that is not at all the only barometer to base that judgment on. Try not being disingenuous.

 

[patsox23]

All you (and anyone else who dogs Hobbs) has as an argument is the eyeball test. Try refuting the statistics with something a little more concrete than your eyes off of a network feed.

WHAT statistics??????????????????????????????????????????????????????????

 

[Ownagedood]

WOW. This thread was started a whole two years ago.. And someone brought it back to life..lol

 

[patsox23]

Yes. It's been brought back to life by fans who want to now throw Asante Samuel (no longer a Patriot) under the bus in favor of his deeply inferior teammate (still a Patriot!). Surprise, surprise.

 

[Deus Irae]

BradyManny2344, I apologize, but I can't verify which writer published the numbers. They were in an article/blog entry. The memory says "Reiss", but I don't want to claim that's 100% certain. I can't remember exactly how many weeks of the season this was after, but it wasn't over the course of the entire year + playoffs. Here are the numbers that were given:

1.) Opposing teams threw at Hobbs 106 times, 13th most in the NFL

2.) Samuel was thrown at 94 times

3.) Receivers Hobbs covered scored 4 touchdowns, 45th most in the NFL

4.) Asante surrendered 6 touchdowns to receivers he was covering

5.) Dré Bly and Jason David surrendered the league high of 10

6.) Hobbs allowed a 54.7% completion rate, better than 157 defenders in the NFL (30 att. min)

7.) Asante allowed a 53.2% completion rate

This was posted in the Hobbs=Jesus? thread, as well as in an earlier thread, I believe. Essentially, Hobbs was surrendering 1+ more completion per 100 passes than Samuel, but was surrendering 2+ fewer touchdown passes in that same 100 pass span.

 

[signbabybrady]

You don't have to wait and "see." I'll tell you what my response is - it is patently ABSURD that ANYONE would assert that Ellis Hobbs performed better at CB last year than Asante Samuel. You are delusional.

Asante had a solid year, an all-pro year, and Ellis Hobbs gave up receptions CONSTANTLY. The eye-test alone - and it's not the only barometer - tells us this.

Eye-test....My eye test tells me Hobbs is pretty good you might wanna get your eyes checked.

I am not trying to say Hobbs is better than Asante. The stats show that he right there with him.

 

[patsox23]

Hey, if you guys want to be on the side of "Ellis Hobbs is better than Asante Samuel," go for it. I'll take that argument. I disagree. Asante Samuel is the better player, IMO.

 

[HSanders]

This could just be my memory only but I have seen Hobbs make more plays (knockdowns) when he is tight on a WR than I do Samuel...he is great at jumping routes, etc. but covering tight isn't his forte. I am not saying he sux b/c he isn't a Patriot anymore, just that I don't think he is as great as his rep. He is good, not great. I think Hobbs has the POTENTIAL to be a better all around CB than Samuel is.

 

[signbabybrady]

Hey, if you guys want to be on the side of "Ellis Hobbs is better than Asante Samuel," go for it. I'll take that argument. I disagree. Asante Samuel is the better player, IMO.

You see the point in comparing him to Asante was not to say he was better but just to show that he compares to him pretty well statisticly (INTs aside). By showing he is close to as good as Asante we show that he is a good corner. But if you want to keep twisting the argument go for it.

 

[BradyManny]

You don't have to wait and "see." I'll tell you what my response is - it is patently ABSURD that ANYONE would assert that Ellis Hobbs performed better at CB last year than Asante Samuel. You are delusional.

Asante had a solid year, an all-pro year, and Ellis Hobbs gave up receptions CONSTANTLY. The eye-test alone - and it's not the only barometer - tells us this.

Mid-season, I would have agreed with you by the eye-test, but stats don't back up the eye-test, and by the end of the season, even Asante was failing at the eye-test at times.

I'm going to take metrics over my own eyes watching something unfold at game speed. And the stats tell us Hobbs was effective as Asante, often defending tougher receivers.

 

[dhamz]

Mid-season, I would have agreed with you by the eye-test, but stats don't back up the eye-test, and by the end of the season, even Asante was failing at the eye-test at times.

I'm going to take metrics over my own eyes watching something unfold at game speed. And the stats tell us Hobbs was effective as Asante, often defending tougher receivers.

I keep read the "Hobbs usually plays the tougher WR" line and don't understand where it comes from. Didn't Asante always play the left corner? Teams generally line up their #1 WR on their right side (the defenses left) because that is a right handed QBs easiest read. That doesn't mean they don't move their WR around but if you are looking to see where the Randy Mosses, TOs of the world are more often than not it is on the right.

 

[BradyManny]

I keep read the "Hobbs usually plays the tougher WR" line and don't understand where it comes from. Didn't Asante always play the left corner? Teams generally line up their #1 WR on their right side (the defenses left) because that is a right handed QBs easiest read. That doesn't mean they don't move their WR around but if you are looking to see where the Randy Mosses, TOs of the world are more often than not it is on the right.

The whole season teams were moving their #1 to avoid Asante based on his rep and the fact that he doesn't like to switch sides (and therefore stick with one receiver), so teams know they can avoid him simply by lining up their #1 wideout across Hobbs. Just watch either of the Giants games, Hobbs drew Plaxico more often.

 

[patsox23]

You see the point in comparing him to Asante was not to say he was better but just to show that he compares to him pretty well statisticly (INTs aside). By showing he is close to as good as Asante we show that he is a good corner. But if you want to keep twisting the argument go for it.

NOW you're saying this? Fine. It's a specious argument, either way. If, as you say, he compares favorably to Asante statistically, then that is an example of statistics lying.

I dare you, any of you, to find any ACTUAL PERSON (as opposed to a homeristic Patriots fan poster) - a pundit, an NFL expert, an insider, anyone ANYWHERE - who actually thinks Ellis Hobbs is anywhere near Asante Samuel's league as a corner. If anything, it shows how well Belichick's scheme can work with a weak link, and it explains why Belichick undervalues CBs in general.

Your contention - whether he's better than Samuel or comparable - either way is laughable. It is an embarrassment of homerism and gomerism. Try calling in to, say, ESPN radio or WEEI or PFW in Progress. If you're too scared, fire off an e-mail. It's [email protected].

 

[BradyManny]

NOW you're saying this? Fine. It's a specious argument, either way. If, as you say, he compares favorably to Asante statistically, then that is an example of statistics lying.

I dare you, any of you, to find any ACTUAL PERSON (as opposed to a homeristic Patriots fan poster) - a pundit, an NFL expert, an insider, anyone ANYWHERE - who actually thinks Ellis Hobbs is anywhere near Asante Samuel's league as a corner. If anything, it shows how well Belichick's scheme can work with a weak link, and it explains why Belichick undervalues CBs in general.

Your contention - whether he's better than Samuel or comparable - either way is laughable. It is an embarrassment of homerism and gomerism. Try calling in to, say, ESPN radio or WEEI or PFW in Progress. If you're too scared, fire off an e-mail. It's [email protected].

Why did Belichick put Hobbs on Plaxico on the all-out blitz in the SB then? If the answer is the usual "because Asante is more comfortable on the left", then well that diminishes Asante's value as it is. The reality is, BB knew he was going to leave one corner on an island with one of the best receivers in the league, for one play, he could've told Asante to suck it up and just follow Plax to whichever side he was on. He didn't, he put Hobbs on Burress. That tells you something.

And again, what do you say of the metrics that say they have similar numbers?

 

[signbabybrady]

NOW you're saying this? Fine. It's a specious argument, either way. If, as you say, he compares favorably to Asante statistically, then that is an example of statistics lying.

I dare you, any of you, to find any ACTUAL PERSON (as opposed to a homeristic Patriots fan poster) - a pundit, an NFL expert, an insider, anyone ANYWHERE - who actually thinks Ellis Hobbs is anywhere near Asante Samuel's league as a corner. If anything, it shows how well Belichick's scheme can work with a weak link, and it explains why Belichick undervalues CBs in general.

Your contention - whether he's better than Samuel or comparable - either way is laughable. It is an embarrassment of homerism and gomerism. Try calling in to, say, ESPN radio or WEEI or PFW in Progress. If you're too scared, fire off an e-mail. It's [email protected].

I sent over the question via email as I don't have the time to wait on the phone. I asked wether they could shed light on the argument. Wether Hobbs skill was closer to Asante or closer to someone who should not be a starter in this league. I will post any response.

Ohh and take my word for it their are plenty of NFL fans out there who think Hobbs is good. My cousins boyfriend is a Cowboys fan and thinks pretty highly of Hobbs.

Why exactly is Hobbs enemy number 1 to you. Its not like our secondary was a sieve like when we had Starks. We actually were a top ten secondary and Hobbs was a big part of it.

 

[signbabybrady]

Why did Belichick put Hobbs on Plaxico on the all-out blitz in the SB then? If the answer is the usual "because Asante is more comfortable on the left", then well that diminishes Asante's value as it is. The reality is, BB knew he was going to leave one corner on an island with one of the best receivers in the league, for one play, he could've told Asante to suck it up and just follow Plax to whichever side he was on. He didn't, he put Hobbs on Burress. That tells you something.

And again, what do you say of the metrics that say they have similar numbers?

He says statistics can be twisted...his eyes tell him he is not good.

Which to me sounds like I saw him get beat once or twice and I have decided he sux because of it and I don't care if the stats actually show that he is good ot that he is still a young corner who is improving and probably improved alot after said bad plays.

 

[Deus Irae]

NOW you're saying this? Fine. It's a specious argument, either way. If, as you say, he compares favorably to Asante statistically, then that is an example of statistics lying.

I dare you, any of you, to find any ACTUAL PERSON (as opposed to a homeristic Patriots fan poster) - a pundit, an NFL expert, an insider, anyone ANYWHERE - who actually thinks Ellis Hobbs is anywhere near Asante Samuel's league as a corner. If anything, it shows how well Belichick's scheme can work with a weak link, and it explains why Belichick undervalues CBs in general.

Your contention - whether he's better than Samuel or comparable - either way is laughable. It is an embarrassment of homerism and gomerism. Try calling in to, say, ESPN radio or WEEI or PFW in Progress. If you're too scared, fire off an e-mail. It's [email protected].

It's quotes like this that make me so interested in how the Patriots graded out their defensive backs and in how the final numbers (playoffs included) broke down.

 

[mmasterkillah]

Asante had an absolutely phenomenal year last year. I can count on my hand the number of times he was burnt for a reception. I will miss seeing him go, but I think we made the right move based on value.