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Will Brady Ever Have A WR Like Moss Or TO?

Discussion in 'PatsFans.com - Patriots Fan Forum' started by Haterproof, Sep 8, 2006.

  1. Haterproof

    Haterproof Rookie

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    I'm curious to know some of the things Brady could do with a WR like Moss or TO (without the baggage).He'd probably go down as the greatest QB of all time.Hopefully Brady can get a big time WR 1 of these days.I'm keeping my fingers crossed.
  2. patchick

    patchick Moderatrix Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #11 Jersey

    Time will tell, but I'm pretty sure that's supposed to be Chad Jackson's job.
  3. zippo59

    zippo59 Rookie

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    I'm not sure if there is such a thing.
  4. emoney_33

    emoney_33 Rookie

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    No and it won't ever matter. Guys like TO and Moss can make these amazing catches, but most of those amazing catches are from bad throws or a ball thrown to them while they are covered. Brady doesn't make a ton of bad throws and he rarely throws into coverage. Get open and you get the ball. All we need is receivers who can run proper routes and catch the ball.

    Sure it would be great to have a guy with Moss's skill but there aren't many guys with close to that amount of skill as well as having a patriot-type personality.

    I'm not trying to say we can have all scrubs as receivers, but we won't ever need that TO type talent IMO. It would be great to have, with the right personality, but I just don't see us ever getting that lucky to find such a player (unless CJ turns into him ;) )
  5. Digger44

    Digger44 Rookie

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    The bigger question is does brady need a WR like that. Nope he has won three SB without one. He doesnt even need that WR to be the greatest qb of all time. he has already had a great start.
  6. cloud34

    cloud34 Rookie

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    meaning..a selfish receiver?...seems like he has one now on the outside looking in.....don't need guys like that
  7. desi-patsfan

    desi-patsfan Rookie

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    He might not ever get a TO or Moss. But he will have the hybrid of Coates and Gonzales.
  8. rookBoston

    rookBoston Rookie

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    #12 Jersey

    Yeah, Chad. Haven't you been paying attention?
  9. Johnny Z

    Johnny Z Rookie

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    Moss and TO get more; everybody else gets less.

    And then they lose in the playoffs.

    The #-1 WR fantasy is for losers 'cause all it does is lose big games to teams that spread the ball around.
  10. PatsFanInVa

    PatsFanInVa PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    That last post looks pretty perceptive.

    Okay this is very broad brush but:

    - lots of circus catches means lots of borderline catchable balls. That would be a large percentage for a less accurate guy with a ****ty scheme, and a small percentage for a more accurate guy working in a scheme that gets a guy more open in more plays.

    - Lots of catches of all kinds means a pass first offense, think Martz as the extreme. The ground game is strategically superior as augmented by the passing attack, because you can use ground yardage (but not pass yardage) to control the clock and get your D some rest. ("The best defense is a running offense.") So, a guy that figures "I'll get us out of the hole we dig every week" (splashy offense thinking,) has less control than the "never dig a hole that size in the first place" guy. Less dramatic, but more effective, if 3 SBs really demonstrate anything. Notice when our running game went down the tubes our D did too? It's not all injuries. It's being on the field 35 minutes a game.

    - Within BB's cost structure, recognizing the team he's trying to build, where do you put this TO/Randy Moss kind of guy? Everybody's paid pretty much as a journeyman except those "best in the game" types like Brady and Seymour. If we get a "best in the game" at another position, I doubt we'd go for it at receiver, for reasons sketched out above. Think of the drain of a guy with 8 or 10M or 14M every year cap hit (for instance,) taking roughly 8-14% of your cap. You only get a couple or three of those guys... and I don't know when guy number 3 will be identified if ever for the Pats. After that, you end up with nada to spend on the rest of the team. (Colvin's scheduled to start knocking on the door of that level... I wonder how long we have with his services on board.)

    You never say never, and maybe one of those TO/Moss guys shows up next week -- but I dont see BB/SP putting the value on that type of player, that other teams do. Therefore, they'd never really have much chance to talk to them. From all indications, the Pats think superstar wideouts are way overvalued for what you actually get, and it might not just be the stupid antics off the field/celebrations/head case stuff that's keeping us away from them (although that stuff wouldn't help in a BB world - just can't imagine a guy w/that little self control being a "patriots type player.")

    PFnV
  11. Patriots4Ever

    Patriots4Ever Rookie

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    ewww...You used Coates and Gonzales in the same sentence.Don't taint Bens good name like that...
  12. PatsWorldChamps

    PatsWorldChamps Rookie

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    hopefully not...WR like that ruin teams... how many rings do TO and moss have together? end of story.
    Last edited: Sep 9, 2006
  13. sieglo

    sieglo Rookie

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    Brady will never have one for the simple reason that one will never emerge playing for the Pats. Bray is too good at spreading the ball around.
  14. MrClutch

    MrClutch Rookie

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    Brady doesn't really need a TO or Johnson, but i'm not saying that it wouldn't help. If a reciever can get open, Brady will deliever. That's what he's become known for around the league. That's why we literally see these recievers come out of nowhere because Brady can spread the ball around and if a reciever is open, the ball will be there as well.
  15. flutie2phelan

    flutie2phelan Rookie

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    I'll bet Brady would rather have
    Light - Mankins - Koppen - Neal - Kaczur - Hochstein - O'Callaghan
    in front of him
    than Moss, Owens, AND Rice ... out wide.
  16. Box_O_Rocks

    Box_O_Rocks PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Who knows? BB and SP have been team building, so where are we now?

    QB - Tommy is under 30 with a pretty good looking back-up.
    RB - Maroney might have a few good years ahead of him, everybody else is hovering around the dreaded 30 mark, another draft pick or two here won't go amiss.
    OL - The team doesn't seem to have any pressing need to draft here.
    TE - If Graham goes unsigned, I can see BB drafting for a TE.
    DL - The team doesn't seem to have any pressing need to draft here.
    LB - Folks keep begging him to draft LBs and he keeps drafting elsewhere, I suspect he will continue to use late round picks and shop other team's reserves and free agents to keep the experience level high here.
    CB - There are three good young corners with another on the Practice Squad, of course, BB won't pass up a bargain if one comes along.
    S - This is still a young position, look for BB to continue to bring in older CBs to extend their playing time and compliment Wilson and Sanders.

    Projected 2007 Draft Needs: WR/TE/LB/CB/RB. I can see BB taking another first day WR in 07, perhaps not a Moss/Rice type, but another second tier number one type.
  17. rookBoston

    rookBoston Rookie

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    #12 Jersey

    Assuming they resign Koppen. If he leaves in FA, then I could see BB spending a pick at C, just like he did in taking Mankins after Andruzzi signed with the Browns.
    I think you're confusing his willingness to draft LB with his commitment to drafting BPA in the draft. I think he's perfectly comfortable with the idea of taking a LB early if there is a LB candidate worth taking early. There were reports (from Michael Holley and others) that BB was willing to spend his pick on Jonathan Vilma in 2004. But the draft unfolded differently.

    I'm convinced that if the draft had been different this year, say the Cowboys had taken Moroney, that BB would have tapped Carpenter. The fact that he passed on Manny Lawson, to me, is simply an indication that even with all his athleticism, they didn't consider him first round value.

    My question now is whether someone like the Jets will give a first rounder for Branch... in which case, BB could flip that into a player like Paul Posluszny in 2007. I think Posluszny has the leadership, worth ethic, technique and field smarts that BB would want in his LB of the future.

    WR - depends on Branch situation. But I agree, this is an opportunity
    TE - maybe, if the talent is there
    LB - absolutely. But, again, BB will pick a player that he likes, not a position
    CB - there is roster space for a top flight starter. But the urgency is only moderate. Starting Hobbs and Gay would not be the end of the world.
    RB - possibly

    I think you are missing OC on your list.

    And I think you're missing SS on your list, too. If Tom Zibikowski is available, I think BB might see him as a blue chipper in the mold of a John Lynch or Rodney Harrison. A ten year starter and the heart and soul of the team. Sanders may look good, and Wilson is great player, but do either one fill the leadership void of losing Harrison? The secondary has plenty of young talent, but it still needs a captain to take the reigns from Rodney.

    My targets on Day One: ILB, SS, OC, WR, OLB
  18. 1976pats

    1976pats Rookie

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    :agree:

    BB and Pioli have, for lack of a better phrase, a salary slot for each and every position. With Brady and his ability to spread the ball around and make guys shine, that slot for receiver has to be fairly low. The long and the short of it is we'll get a TO/Moss type when we have a quarterback that will need one.
  19. Box_O_Rocks

    Box_O_Rocks PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    There is no urgency at OC with Hochstein and Mruczkowski available - would he take one if he thought the player was an upgrade, certainly.

    I'm leaning towards a different theory regarding first round LBs - their role on the team would most likely be Special Teams. Vilma may have been targeted, but it seems unlikely he would have cracked the starting line-up that season. Assuming they would have signed him to a six year deal, it would have been a decent investment, and BPA, but his 1st year role would have been very limited, probably his second too.

    I'm not so sure SS is a 1st day need. Hawkins has some years left in his tanks, Sanders is learning, Ventrone may figure in the mix again, and I can see Rodney lasting another year or two. The kind of leadership your targeting doesn't usually come from a rookie, even if they're a heavy weight boxer. If Rodney retired, I would expect SP to be scouring free agency and 31 rosters for a signing or trade first.

    OLB? Assuming TBC is re-signed, I don't see it on day one, except as BPA. Vrabel is here through 09, Colvin is someone you have to wonder if he will choose a bigger payday elsewhere, or take a discount for the team that stood by him when he was down - hard to tell. Woods looked like the real deal in preseason. Give him some coverage work and an off-season conditioning program and he'll be a gem.

    ILB? You really have to wonder if a rookie plays any role beyond special teams his first year. It just may be that the next ILB is already on the roster between Alexander, Mays, Woods, and TBC...Your Penn State kid may be just what the doctor ordered, but it is going to take some serious horsepower to get up in the top ten for him.

    If they go straight BPA, our need guess don't matter a hill of beans. If need does factor in at some point, then it makes sense that WR would garner a day one look before LB.
  20. patsfan13

    patsfan13 Hall of Fame Poster PatsFans.com Supporter

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    One of the reasons is great is his decision making. Not sure any receiver would run up huge stats due to Brady focus on throwing aginst the vunerability of the D rather than to a particular receiver.

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