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WikiLeaks cables: Saudi Arabia cannot pump enough oil to keep a lid on prices

Discussion in 'Political Discussion' started by The Brandon Five, Feb 9, 2011.

  1. The Brandon Five

    The Brandon Five Rookie

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    #75 Jersey

    Last edited: Feb 9, 2011
  2. Holy Diver

    Holy Diver Rookie

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    #80 Jersey

    BF,

    don't you know that Earth's core is made of crude oil and actually produces more oil that we as a race can consume?

    back to reality:

    How ANYONE can think there is some unlimited supply of a 'fossil fuel'? Unless we get some kind of a Manhattan Project rolling on an energy supply/source....we are screwed.
    Last edited: Feb 9, 2011
  3. Nikolai

    Nikolai Football Atheist PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #54 Jersey

    There's also a limited supply of uranium. Time to revisit Thorium, maybe? Hope for a supervirus to wipe out 1/3 of the earth?

    Seriously though, Bahrain has pretty much run out of oil, and other states won't be far behind. Unfortunately, this song and dance has been playing for a very long time, and a whole lot of inaction has followed.

    Yep, the energy crisis is a comin', but outside of nuclear power (with its uranium issues), there aren't a lot of viable options that can continue to provide us with the same energy yield we get today. Big problems or big adjustments; it's a matter of time. It will be interesting to see where this goes...
  4. Holy Diver

    Holy Diver Rookie

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    #80 Jersey

    Helium-3 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    just a thought.
  5. Nikolai

    Nikolai Football Atheist PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #54 Jersey

    Thanks for posting that. I was not aware of Helium-3. Like other proposed elements, it has upsides and drawbacks, but doesn't appear any less viable than Uranium and Thorium; at least after a cursory review on wikipedia (heh).

    I actually think part of the problem is that everyone is looking for a smoking gun to fix this problem and essentially replace fossil fuels wholesale as an energy source; cold fusion, this element, that element, etc. People are waiting until this miracle solution comes about before serious effort is devoted to alternative energy instead of scraping the bottom of the barrel for fossil fuels. Is it realistic to keep doing trial and error? I'm not convinced, but we need to find an acceptable network of alternatives, rather than one silver bullet.

    Unfortunately, I was a C chemistry student, so I'm not going to be much use in a practical discussion of where we go from here from a scientific and engineering standpoint, but strategically speaking, it seems we've got the ol' paralysis by analysis. It's up to the decision makers and people movers to help those who know what the hell they're doing get moving in a meaningful way; which brings us full-circle to your Manhattan Project statement.
    Last edited: Feb 9, 2011
  6. The Brandon Five

    The Brandon Five Rookie

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    #75 Jersey

    If we can figure out how to harness that we're all set!
  7. wistahpatsfan

    wistahpatsfan Rookie

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    #75 Jersey

    Fo sho.
    We haven't been asked by our "leaders" to do a damn thing about it. We don't conserve. The slightest whisper of raising CAFE standards is met with some "Nanny State" hysterics from Big Oil employees Michael Graham and Rush Limbaugh. We have no energy policy. We have no unified effort to accellerate the research process for energy alternatives. We will be the last developed nation on the planet still using fossil fuels at the end of this century, and China will be rigged with new sources and regulated consumption. We're going to find ourselves behind everyone else if we don't wake up.
  8. wistahpatsfan

    wistahpatsfan Rookie

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    #75 Jersey

    And why do you suppose the Saudis have inflated their capacity to this point? Could it be that they want everyone to believe they have more than they really do? Maybe they can leverage that perception into political protection, weapons and "mutual" defense arrangements. How else will the Royal Family retain control in this recent climate? Without the world thinking they can supply part of its energy supply, the KofSA is just a sand pit populated by nomads.

    [​IMG]
  9. Harry Boy

    Harry Boy Look Up, It's Amazing PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Why don't we drill for oil--------:confused:
  10. The Brandon Five

    The Brandon Five Rookie

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    #75 Jersey

    Renewable energy in the United States - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
  11. reflexblue

    reflexblue PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #91 Jersey

  12. The Brandon Five

    The Brandon Five Rookie

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    It's from yesterday's Guardian. Do articles have a 24 hour expiration now?:confused2:
    Last edited: Feb 9, 2011
  13. reflexblue

    reflexblue PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    There use to be someone here by the name of Press Coverage, he started many a thread about the Guare oil field and how it way past its peak. That by looking at the out put it was obvious that they couldn't keep up with demand. That was about two years ago.
  14. Stokes

    Stokes Rookie

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    Good old PC, this was one of the few things we could agree on!
  15. Harry Boy

    Harry Boy Look Up, It's Amazing PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Why don't we drill for oil-------------:confused:
  16. Titus Pullo

    Titus Pullo Banned

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    Because by all estimates, there's barely any light crude here to offset growing demand... and dry holes cost a lot of money?

    Shale oil, shale gas and tar sands are plentiful, ... at 5-10x the cost, and devastating to the environment (which also factors into cost). :eek:

    Of course, if we learned anything about the Cheney years, it's "to hell with the environment."

    No one is surprised that Saudi has inflated their reserve totals. The same is true for all the other OPEC nations desperate to maintain foreign investment. The problem is that they can no longer keep a lid on the reality, and western corporate interest do NOT want a new, progressive energy policy that might shut off the gravy train.
    Last edited: Feb 9, 2011
  17. Real World

    Real World Moderator Staff Member

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    Like any tangiable resource, oil is finite. That shouldn't come as a surprise to anybody. The real question is when a resource is reaching a level of decline. I don't think oil is at that point.

    I was just up in Canada and I was reading one of their daily's, and all the talk was how Canada's oil export industry is becoming the driving force of their economy. Oil is already around $80-100 a barrel, so the increased costs associated with harvesting more difficult reserves, is already being realized at the consumer level. The flow and availability remaining constant is really the key. All that being said, it's why a genuine and comprehensive long term energy strategy is needed. It was needed 30-40 years ago. Part of that strategy has to include searching for, and drilling more of our own. Since we don't yet have a viable replacement for oil, we will need more of it in order to bridge the time until a replacement is in place. Maybe that replacement is hydrogen, but who knows. Comprehensive policy people. One that utilizes our domestic supply in the short term, with investment and emphasis placed on a viable replacement long term. It's really not that complicated.
  18. Triple-T

    Triple-T Rookie

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    It's all part of the plan...

    1. Don't drill our oil
    2. Suck the rest of the world dry
    3. As the world collapses, we drill our oil, sell it off at a massive premium and convert completely to renewables
  19. Titus Pullo

    Titus Pullo Banned

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    Actually, it's INCREDIBLY complicated, considering decades of agreements and industries tied to existing energy contracts, in addition to endless droves of people who still insist the condition is one of "false scarcity."

    And when you allude to Canada's blossoming energy industry, keep in mind that the vast majority of it is attributed to their tar sands, which is enormously expensive to extract and refine.

    People can make mention of the market, the market, the market all they like, as if price points will spawn alternative investment and a smooth transition. But they fail to realize two important factors:

    1) It takes 20-30 years to transfer to something else.
    2) If the average consumer can not afford $125-, $250-barrel oil, no one's gonna be able to buy it anyway. Every oil shock in modern history has preceded a recession. If brief $147 oil in 2008 led to the greatest economic crash since 1929, what do we think sustained $150 oil will mean DURING a recession?
    Last edited: Feb 9, 2011
  20. Titus Pullo

    Titus Pullo Banned

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    Watch the documentary "Gasland" and then tell us how this puff piece you link to above has any traction. It's on HBO this month.

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