Why The Pats Believe In Josh McDaniels, And You Should Too

[jmt57]

You're tossing TEs in with the WRs, though. Right now, the Patriots "known" WR corps essentially consists of Amendola, Edelman and Jenkins, with only Amendola a 'lock'. Everyone complaining that people are down on the WRs should really take a look at that, factoring in both injury and talent.

Patriots current "known" WR corps:
Amendola
Edelman (?)
Jenkins (?)

That's got to be among the worst in the league.

There are other teams counting on rookies to be their 2nd best receiver as well. To not include rookies at all in the discussion is of course going to make the group look worse than it is as a whole.

I am not saying the Pats WR corps is good - right now it is not - but I am not ready to say it is the worst in the league either.

 

[Danger Zone]

Re: Re: Why The Pats Believe In Josh McDaniels, And You Should Too

It's only because it's your beloved Patriots, because your post is little more than "don't judge them, please!".

"your beloved Patriots" -such a telling 3 words...

 

[Brady6]

So, Green Bay's running backs are suspect and our wide receivers are not?????

I would point out that rookie running backs do not have anywhere the same issues being productive as rookies, compared to wide receivers. Green Bay has two good ones.

Never said ours WR's weren't suspect brother. I said we do have a lot of talent despite the fact outside of Amendola our WR's are unknowns.

 

[mgteich]

Are you sure that you don't know DW?

Never said ours WR's weren't suspect brother. I said we do have a lot of talent despite the fact outside of Amendola our WR's are unknowns.

 

[Brady6]

Are you sure that you don't know DW?

I really don't MG. Who is he?

 

[signbabybrady]

You're tossing TEs in with the WRs, though. Right now, the Patriots "known" WR corps essentially consists of Amendola, Edelman and Jenkins, with only Amendola a 'lock'. Everyone complaining that people are down on the WRs should really take a look at that, factoring in both injury and talent.

Patriots current "known" WR corps:
Amendola
Edelman (?)
Jenkins (?)

That's got to be among the worst in the league.

Lets put it this way last year our offense consisted of solid receiving targets in Gronk, Welker, Ahern, Woody, and to lesser extent Lloyd everything else was/is easily replaceable. This year we have Gronk, DA, Ballard, Vareen, and to a lesser extent two rookies. health aside there is likely a small drop off from Welker to DA and a larger drop off Ahern to Ballard but the combo of Vareen, Boyce and Dobson might not outproduce Woody and Lloyd but they should be far more explosive and more for a defense to handle.

So, you think that the league should be afraid of Amendola, Edelman, Gronk and Ballard? You think this among the best in the league? Even assuming that all these players are on the field at the same time (tough given their injuries), a competent defense would simply take away Gronk (as a receiver) and attack Brady. This group of four is not nearly one of the best in the league.

We have the best rookie prospects since Price and Tate. Seriously, the team has done all it can. They even hired an extra coach. However, this may take a year or so, if it works out at all.

For starters I think the the league should be afraid of any group that starts with Gronk period end of story. there is no simple way to take him away.

But I dont think you give DA enough credit, he has proven himself to be a very good receiver.

These two alone match up well vs the best 2 targets any team in the NFL fields. Or more to the point these two alone are more than enough for most defenses in the league to handle.

yes I have health concerns and you never know what rookies will truly do but when you realize the above statement you can then worry about health and I think we have good depth with Ballard backing up Gronk and with Edelman(asuming he gets on the field) and the rookies at WR.

 

[Bonzo]

To the point of "believing in McDaniels"... I think there's enough talent here for the Pats to at least be competitive on that side of the ball. But what I really believe in is the combination of Brady, McDaniels, and this O-line.

I would forecast an improved running game that was already 7th in the league in 2012. I still think we'll see plenty of (albeit "heavier") 2-TE sets. I also expect greater opportunities for the O to play with a shorter field, via the "hidden yardage" supplied by an improved return game with Washington & Edelman (hopefully), as well as a defense that looks poised to make a leap this season. (Although, not for nothing, the Pats did have the 10th-ranked scoring D last year.)

What I'm anticipating from the offense is the Gronk & Amendola show, lots of balance with the run game, and the use of a combination of the younger WRs to threaten vertically -- make a couple catches each week -- and keep the opposing D honest. That still looks to me like a team that can put up some points. (I'm reminded of the post-Moss 2010.) And if the D steps up, this can be a formidable team.

 

[Deus Irae]

Lets put it this way last year our offense consisted of solid receiving targets in Gronk, Welker, Ahern, Woody, and to lesser extent Lloyd everything else was/is easily replaceable. This year we have Gronk, DA, Ballard, Vareen, and to a lesser extent two rookies. health aside there is likely a small drop off from Welker to DA and a larger drop off Ahern to Ballard but the combo of Vareen, Boyce and Dobson might not outproduce Woody and Lloyd but they should be far more explosive and more for a defense to handle.

Vereen is more explosive than Woodhead. We've seen that. We've not seen that out of Boyce or Dobson.

Ballard isn't in AH's league. We've seen that, as well.

Regardless, the 'known' WR corps sucks, as of now.

 

[Salva135]

Huh?!? I wish I had Unorginal's incredible breakdown of that game disproving this entire post. McDaniels tried plenty of screens. The problem was the defense was able to bust through the line so easily that even quick screens didn't work.

And let's not act like Weis and most coordinators are predictable at times. Weis ALWAY threw a deep bomb after an INT and ran the FB draw on 3rd and short all the time (and it rarely worked).

The 2007 Pats built themselves on a strong O-line that allowed slow developing deep plays coupled with quick hits over the middle to Welker when the defense was playing way back. They were completely unprepared for a defense that trashed the O-line up the middle and forced Brady into quick decisions. He had no outlet, no screen game, nothing. It was embarrassing. And McDaniels never made significant adjustments at the half. Just more attempts at the same offense that clearly was not working.

 

[BSR]

So, you think that the league should be afraid of Amendola, Edelman, Gronk and Ballard? You think this among the best in the league? Even assuming that all these players are on the field at the same time (tough given their injuries), a competent defense would simply take away Gronk (as a receiver) and attack Brady. This group of four is not nearly one of the best in the league.

We have the best rookie prospects since Price and Tate. Seriously, the team has done all it can. They even hired an extra coach. However, this may take a year or so, if it works out at all.

Who cares if they aren't considered one of the best in the league. When was the last time the Patriot's WRs had that distinction? 2009? The only WR anyone was afraid of last year was Welker and that was about it. I certainly think the group this year has as much talent if not more than last years.

The point is they don't have to be the best. They just have to get on the same page with Brady. If they can do that then they will produce. Its not like Brady's yards are going to drop in half because of these guys.

 

[mgteich]

Does Detroit have the best offense in the league because they have Calvin Johnson? Can defenses beat the Detroit offense?

Let's be serious. The best TE in history is NOT enough to give us even an average receiving corps.

For starters I think the the league should be afraid of any group that starts with Gronk period end of story. there is no simple way to take him away.

 

[mgteich]

DW was a poster who addressed us as "cousin" on many posts, much as you address us as "brother".

I really don't MG. Who is he?

 

[Rob0729]

The 2007 Pats built themselves on a strong O-line that allowed slow developing deep plays coupled with quick hits over the middle to Welker when the defense was playing way back. They were completely unprepared for a defense that trashed the O-line up the middle and forced Brady into quick decisions. He had no outlet, no screen game, nothing. It was embarrassing.

They were completely unprepared for Stephen Neal to go down and not having an adequet replacement.

And they had no screen game because, even though they ran it quite a bit (it is a falicy that didn't run screens in that Super Bowl), the Giants took it away. It wasn't McDaniels' fault when the Pats ran screen passes, Brady was almost picked off by Michael Strahan because he was in the backfield untouched because no one blocked him or when they threw a screen to Welker in the slot he got blown up in the backfield because no one blocked in front of him.

Let's not act like Weis didn't have his struggles. In 2003, the Pats don't even sniff the Super Bowl without arguably the best defense in Patriots history. That offense had a horrible time converting third downs (I think it was the worst year in that category in Brady's career). And their offense did little vs. the Rams until the last drive in the first Super Bowl.

It is revisionist history because the Pats lost that Super Bowl. McDaniels didn't call his best game in that Super Bowl, but people have turned it into all on him. People still have this BS idea that he didn't call adjustments or screen passes, but Unorginal and his breakdown blew that out of the water as incorrect. The Giants just were able to counter everything the Pats threw at them.

BTW, Welker had 11 receptions (targeted 15 times) in that Super Bowl. Unless he has turned into a deep threat, the Pats threw a lot more quick passes (and connected on them) more than you are willing to admit.

 

[Deus Irae]

The 2007 Pats built themselves on a strong O-line that allowed slow developing deep plays coupled with quick hits over the middle to Welker when the defense was playing way back. They were completely unprepared for a defense that trashed the O-line up the middle and forced Brady into quick decisions. He had no outlet, no screen game, nothing. It was embarrassing. And McDaniels never made significant adjustments at the half. Just more attempts at the same offense that clearly was not working.

Brady injured and immobile
Neal lost early
Maroney/Faulk nicked up
TEs injured and useless


These things add up. Hobble Eli to the same extent Brady was hobbled, and the Patriots probably win that game by 3 TDs or more.

 

[Salva135]

Brady injured and immobile
Neal lost early
Maroney/Faulk nicked up
TEs injured and useless


These things add up. Hobble Eli to the same extent Brady was hobbled, and the Patriots probably win that game by 3 TDs or more.

McDaniels had foreknowledge of all of these injuries. Did he create a new gameplan based on those injuries? Did he create a different game plan knowing how the Giants played them in Week 17? Or rather, did he try the same plan that worked for 18 straight wins?

 

[Deus Irae]

McDaniels had foreknowledge of all of these injuries. Did he create a new gameplan based on those injuries? Did he create a different game plan knowing how the Giants played them in Week 17?

He had foreknowledge of Neal going down with an injury during the game, while the backup (Hochstein) was already injured? Who's his psychic?

 

[Salva135]

They were completely unprepared for Stephen Neal to go down and not having an adequet replacement.

And they had no screen game because, even though they ran it quite a bit (it is a falicy that didn't run screens in that Super Bowl), the Giants took it away. It wasn't McDaniels' fault when the Pats ran screen passes, Brady was almost picked off by Michael Strahan because he was in the backfield untouched because no one blocked him or when they threw a screen to Welker in the slot he got blown up in the backfield because no one blocked in front of him.

Let's not act like Weis didn't have his struggles. In 2003, the Pats don't even sniff the Super Bowl without arguably the best defense in Patriots history. That offense had a horrible time converting third downs (I think it was the worst year in that category in Brady's career). And their offense did little vs. the Rams until the last drive in the first Super Bowl.

It is revisionist history because the Pats lost that Super Bowl. McDaniels didn't call his best game in that Super Bowl, but people have turned it into all on him. People still have this BS idea that he didn't call adjustments or screen passes, but Unorginal and his breakdown blew that out of the water as incorrect. The Giants just were able to counter everything the Pats threw at them.

BTW, Welker had 11 receptions (targeted 15 times) in that Super Bowl. Unless he has turned into a deep threat, the Pats threw a lot more quick passes (and connected on them) more than you are willing to admit.

I have never put it all on him, but at least you admitted my point in the former phrase.

 

[Salva135]

He had foreknowledge of Neal going down with an injury during the game, while the backup (Hochstein) was already injured? Who's his psychic?

Are you suggesting that injury completely derailed the greatest offense in NFL history?

 

[Deus Irae]

Are you suggesting that injury completely derailed the greatest offense in NFL history?

I'm suggesting that the combination of banged up O-line, banged up TEs and banged up QB had a lot to do with that offense struggling. Are you seriously going to try pretending that's not likely to have been the case?

 

[Oswlek]

McDaniels had foreknowledge of all of these injuries. Did he create a new gameplan based on those injuries? Did he create a different game plan knowing how the Giants played them in Week 17? Or rather, did he try the same plan that worked for 18 straight wins?

How did McDaniels know that K. Brady, Neal and Faulk were all going to get hurt in the SB?

Take a look at those names. That is your best pass protecting interior OL, your best blocking/receiving back and your only blocking TE. It was as if God made a clean sweep of NE's max protect personnel.