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Why is "forceable rape" such a controversial term?

Discussion in 'Political Discussion' started by Wolfpack, Aug 22, 2012.

  1. Wolfpack

    Wolfpack Banned

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    Scenario 1) A woman is walking home alone late at night. An assailant, whom she does not know, attacks her and drags her kicking and screaming into some alleyway and the holds a knife to her throat and tells her that he will kill her if she screams out. She does everything she can to resist, but is simply overwhelmed by fear and the assailant's superior size and strength.

    Scenario 2) A college junior and sophomore - both over age 18 - are at a party and both have been drinking a bit. Both are tipsy but still coherent. I'm thinking .12 BAC. They each willingly sneak off into the girl's dorm room. There is no pressure or coercion on the part of either one of them. In fact, if anything, the girl is being the aggressive one.

    Now, believe it or not, the man in scenario 2 is guilty sexual assault and he is guilty of raping the woman. But is it really the same thing as scenario 1? Legally or morally, do we really want to consider those 2 scenarios the same?
    Last edited: Aug 22, 2012
  2. chicowalker

    chicowalker Rookie

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    By what law is scenario 2 sexual assault or rape?

    I haven't seen what the bill people were up in arms about stated. if it was simply using the term "forcible rape" to go along with "statutory rape," I don't understand what the issue was, either.
  3. Holy Diver

    Holy Diver Rookie

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    unreal.....
  4. Wolfpack

    Wolfpack Banned

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    Do you have anything intelligent or insightul to add to the discussion?
  5. Nikolai

    Nikolai Football Atheist PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #54 Jersey

    Yeah, I'm not getting it either. :confused2:

    Is this a strawman or is there some law saying that this is rape?
  6. Wolfpack

    Wolfpack Banned

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    Chico, I don't have a shelf full of law books right here next to me, able to loook up the specific laws and statues, so please stop with the "what law says that?!?" I can't find the specific statue that says it's illegal for someone to commit vehicular homicide, but I'm pretty sure that's in there somewhere.
    It's just much ado about nothing from the left, I guess.
    Last edited: Aug 22, 2012
  7. PatsWSB47

    PatsWSB47 Rookie

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    #12 Jersey

    :confused: How was the girl raped in the 2nd scenario?
  8. Kid~Brady

    Kid~Brady Rookie

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    #12 Jersey

    Apparently, I guess it depends to whom you are asking this question.

    Is scenario #1 considered a "legitimate" rape? As long as she doesn't get pregnant, then I guess its okay.

    Had to poke at that a little. :D

    But seriously, scenario #2 doesn't sound like rape. Its consensual, they are both of age... so whats the problem?
  9. Wolfpack

    Wolfpack Banned

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    I honestly thought this was common knowledge. I think you guys need to join the 21st century. Maybe it's because I'm younger than you and have heard a couple dozen of these lectures from my days on campus (that's just a theory; I honestly don't know if I'm younger than either of you gents, just theorizing).

    An intoxicated woman is not capable of consenting to sexual intercourse, therefore such intercourse is considered rape, no matter how she behaves otherwise. And she doesn't have to be pissing-her-pants, falling-down drunk. The legal limit for intoxication is only .08.

    What EVERY GUY Must Know About Date Rape - A Date Rape Fact Sheet for Guys

    Another area of confusion on the date rape topic is intoxication. Bottom line, if a girl is intoxicated she cannot consent to sex and you could be charged with rape. It does not matter whether you knew she was intoxicated, it doesn’t matter if you were intoxicated too, all that matters is that she was not in a state of mind to consent and therefore it is rape.
  10. Wolfpack

    Wolfpack Banned

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    Legally, she was. Kinda crazy, huh? But that definitely fits under the definition of date rape.

    So ya see how a term like "forceable rape" is worlds apart from a term like "date rape" and thus probably not the most offensive thing someone can say?
  11. Kid~Brady

    Kid~Brady Rookie

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    #12 Jersey

    So you just answered your initial question then. You knew this was controversial, especially since we don't all have the rule-book to rape.

    Maybe, I just never had to think about this happening personally. The bottom line is whether its "statutory rape" or "forceable rape".... its rape but I don't think this is common knowledge.
    Last edited: Aug 22, 2012
  12. DarrylS

    DarrylS PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Unf..ing believable.. some things just don't make sense in the real world.
  13. patsfan13

    patsfan13 Hall of Fame Poster PatsFans.com Supporter

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    The girl in scenario 2 changes her mind the next morning and claims rape/didn't give consent. I think that is the rest of the scenario.

    Legally both are rape.
  14. Wolfpack

    Wolfpack Banned

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    Well that's kinda the point I'm trying to make. I've heard about 1,000 times this past week "rape is rape ... rape is rape ... rape is rape." Paul Ryan said that phrase something like 5 times in one single interview because he's obviously terrified of the left wing outcry if he dares speak some common sense truth: Not all rapes are equal. Some are worse than others.

    I refuse to play like some sort of Orwellian character, repeating whatever the gpowers-that-be beat into him. Sorry, feminazis; Forcible rape is a whole world apart from date rape.
    Last edited: Aug 22, 2012
  15. Kid~Brady

    Kid~Brady Rookie

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    #12 Jersey

    Totally Agree. It sounds bad or selfless to say but its the truth. The girl did consent in the other scenario but forcible is much worst by nature.
  16. chicowalker

    chicowalker Rookie

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    When you make a claim about a law that would shock many of us, because it woulddn't make any sense, I don't think asking what you're talking about is unreasonable.


    Certainly a possibility.
  17. Holy Diver

    Holy Diver Rookie

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    date rape happens on a date, between people who know one another. Its still rape, because RAPE means one of the parties involved isn't a willing participant....kinda crazy, Huh?


    in your 2nd scenario, they are both willing, thus it isn't a rape....kinda crazy, Huh?



    If the girl claims she was raped after being a willing participant, then she is a liar, and she will have to prove the rape in a court.



    its shocking that this has to be explained to humans.


    sad more than shocking actually...


    .
    Last edited: Aug 22, 2012
  18. chicowalker

    chicowalker Rookie

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    Now, this simply isn't true.

    Date rape is often forcible, often violent. I have female friends who were victims of date rape, and it wasn't some nebulous "hey, we were both drunk and I thought everything was OK" -- it was date rape and it was forcible.
  19. DarrylS

    DarrylS PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    As you sit amongst your lawbooks, you may have a better discussion if you detail the applicable state laws relating to your scenario along with the case law and some legal examples...

    Everything else invites conjecture and makes you feel all smart, as you obviously know the answer and have a preconcieved outcome.. men are the victims again.
  20. Wolfpack

    Wolfpack Banned

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    Actually, the crazy part is that it is rape. Did you see that article I posted?

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