Why is BB taking so much heat aboukt TJ?

[NEPat]

What "team records"? Where is this info coming from? And who is "everyone concerned."

In the Globe article, it mentions that Johnson was happy that the team recorded the concussions he suffered first in the game and then in practice. For some reason, I thought that meant it was also recorded that he was not cleared for practice because of the first concussion, but that is a huge leap in logic I should not be making.

As far as "everyone concerned," it's troubling to me that no one has actually refuted Ted's story. Not Belichick, or Kraft, and the media isn't allowed to talk to the trainer involved. Can't they just say Johnson is mistaken, if his events are untrue? It leads me to believe that his story is more or less true.

And the Globe says:

Whalen was not allowed by the Patriots to comment for this story. Two players corroborated Johnson's version of what transpired. Former linebacker Roman Phifer said, "What they did to Ted was just wrong."

So as far as I know, no one connected to the Patriots has said Ted is wrong in his telling of the events.

1. Johnson is mentally screwed up and blames the concussions he suffered in the NFL, particularly his "back to back concussion in 2002"

Sure.

2. Johnson DID suffer back to back concussions

Yes.

3. Johnson suffered his second concussion during PRACTICE, NOT an actual game

Yes, not sure why it matters where he suffered the concussion.

4. Belichick and Johnson had a meeting AFTER Johnson left the team without permission and then returned

Yes.

5. Belichick commented that both he and Ted "apologised" to each other in the meeting. The nature of Belichick's comments suggests that he made a general apology to soothe Ted's feelings for the benefit of the team. NOWHERE in Belichick's comments does it state that he apologised to Ted for "overruling the trainer and giving him a blue jersey to wear in practice".

Right, that is Johnson's view. The nature of Belichick's comments said that he "apologized" for something, not necessarily that the purpose of the apology was to "soothe Ted's feelings for the benefit of the team."

6. Ted JOHNSON claims that Belichick said he "effed up"....the implication being that this alleged comment by Belichick was made in reference to Johnson wearing a blue jersey at practice. We do not know whether this particular phrase was indeed said by Belichick and EVEN IF IT WAS, whether it was said in reference to ANY SPECIFIC INCIDENT

.

Right, we only have Johnson's comments that Belichick apologized for the blue jersey.

7. Ted Johnson claims to have suffered more than thirty concussions....to have played with concussions and NOT HAVE REPORTED these concussions

Right.

Let me know if you have any other information besides what I've presented because from that information once CANNOT draw ANY conclusions, certainly not that the "Patriots/Belichick show a lack of value for human life" or "run their organization in a disturbing manner". Here are some relevant unanswered questions...

Where do I say either about the Patriots? At most, if Belichick overruled the trainer then it was a big mistake. I don't think Belichick treats players lives like disposable trash, it only means that he made a mistake.

1. What is the normal period of time IN THE NFL before a player who has suffered a concussion is allowed to PRACTICE with full contact? Everyone keeps condemning Belichick but I have yet to see this question answered.

I don't think that it matters. It's not the coaching staff that should rule on how long a player should practice after a head injury, it's the medical staff and the trainers.

2. Does the answer to number one depend on the severity of the concussion (i.e. how long the player is unconscious, if at all) and if it does...exactly what kind of concussion was Johnson diagnosed with the first time.

Again, if the trainer says no, then it should be no.

4. Who was responsible for clearing Johnson for full contact practice and was the information relayed to Belichick. The answer to this question would determine how much "heat" Belichick should get since it would be wrong for him to overrule medical staff.

That's the whole point thought, isn't it, that according to Johnson, it was Belichick who was responsible for clearing him for practice against the trainer's advice. Or, at least the implication is that Belichick sort of pushed the issue, and the trainers relented.

My opinion on this is that it is Johnson's OPINION that his back to back concussions in 2002 is to blame for his current condition.

Right, that is what I said in my second point.

However, the fact that he suffered multiple concussions over his career, and reported very few of them means that the 2002 incident cannot be reasonably held to be responsible for his condition.

Well I said that it is most likely a combination of drugs and all his concussions that is responsible for his current condition.

There is not enough evidence to say what exactly is responsible for his condition, but as I said, because Johnson says it's those two concussion, all the news angles will take that viewpoint unless someone says otherwise.

But to me, the most important issue in the story is not what the starting point was for Ted's deterioration. It's how the team looks after it's players after injury, and how much say the coaches have over the trainers.

It also shows that he was an active participant in disregarding his health. He was an adult..."brave" enough to leave the team because he was going to be held out of a game and to confront Belichick so he has no excuse for not reporting his concussions or refusing to play.

I made this point in one of my earlier posts, but the NFL culture, where you lose your job if you can't play through injury, where teammates and coaches look down on you for not playing hurt, all contributes to guys pushing themselves when they should not. There was a quote from a player in the Globe article, that said the player has to be his own advocate. But I imagine that can be difficult sometimes.

Lastly, considering how careful the Patriots are with injuries to their players, I find it difficult to believe that they would have treated Johnson's injury with any less care. Not saying it couldn't have happened, but the known history of the Patriots in regards to injuries should prompt any unbiased person to wait until the aforementioned questions are answered before passing judgment.

You're right, maybe I shouldn't rush to criticize, but because the Patriots haven't said much specifically about the issue and certainly haven't shot down the story, it's making it difficult for me not to.

I don't think the Patriots are careless, and I don't think Belichick is an unfeeling satan who deliberatly condemned Johnson to brain damage. But like Ted said, it's not just the Patriots and Belichick, this kind of thing happens all the time in the NFL. Trainers have to feel secure enough in their jobs so that they can stand up to a head coach if need be. Players need to be their own advocates. Things need to change.

I guess the bottom line is that I think there's enough there that I believe Ted's story (not the part about the concussions leading to all his problems, but about the blue jersey thing). It's concerning to me, and I really, really hope someone in the organization addresses this in more depth soon.

 

[kolbitr]

Re: Why is BB taking so much heat about TJ?

I agree with NEPat on the main issue, that this is an important story which should be addressed as thoroughly as possible by the Patriots, including Kraft and Belichick. But I have to stress as well that believing that McMullen's article was intended to be anything other than a partial BB-smear job is incredibly naïve. The paper has a Vendetta, and it is pursuing it through every possible angle--one could even argue that it is using Ted Johnson in a most calculated fashion. Thus, it is very difficult to know what were the circumstances surrounding the back-to-back concussions, to know who did what, under what duress, under what circumstances, etc.

Would anyone be surprised if we learned that Ted had more or less challenged Belichick's authority, perhaps repeatedly, in such a way that made it more possible for him to be challenged in return to be on the field? Was Ted demanding to play in the game, and BB wanted him to be willing to practice first? Such a scenario, although still worthy of regret on both sides, would make the TJ-incident a rare if still-sad chapter in the life of a football player and his demanding coach, one that would probably have been duplicated by most head coaches at every level of football, unfortunately.

I think that this is one salvo from the Broadsheet Bully (The Globe) that needs to be met head on by the Patriots, defused, and the true and complete story must be told. That a player was rushed back to the field too quickly is in itself hardly a story--it happens all the time. Belichick's approach to injuries since then has been far more circumspect--cf, Chad Jackson. Whereas Parcells, he of the famous "Terry Glenn is a She" remark, has nothing to answer for in this regard?

One more thing...it is also clear that Ted has a grudge against the Patriots, and perhaps specifically Belichick, which makes him an all-the-more- likely candidate for the Globe's vultures...

There is no doubt that Ted Johnson is suffering, that he is hurt and confused. But he is also being misused by the scrum of Max Mercies masquerading as sportsmen and skulking in the Globe's dark caves. A wonderful day it will be when another of their braying band is disgraced, à la Mike Barnicle. (And this is coming from a man who writes for his living.)

 

[PatsMyBoyz!]

Re: Why is BB taking so much heat about TJ?

I agree with NEPat on the main issue, that this is an important story which should be addressed as thoroughly as possible by the Patriots, including Kraft and Belichick. But I have to stress as well that believing that McMullen's article was intended to be anything other than a partial BB-smear job is incredibly naïve. The paper has a Vendetta, and it is pursuing it through every possible angle--one could even argue that it is using Ted Johnson in a most calculated fashion. Thus, it is very difficult to know what were the circumstances surrounding the back-to-back concussions, to know who did what, under what duress, under what circumstances, etc.

Would anyone be surprised if we learned that Ted had more or less challenged Belichick's authority, perhaps repeatedly, in such a way that made it more possible for him to be challenged in return to be on the field? Was Ted demanding to play in the game, and BB wanted him to be willing to practice first? Such a scenario, although still worthy of regret on both sides, would make the TJ-incident a rare if still-sad chapter in the life of a football player and his demanding coach, one that would probably have been duplicated by most head coaches at every level of football, unfortunately.

I think that this is one salvo from the Broadsheet Bully (The Globe) that needs to be met head one by the Patriots, defused, and the true story be told. That a player was rushed back to the field too quickly is in itself hardly a story--it happens all the time. Belichick's approach to injuries since then has been far more circumspect--cf, Chad Jackson. Whereas Parcells, he of the famous "Terry Glenn is a She" remark, has nothing to answer for in this regard?

One more thing...it is also clear that Ted has a grudge against the Patriots, and perhaps specifically Belichick, which makes him an all-the-more- likely candidate for the Globe's vultures...

There is no doubt that Ted Johnson is suffering, that he is hurt and confused. But he is also being misused by the scrum of Max Mercies masquerading as sportsmen and skulking in the Globe's dark caves. A wonderful day it will be when another of their braying band is disgraced, à la Mike Barnicle. (And this is coming from a man who writes for his living.)

What he said.

 

[Bella*chick]

because lately everyone's hobby is to try and make BB look like the biggest ******* possible

That's really it. You know, I always knew that once you start losing, the media turns on you. With the Pats, it appears wild success has changed those standards. Now, everyone turns on you if you don't win the Superbowl every year.

 

[Terry Glenn is a cowgirl]

Funny thing about TJ, why did he want to come back during the 2006 season????

Maybe he just wants more cashola since the Steeler story broke open.

HMMM...

 

[Hoodie]

It would be even more sad if BB decides to retire because of this. There's only so much crap a person can take without fighting back.

True, but I think he's particularly thick skinned. We gotta remember that things were BAD in Cleveland. They stationed a 24 hour-a-day police watch outside his house there. He survived that, I think he'll survive all of this, I hope.

 

[PATRIOTS-80]

Re: Why is BB taking so much heat about TJ?

I agree with NEPat on the main issue, that this is an important story which should be addressed as thoroughly as possible by the Patriots, including Kraft and Belichick. But I have to stress as well that believing that McMullen's article was intended to be anything other than a partial BB-smear job is incredibly naïve. The paper has a Vendetta, and it is pursuing it through every possible angle--one could even argue that it is using Ted Johnson in a most calculated fashion. Thus, it is very difficult to know what were the circumstances surrounding the back-to-back concussions, to know who did what, under what duress, under what circumstances, etc.

Would anyone be surprised if we learned that Ted had more or less challenged Belichick's authority, perhaps repeatedly, in such a way that made it more possible for him to be challenged in return to be on the field? Was Ted demanding to play in the game, and BB wanted him to be willing to practice first? Such a scenario, although still worthy of regret on both sides, would make the TJ-incident a rare if still-sad chapter in the life of a football player and his demanding coach, one that would probably have been duplicated by most head coaches at every level of football, unfortunately.

I think that this is one salvo from the Broadsheet Bully (The Globe) that needs to be met head on by the Patriots, defused, and the true and complete story must be told. That a player was rushed back to the field too quickly is in itself hardly a story--it happens all the time. Belichick's approach to injuries since then has been far more circumspect--cf, Chad Jackson. Whereas Parcells, he of the famous "Terry Glenn is a She" remark, has nothing to answer for in this regard?

One more thing...it is also clear that Ted has a grudge against the Patriots, and perhaps specifically Belichick, which makes him an all-the-more- likely candidate for the Globe's vultures...

There is no doubt that Ted Johnson is suffering, that he is hurt and confused. But he is also being misused by the scrum of Max Mercies masquerading as sportsmen and skulking in the Globe's dark caves. A wonderful day it will be when another of their braying band is disgraced, à la Mike Barnicle. (And this is coming from a man who writes for his living.)

I absolutely agree. Good post. I think it gets tot he heart of the matter.

 

[DarrylS]

My understanding on this whole thing is it that BB is not part of the decision making process when it comes to deciding who will practice and who will not, the training & med staff make that decision. If you want to take it one step further, if the Training staff put out a blue jersey and he shows up for practice BB & staff expect him to practice. If he is given a red jersey by the training staff, then there is no contact expectation. These checks and balances are in place to insure that Coaches do not have injured players practicing or playing.

Concerning McMullen, Borges and the rest of the idiots writing for the Globe, once a fabled newspaper, their vendetta is obvious.. read something yesterday where Borges supported McMullens piece. they are complicit, what can be done.. probably nothing, as outside of us hardcore fans, no one will really care much about this. I do think that the Pats need to take the offense in this one, I also suspect that Ted Johnson is putting himself in a bad sitz for doing this. If he is going to sue, he has tipped his hand, if he is looking for sympathy he will not get a whole bunch. TJ has issues, early was very injury prone lots of serious muscle pulls(steroids??), he also has domestic & addiction issues. To blame all of his problems on BB and the Pats seriously begs the issue and cannot imagine any lawyer taking this stance.

 

[Sean Pa Patriot]

This is a thing that will not go away for a long long time... Its sad what Johnson is going thru, and its sad that he has to blame BB for his troubles.. too many holes in this story, that just does not make any sense.. Johnson is having a rough time, and he is just trying to reach out for help.. But of course the media does not see it that way..