Discussion in 'PatsFans.com - Patriots Fan Forum' started by glm, Jul 5, 2009.
I'd say Brady, Moss, Bruschi, Harrison, Seymour, and Law.
I'm probably missing some.
Vinatieri (he's a kicker, but he's got some great kicks on the resume)
Dillon (Has the yards, will he have the votes?)
Fred Taylor (See Dillon)
Bledsoe (unlikely, but he's got a lot of the numbers),
Thinking wishfully, not realistically, Troy Brown.
Bru, Brown and Sey, no chance
Law, Vinatieri, Taylor possibly
Brady, Moss, Seau definites
Hopefully, Kevin O'Connell will be a Hall of Famer after 7 years on the bench
Mayo, if the guy turns into the absolute beast we know he can be.
Interesting to mention Taylor and Dillon. I just don't know that I can ever say they were tops in the league at any one time. Each had a great career, but I'd say both are dicey.
No way for Bruschi, just no way. I think the same applies for Seymour.
Brady and Moss could've retired after 2004 and each would've made it.
Seau is in. Vinatieri is in. Don't think so with Law, Harrison or Bledsoe.
Brady is a first ballot lock. Ditto Moss though not entirely due to his performance here.
Seau is in but not based on anything he did here. Harrison might yet be in based on what he did here and how well his fellow mediots take to him. Law is on the fringe but will probably get in eventually. Seymour was on track early but the jury remains out of late.
Dillon is on the bubble even with a ring. Taylor is likely as well. Drew will have to buy a ticket. Ditto Tedy and Bingo.
As we all know, or should know, "the sorriest corner in the league" (thus spake Philip Rivers) is already in
Yes, Ellis Hobbs' jersey is in a little glass case with a couple other jerseys in the "amazing threesome of long kickoff return" display.
I'm with this dude :
Brady, Moss & Seau are the only locks... and only Brady has played for the Pats for the greatest part of his career. I don't think I'd say Sey has NO chance, because I think his reputation and his Pro Bowls are enough for the casual writer to think highly of him.
I think Viniateri has the "next best shot" after the initial three and I'd put him as a "near lock". I think Harrison will be hurt by the HGH and his dirty player label.
Hopefully Mayo becomes a HoFer, but it's wwwwaaaaaaaaaaayyy to early to go there.
Tom Brady, Ty Law, Junior Seau and Randy Moss (provided he can finish out his career at a high level). Vinatieri may also find his way into Canton because I don't think there's been a kicker in recent memory that has made more big kicks than he has.
I think Harrison has a better shot than most people think. Harrison put up his numbers before he took HGH and after he was caught with it he really didnt do that much on the other hand HGH is the last thing everyone else remembers him doing.Though hopefully maybe after a few years Im sure people will remember the smack talking monster hitting Harrison that put up solid numbers year after year.
One thing to keep in mind is that there was a bit of a backlash to so many Steelers of the 70's getting in to Canton, and the result is that there will probably be an unwritten 'quota' rule regarding how many Pats from this decade make the Hall of Fame. Nine Steeler players from the 70's plus Chuck Noll are in the Hall, as well as six Dolphins plus Don Shula from that decade. By comparison there are only four 49ers (plus Bill Walsh) from the 80's, and two Cowboys from the 90's and two from the 80's (plus Tom Landry, with Emmitt Smith on the way.) In other words the trend is to look at other NFL players and not just those on championship teams.
I would say that Bill Belichick, Tom Brady and Adam Vinatieri will make the Hall in my opinion. Randy Moss probably will as well, though as noted elsewhere it will be as much for what he did in Minnesota as in New England. The rest are on the bubble with odds stacked against them because at some point I think the voters will feel "the Pats of the 2000's are already represented" and will instead be looking at players like Jonathan Ogden, Derrick Brooks, Walter Jones, etc.
Locks: Brady, Moss, Vinatieri, Seau
Almost certain: Seymour, Taylor, Washington
Very good chance: Harrison, Law, Dillon and Wes Welker based on his last two seasons. If he keeps that rate up he will be a lock.
Outsiders: Brushci and Samuel.
It I was picking them Troy Brown and Matt Light would be in it for certain.
I'm a huge Rodney fan... but maybe it'd be more prudent to say "Harrison put up his numbers before he WAS CAUGHT FOR TAKING hgh". If we're being honest and logical, most of our sports heroes are on PED. I'd be much more surprised if it was proven than an NFLer WASN'T using (cue the innocent until proven guilty lovers in 3,2,1...).
Just to comment on some of the above posts:
I've thought that Seymour is a lock.
Bruschi and Harrison will not make it, IMO.
I agree with your theory about HGH and NFL players, regardless of guilty until proven innocent; it's important to remember that the NFL does not test for HGH.
However in the court of public opinion - which will have an effect on those voting - Harrison was caught while all those other players were not. Right or wrong, that will probably cost him some votes, as will his reputation as a dirty player. Those two factors may end up being the difference between him getting in to the Hall or just missing out.
I've already mentionned both of those as the reasons I think he will be overlooked (though I feel they should put him through). I do, however, get aggravated when sports fans go all crazy over the "cheaters" as if only the ones who get caught are using.
In '88, Ben Johnson lost the gold medal in the 100m because of drug use. I knew then, as an 8th grader, that many, many more athletes were using. Put it this way : if highschoolers are using, what makes us think college & pros aren't ?
Back to the topic : we both agree Harrison will probably be bypassed for the reasons stated above. I personally think he should go because, in the end, he was a winner on a winning team that played a big part in winning SBs. And that's the stat I care about.
I agree that Seymour will make it but I wouldn't call him a lock for it. I mean he not as likely as Brady, Moss, Seau and Vinatieri imo. I know Vinatieri is a kicker but he is the closest to a household name any kicker will ever be so imo he is more certain than Seymour to make it.
Brady, Moss, Seau go in hands down.
Bruschi will be like Tippett, a decade or more after he retires they will let him in and even then it might have to be a light year for candidates.
Troy Brown...not likely. They have kept out Irving Fryer and Stanley Morgan, they aren't going to let Brown in.
Rodney Harrison will have to wait a few years, being with the media will soften them up about his candidacy but it might take some fresh voter blood to get over his reputation and the HGH suspension.
Dillon I don't think makes it in, if he does it will be after a long wait. There are several running backs from this era who are ahead of him and he will have to wait until they are in before he gets in if he does at all.
Taylor, same as Dillon. He might get in sooner than Dillon due to not being a problem for his team like Dillon was.
I'm not ready to put Seymour or Light in there, I think they still need to make cases for themselves before they go in. Considering they aren't close to retiring they have plenty of time to do that.
Welker I think could make it, but he will end up being a fringe guy. We don't know where his numbers will be or how much longer he will play and at what level he will play...he could take a nose dive in a few years and sabotage his chances.
Law I don't think makes it, if he makes it it will be after a long, long time.
Adam V. makes it after a long wait and new blood voting. Too much anti-kicker hatred still around to put him in there. He will need more dramatics to wow people again.
Bledsoe I wouldn't put into this grouping, he belongs with the 90s players. His numbers are worthy, he is considered one of the top QBs of the 90s- extremely hard to keep him out of the Hall of Fame.
I think we're all going to be extremely disappointed when it comes to the Hall votes. Perhaps things would have been different if Spygate hadn't happened or if ESPNisFULLofSHALLOWjerks Gate had covered the incident in a responsible manner but as things are, the Patriots and some of our deserving players will pretty much get screwed.
While there will certainly be some players whose statistics can't be argued against, there will be quite a few who could've only gotten in based off the media's respect for the team. In much the same way that Swann and some of the Steelers players got in b/c they were great players on the greatest team, Bruschi and maybe even Brown could've received similar treatment but since our team is pretty much universally hated now, they're chances are slim to none.
Here's my list.
1) Seau - 1st ballot lock
2) Brady - 1st ballot lock
3) Moss - lock (they'll make him wait once or twice like they did with Irvin though)
4) Vinatieri - lock
5) Belichick - Will likely have to wait a few ballots as I'm sure there will be quite a few that try to give him the Pete Rose treatment. Clueless idiots!
6) Seymour - Needs a few more All-Pro's to gain lock status
7) Harrison - Being miscast as a dirty player will hurt him but his personality in front of the camera at his new job will ultimately swing the vote in his favor
8) Law - Never got the respect he deserved. Prior to his injury in 2004 he played at a far superior level than Champ Bailey ever has but never got the PR.
9) Ted Washington - The best NT in the history of the league but the idiot sportswriters don't recognize non-stat guys. That would require them to actually watch football games instead of just reading the box-scores.
10) Assante Samuel - Still too early in his career but he's on pace to make it in easy since he shows up in a lot of box-scores (Int's).
11) Bruschi - The Heart and Soul of our defense. 50/50 shot to get in but it will definitely take awhile.
12) Brown - The guy deserves to be in. Incredible football player.
13) McGinest - All Time Postseason Sack Leader deserves some consideration but if it took Tippet this long to get in, I don't see it happening
14) Vrabel - If the team was loved by the media like the 70's Steelers or Cowboys he'd get in but since we're not, he won't.
15) Fred Taylor - Needs at least one stellar season and postseason performance
16) Joey Galloway - There are so many good WR's its tough to say. If he can contribute to two more SB wins, things might fall his way though.
17) Welker - Would need to average 100 receptions for another 3 or 4 years. Even then, I doubt it. Too much competition at WR and the media idiots have labeled him a system guy.
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