Where does Mario Williams rank among NFL defenders?

[MarvLevy]

This. Nobody wants to go to buffalo. And if their coaching staff want to keep their jobs, they need to splash their money now. They need to generate publicity there and the only way is by signing big name players. I think they made the best decision possible.

Sorry if this offends any of you but there's more to decision making than just player and cap space. You have to consider geography, market, media, PR, owner confidence, locker room, etc. most of these factors are not known to fans.

My brother lives in Philly. I really hope you aren't trying to imply Philly is a more glamorous location than Buffalo because it isn't. But obviously in terms of just football, Buffalo has struggled for a decade. That said, we have been re-signing all of our key players the last couple of offseasons. I believe the culture is changing.

Williams' contract is basically what Peppers got due to inflation. IF you know anything about pectoral injuries, most patients come back stronger than ever due to Kevlar (the stuff that is used for bulletproof) being used to repair the tear.

Everyone in the NFL is overpaid. But I do know we beat you guys for the 1st time in forever nad led 21-0 in the 2nd game. Our defense was our franchise's worst EVER. To get the #1 FA in your biggest position of weakness is absolutely amazing. More than anything, it sends a message that the Bills are going to go after it.

Adding one of the best pass rushers to an interior that features a pro bowler in Kyle Williams and a rookie who played well in Dareus is absolutely huge. Maybe it never works out. But I feel a million times better about our chances to compete today than I did before.

 

[THELAWFIRM226]

How could this not be about the money.....He left a playoff team not far from a Superbowl in all likelihood, to the......bills.......

With that said, I can't say I blame him because I bet everyone in the NFL would have done the same thing...

 

[MarvLevy]

It's kind of like the hometown discount, only in reverse.

The Bills have to overpay by about 15%-20% to get guys to go to Buffalo.

He'll still be able to experience a Houston winter when he's in Buffalo--I think they call it August.

Haha. City smack is hilarious. Generally people who have high quality of life don't put down other people's hometowns. I love that people think they are somehow better people because of where they live or what team they root for. I'd gladly PM resumes with someone who feels they are "superior" because of their location.

IT's doubly hilarious that people from Boston act like their city is some tropical paradise. Buffalo had 33 inches of snow this year. But we all know Boston is the San Diego of NE. :bricks:

 

[THELAWFIRM226]

Haha. City smack is hilarious. Generally people who have high quality of life don't put down other people's hometowns. I love that people think they are somehow better people because of where they live or what team they root for. I'd gladly PM resumes with someone who feels they are "superior" because of their location.

IT's doubly hilarious that people from Boston act like their city is some tropical paradise. Buffalo had 33 inches of snow this year. But we all know Boston is the San Diego of NE. :bricks:

I agree with most of what you said, but you'd "gladly PM resumes"?

I don't even know what to say other than just shut up.....

 

[reflexblue]

Be honest with yourselves, if Williams had signed here you all would be saying he was the best or close to the best Defensive player. This is so typical of this forum, we miss out on a player and all of a sudden he turns into a bum, hes not that good, we're better off without him. Personally i don't think he so good i would tie up $100 million in him.

 

[upstater1]

My brother lives in Philly. I really hope you aren't trying to imply Philly is a more glamorous location than Buffalo because it isn't. But obviously in terms of just football, Buffalo has struggled for a decade. That said, we have been re-signing all of our key players the last couple of offseasons. I believe the culture is changing.

Williams' contract is basically what Peppers got due to inflation. IF you know anything about pectoral injuries, most patients come back stronger than ever due to Kevlar (the stuff that is used for bulletproof) being used to repair the tear.

Everyone in the NFL is overpaid. But I do know we beat you guys for the 1st time in forever nad led 21-0 in the 2nd game. Our defense was our franchise's worst EVER. To get the #1 FA in your biggest position of weakness is absolutely amazing. More than anything, it sends a message that the Bills are going to go after it.

Adding one of the best pass rushers to an interior that features a pro bowler in Kyle Williams and a rookie who played well in Dareus is absolutely huge. Maybe it never works out. But I feel a million times better about our chances to compete today than I did before.

Err, I live in Buffalo and I like it, but come on??!! Have you actually visited your brother? Philly has it over Buffalo with ease. Don't be dense.

 

[upstater1]

It's kind of like the hometown discount, only in reverse.

The Bills have to overpay by about 15%-20% to get guys to go to Buffalo.

He'll still be able to experience a Houston winter when he's in Buffalo--I think they call it August.

You're one of the few people I know that prefers 100 degrees and sweltering humidity with green muggy skies to 85 degree dry weather with beautiful blue skies.

I'm comparing August weather.

 

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

Everyone in the NFL is overpaid. But I do know we beat you guys for the 1st time in forever nad led 21-0 in the 2nd game. Our defense was our franchise's worst EVER. To get the #1 FA in your biggest position of weakness is absolutely amazing. More than anything, it sends a message that the Bills are going to go after it.

There is nothing "absolutely amazing" about it. The Bills were determined to get Williams at any cost, and quite a cost it was. Probably 15 teams could have done the same thing with Williams and just paid him $100M, but 14 of them bowed out. Why? Because they don't see this as an "absolutely amazing" move. Perhaps drafting a stud player with immediate impact or trading a late round pick for a great player whose contract is affordable, those would be "absolutely amazing" in that they would upgrade the roster, but not at the expense of a $20M hole in your roster. Suppose Williams gets hurt or just puts up 5 sacks a year. You are completely screwed in that case.

In my opinion, the Bills took a major step back. Could you please remind me of the last team that made some mega offseason signing and didn't badly disappoint the next year?

People just don't realize that salary-cap era football is about economics and value. As I stated earlier in this thread, it is nearly impossible for Williams to be a good value for the contract he got. He'd have to play better than he ever has before, stay healthy, and make teammates better for him to justify that deal. And even if he does, he is barely worth it. More likely, the Bills will regret this deal three years from now.

 

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

ESPN Scouts Insider:

NFL Free Agents Grades and Free Agency Rumors - National Football League - ESPN

They rank Mario Williams a 79 out of 100 (between good starter and outstanding player), sixth among free agent linebackers.

Not saying that anyone should take ESPN too seriously, but doesn't that seem a bit odd that the highest paid defender in the NFL is not even the consensus #1 linebacker, and nowhere near elite, according to these rankings? Do you really think Lawrence Taylor or Ray Lewis would have had a single scout believe this?

 

[MarvLevy]

ESPN Scouts Insider:

NFL Free Agents Grades and Free Agency Rumors - National Football League - ESPN

They rank Mario Williams a 79 out of 100 (between good starter and outstanding player), sixth among free agent linebackers.

Not saying that anyone should take ESPN too seriously, but doesn't that seem a bit odd that the highest paid defender in the NFL is not even the consensus #1 linebacker, and nowhere near elite, according to these rankings? Do you really think Lawrence Taylor or Ray Lewis would have had a single scout believe this?

He had 5 sacks in 5 games in his 1st year in a new defense. If you take out his injury year (where he averaged a sack/ game) and his rookie year, he has averaged 11 sacks/ year. He also gets to play next to a pro bowl DT and a #3 overall DT who showed a lot of promise.

But I'm sure if you guys got Williams you won't be excited.

 

[MarvLevy]

There is nothing "absolutely amazing" about it. The Bills were determined to get Williams at any cost, and quite a cost it was. Probably 15 teams could have done the same thing with Williams and just paid him $100M, but 14 of them bowed out. Why? Because they don't see this as an "absolutely amazing" move. Perhaps drafting a stud player with immediate impact or trading a late round pick for a great player whose contract is affordable, those would be "absolutely amazing" in that they would upgrade the roster, but not at the expense of a $20M hole in your roster. Suppose Williams gets hurt or just puts up 5 sacks a year. You are completely screwed in that case.

In my opinion, the Bills took a major step back. Could you please remind me of the last team that made some mega offseason signing and didn't badly disappoint the next year?

People just don't realize that salary-cap era football is about economics and value. As I stated earlier in this thread, it is nearly impossible for Williams to be a good value for the contract he got. He'd have to play better than he ever has before, stay healthy, and make teammates better for him to justify that deal. And even if he does, he is barely worth it. More likely, the Bills will regret this deal three years from now.

A step back??? We were 6-10 and just fielded our worst defense in the history of the franchise. Again, nothing is set in stone but I don't think teams will look forward to playing against our d line and it all starts up front. The Bills struggled with pressured and forced several QBs into multiple INTs. Even if MW doesn't get a sack, he frees up someone else.

And to answer your question about the last team to do well after spending mega bucks in FAcy: the 2010 Bears who went to the conference title game after signing Peppers to a similar deal. IMO, if you overspend, it should be on a QB or big body.

 

[Deus Irae]

He had 5 sacks in 5 games in his 1st year in a new defense. If you take out his injury year (where he averaged a sack/ game) and his rookie year, he has averaged 11 sacks/ year. He also gets to play next to a pro bowl DT and a #3 overall DT who showed a lot of promise.

But I'm sure if you guys got Williams you won't be excited.

6 seasons
2 seasons with double digit sack totals


Why would you do such a lousy job of shading the facts on this? He's been a good pass rusher, but nothing remotely otherworldly.

 

[MarvLevy]

6 seasons
2 seasons with double digit sack totals


Why would you do such a lousy job of shading the facts on this? He's been a good pass rusher, but nothing remotely otherworldly.

Yeah, he sucks and I wish we didn't sign him. But keeping thinking being a pass rusher is all about sacks. If MW gets 5 sacks but allows Kyle Williams and Dareus to kill it up the middle, it will be well worth it. Additionally, I want them to draft another pass rusher and maybe the corpse of Merriman can contribute something. Pressure is not on one guy. It's a numbers game, as the Giants proved.

 

[Deus Irae]

Yeah, he sucks and I wish we didn't sign him. But keeping thinking being a pass rusher is all about sacks. If MW gets 5 sacks but allows Kyle Williams and Dareus to kill it up the middle, it will be well worth it. Additionally, I want them to draft another pass rusher and maybe the corpse of Merriman can contribute something. Pressure is not on one guy. It's a numbers game, as the Giants proved.

Dude, you tried to eliminate 1/3 of the guy's career in order to beef up his numbers. Don't get snarky with me because I called you on something that obvious.

 

[MarvLevy]

Dude, you tried to eliminate 1/3 of the guy's career in order to beef up his numbers. Don't get snarky with me because I called you on something that obvious.

I'm far from snarky. Damn near 70 here and we got a stud pass rusher. By the way, what I did was eliminate the outliners. When you consider it was his rookie year (unless MW is the only rookie in NFL history to struggle) and a year in which he got injuried (and was averaging a sack/game), I really don't find it that crazy.

But whatever. He's so overrated you guys should be happy you didn't waste your money on him. I'm just going to be dreaming until September.

 

[Deus Irae]

I'm far from snarky. Damn near 70 here and we got a stud pass rusher. By the way, what I did was eliminate the outliners. When you consider it was his rookie year (unless MW is the only rookie in NFL history to struggle) and a year in which he got injuried (and was averaging a sack/game), I really don't find it that crazy.

But whatever. He's so overrated you guys should be happy you didn't waste your money on him. I'm just going to be dreaming until September.

If you were really eliminating outliers, you'd have eliminated the 14 sack season.

 

[Ring 6]

My brother lives in Philly. I really hope you aren't trying to imply Philly is a more glamorous location than Buffalo because it isn't. But obviously in terms of just football, Buffalo has struggled for a decade. That said, we have been re-signing all of our key players the last couple of offseasons. I believe the culture is changing.

Williams' contract is basically what Peppers got due to inflation. IF you know anything about pectoral injuries, most patients come back stronger than ever due to Kevlar (the stuff that is used for bulletproof) being used to repair the tear.

Everyone in the NFL is overpaid. But I do know we beat you guys for the 1st time in forever nad led 21-0 in the 2nd game. Our defense was our franchise's worst EVER. To get the #1 FA in your biggest position of weakness is absolutely amazing. More than anything, it sends a message that the Bills are going to go after it.

Adding one of the best pass rushers to an interior that features a pro bowler in Kyle Williams and a rookie who played well in Dareus is absolutely huge. Maybe it never works out. But I feel a million times better about our chances to compete today than I did before.

I find comments like the bolded one hilarious.
Exactly how does committing a huge chunk of your to one player signify 'going for it' any more than spending the same chunk on numerous players at many positions?

 

[nabwong]

My brother lives in Philly. I really hope you aren't trying to imply Philly is a more glamorous location than Buffalo because it isn't. But obviously in terms of just football, Buffalo has struggled for a decade. That said, we have been re-signing all of our key players the last couple of offseasons. I believe the culture is changing.

Williams' contract is basically what Peppers got due to inflation. IF you know anything about pectoral injuries, most patients come back stronger than ever due to Kevlar (the stuff that is used for bulletproof) being used to repair the tear.

Everyone in the NFL is overpaid. But I do know we beat you guys for the 1st time in forever nad led 21-0 in the 2nd game. Our defense was our franchise's worst EVER. To get the #1 FA in your biggest position of weakness is absolutely amazing. More than anything, it sends a message that the Bills are going to go after it.

Adding one of the best pass rushers to an interior that features a pro bowler in Kyle Williams and a rookie who played well in Dareus is absolutely huge. Maybe it never works out. But I feel a million times better about our chances to compete today than I did before.

Philly IS a more glamorous location than Buffalo. I have nothing against Buffalo but i'd never choose to live there over Philly. Heck, I'd rather live in San Francisco than Philly. Most people would say that.

If you didn't read my post properly, I did say that it was a GOOD decision by the Bills to go after Mario. I also said that the reason to pay him that much was because of a lot of factors fans don't know.

 

[patsfan-1982]

befor last year he only missed 3 games in he's whole career so injury may not be a big problem for the bills, as far as where he ranks among NFL pass rusher... he's not on Jared Allen or DeMarcus Ware level but he's just as good if not better then James Harrison and Julius Peppers

 

[Joker]

I went after "it"...and guess what...I got...

now..what the hell do i do with it???????????