What's the story with Vereen?

[RobertWeathers]

Vereen held out. Got hurt. Practiced. Got dinged up a again and is a rookie. This is his red-shirt year. He gets a pass in my book.

 

[moosekill]

The story is the last couple of years we had an old backfield that experienced lots of injuries. We weren't sure if Faulk was going to come back, and we were losing 2 of our running backs. So, we drafted 2 rookies to replace them. So far this year we haven't had many injuries and Faulk made it back and has played well. I would much rather be in this position than the one we were in last year. Or we could whine about it I guess.

 

[Dragda]

I had high hopes for Vereen when we drafted him.

I remember before the draft, somone asked Michael Holly if he had to name
one player that Pats would draft, who would it be.

His answer....

Shane Vereen.

He must have had some inside information about the Pats feelings about
Vereen.

I know he missed most of training camp with a minor injury, but I am still
suprised he has not been given a chance to play.

What's the story with this guy ?????
Will he get a chance in 2012, or is he another of a long line of 2nd round
busts?

2nd round busts....
Cunningham, Brace, Butler, Wheatley, Chad Jackson.

The only real score we have had in the 2nd round is Gronkowski
and I also like the Vollmer & Chung pick.

The jury is still out on Dowling and Spikes.

If Vereen & Dowling end up a bust, the busts far out number production from 2nd round picks in recent years.

Klemm, Bethel Johnson, and Marquise Hill never panned out either. Hill might have, but had a lot of talent in front of him in those days.

The other side of the coin is that we picked up Light, Branch, and Eugene Wilson in the second round (in addition to the players you mentioned as exceptions). They played well for us. I don't think there is any magic round or cursed round. Just players that make it and those that don't.

 

[Mack Herron]

Makes you wonder though...barring an injury will we even see Vereen this season?

Kevin Faulk RB Knee Limited Participation Questionable
BenJarvus Green-Ellis RB Toe Limited Participation Questionable

Vereen was a "practice player of the week" last week. Now is the time for both Ridley and Vereen to step up.

 

[mgteich]

I just don't understand the problem. It was time for Taylor and Morris to retire. No one knew whether Faulk would be back. Green-Ellis was unsigned. Belichick drafted two running backs for the future, and as insurance.
==================
Many reasonably complain the Belichick doesn't use the running game enough. But that is not the issue we are discussing on this thread. We had a fine running game last year with Green-Ellis and Woodhead.

I see no reason to rush a rookie who has had almost no time to learn in his rookie offseason because of injuries. Would I like to see Vareen out there, perhaps returning kicks? Sure! That would mean that he is now ready to contribute. But I have no reason to expect that to happen.

HOW DO YOU STAND?

1) How disappointed are you that a rookie (who has been injured) hasn't beaten out Green-Ellis or Woodhead?

2) How disappointed are you that this rookie hasn't developed well enough yet to expect him to be better than Woodhead and Faulk on third downs?

3) How disappointed are you that this rookie has developed well enough yet for Belichick to trust him as a returner?

My answer is that I am not very disappointed, other than by the fact that Vareen was injured. This analysis is somewhat colored by having Ridley play reasonably well when called upon.

BOTTOM LINE FOR ME
Green-Ellis and Faulk were re-signed.
We had a solid run game last year.
Ridley is ahead of Vareen in the depth chart.
There are few snaps for Vareen or Ridley.
There have never snaps for the 5th running back (unless he were a top special teamer).

 

[Paul_Newman]

I don't buy it...how is keeping the 185 pound Woodhead in there better than what Vereen can provide?

Just the last game against the Jets i recall Woodhead getting blown up by one of the jets scrubs for a sack.

Woodhead does more than just block. He recognizes defensive coverages. He's pretty good in the passing game as well.

Why knock on the little man? He can play and the Pats are a better team with him. He's just been dealing with injuries this year.

Part of the reason Vereen isn't playing there's just no room for him.

 

[Armchair Quarterback]

I just don't understand the problem. It was time for Taylor and Morris to retire. No one knew whether Faulk would be back. Green-Ellis was unsigned. Belichick drafted two running backs for the future, and as insurance.
==================
Many reasonably complain the Belichick doesn't use the running game enough. But that is not the issue we are discussing on this thread. We had a fine running game last year with Green-Ellis and Woodhead.

I see no reason to rush a rookie who has had almost no time to learn in his rookie offseason because of injuries. Would I like to see Vareen out there, perhaps returning kicks? Sure! That would mean that he is now ready to contribute. But I have no reason to expect that to happen.

HOW DO YOU STAND?

1) How disappointed are you that a rookie (who has been injured) hasn't beaten out Green-Ellis or Woodhead?

2) How disappointed are you that this rookie hasn't developed well enough yet to expect him to be better than Woodhead and Faulk on third downs?

3) How disappointed are you that this rookie has developed well enough yet for Belichick to trust him as a returner?

My answer is that I am not very disappointed, other than by the fact that Vareen was injured. This analysis is somewhat colored by having Ridley play reasonably well when called upon.

BOTTOM LINE FOR ME
Green-Ellis and Faulk were re-signed.
We had a solid run game last year.
Ridley is ahead of Vareen in the depth chart.
There are few snaps for Vareen or Ridley.
There have never snaps for the 5th running back (unless he were a top special teamer).

Why spend a 2nd rounder on a player who is the 5th on the depth chart at a position that is not emphasized in this offense?

Why spend a second rounder on a third down back who can't block?

Running Backs are pretty easy to find and should be able to contribute right away, 2nd round running backs should not be 'redshirted'.

If you're going to take a RB in the second round, maybe take the one who has 674 yards on 100 carries in only three starts halfway through the season rather than the one who needs to be 'redshirted'. Again, drafted after Vereen.

WR's Torrey Smith and Randall Cobb were picked soon after Vereen, Think the Pats could have used them? Or are we already covered with Price, who's now well into his second season being 'redshirted'.

How about some defensive players? One defensive player out of their first 7 picks. This team has more pressing needs than using a second rounder on a 5th string redshirt 3rd down back who can't block.

At the very least, I would hope that he would force them to use him in the return game since the team has struggled finding a decent returner in both the kickoff and punt return games.

Maybe I'd be more optimistic if we hadn't been down this road so many times before.

 

[Reckedtrek]

Right, so a news article doesn't qualify. Got it.

I never presented it as fact, I said I heard it. Generally, someone doesn't use words like "I've heard and "maybe" when presenting a statement as fact.

How about I'll judge the pick however the hell I want to judge the pick and a rb who's "undersized and needs to learn to block" may not have been the wisest choice in the 2nd round. And if they don't need him than the pick makes even less sense.


However you make a very compelling argument with;

"Maybe he's spent the last 4 months in the weight room and getting some instruction on what he'll need later in the season or next year."

You've really turned the table on me with that one. What a well thought out and provocative statement. You've really shown yourself to be a master of debate with that ingenious statement. Well done!

I guess I just assumed when you said "I heard he's a dancer" you actually had a source other than a local media piece you read on the internet. Guess what, I heard the Patriots hate their coach, too!

Tell you what AQ, keep believing everything you read. It's obviously made you smarter than Bill Belichick.

 

[Sciz]

Why spend a 2nd rounder on a player who is the 5th on the depth chart at a position that is not emphasized in this offense?

Why spend a second rounder on a third down back who can't block?

Running Backs are pretty easy to find and should be able to contribute right away, 2nd round running backs should not be 'redshirted'.

If you're going to take a RB in the second round, maybe take the one who has 674 yards on 100 carries in only three starts halfway through the season rather than the one who needs to be 'redshirted'. Again, drafted after Vereen.

WR's Torrey Smith and Randall Cobb were picked soon after Vereen, Think the Pats could have used them? Or are we already covered with Price, who's now well into his second season being 'redshirted'.

How about some defensive players? One defensive player out of their first 7 picks. This team has more pressing needs than using a second rounder on a 5th string redshirt 3rd down back who can't block.

At the very least, I would hope that he would force them to use him in the return game since the team has struggled finding a decent returner in both the kickoff and punt return games.

Maybe I'd be more optimistic if we hadn't been down this road so many times before.

1. You act like Vereen will never be able to block just because he can't now.
2. You act like they drafted him knowing that he'd be the #5 RB, ignoring that the only other RB on the team at the time of the draft was Woodhead.

 

[HowardRoark]

Vereen story is the same as Price he's not good a nuff to be on the field right now, i just wish they would give BJGE 20 att per game

A nuff? Really?

 

[Kontradiction]

The story with Vereen is that we didn't need to draft him...

 

[Armchair Quarterback]

I guess I just assumed when you said "I heard he's a dancer" you actually had a source other than a local media piece you read on the internet. Guess what, I heard the Patriots hate their coach, too!

Tell you what AQ, keep believing everything you read. It's obviously made you smarter than Bill Belichick.

You seem to have an awful lot of trouble separating someone saying they've heard something and having that mean they believe everything they read.

Again, someone doesn't use words like "I've heard" and "maybe" when presenting a statement as fact.

I said "I heard something."
You asked where I heard it.
I answered you.
You dismissed it because it's a local paper and written by someone who's job it is to cover the team.

At no point did I present it as fact.

I assume you get all of your Patriot news directly from Bill Belichick, that is when you're not attending the closed team practices yourself.

 

[Armchair Quarterback]

1. You act like Vereen will never be able to block just because he can't now.
2. You act like they drafted him knowing that he'd be the #5 RB, ignoring that the only other RB on the team at the time of the draft was Woodhead.

No, I question the reasoning of drafting a primarily 3rd down back who can't block in the second round with the emphasis the team places on the RB's ability to block.

Save the projects for the later rounds.

BJGE was never going anywhere, he was an exclusive rights FA and having unrestricted free agency after three years was never on the table.

 

[SyN65]

The story is BB loves trading high picks for more picks in later rounds to pick up players that usually have no impact on this team. Why he drafted 2 RB's (high picks at that) when we already have BJGE/Woodhead on the roster is beyond me. Maybe so they can sit on the bench. Or maybe so they can get like 5 snaps a game. Doesn't seem like an effective use for such a high pick to me. Whatever, in BB we trust I guess.

 

[FredFromDartmouth]

even if he was the best blitz pick up running back since Walter Payton, it would still be hard for him to take snaps in front of four pretty good running backs above him on the depth chart.....especially when 3 out of 5 have to share 3rd down snaps primarily which only occur 15 times a game plus maybe one 2 minute drive.

ti


I am not so sure of that; the best blitz pick up I ever saw by a RB was Corey Dillon. He did not just stop the blitzer...he annihilated the blitzer. Just blew him up. The guy would be lying stunned on the turf after a Corey Dillion hit. It was his revenge on LBs.

 

[Lansdowne]

I look at what Ray Rice is doing now, and sigh thinking about what kind of impact we could be missing from Vereen (similar backs, remember Rice was plenty productive his rookie season even as his team's #3 RB) because we settle for Law Firm's 2 yards and a cloud of dust.

I'm exaggerating of course, BJGE has been solid and dependable, but he's not explosive or dynamic.

 

[Mack Herron]

I look at what Ray Rice is doing now, and sigh thinking about what kind of impact we could be missing from Vereen (similar backs, remember Rice was plenty productive his rookie season even as his team's #3 RB) because we settle for Law Firm's 2 yards and a cloud of dust.

I'm exaggerating of course, BJGE has been solid and dependable, but he's not explosive or dynamic.

The offense currently doesn't have anyone who is explosive or dynamic. Ridley showed a surprising flash of explosiveness in one game, and Vereen is supposed to be better. Also, Price is bigger and faster than any receiver on the roster. Let's hope that at least one of these guys pulls it together and provides a new dimension to the offense before the playoffs get underway.

 

[mgteich]

Green-Ellis was NOT an unrestricted free agent. He was an RFA who we had a right to match. I suppose that if he were offered $4M a year, that you think Belichick would have felt he was forced to pay. Drafting 2 running backs gave us insurance. Besides, we had at least two open running back roster spots.

No, I question the reasoning of drafting a primarily 3rd down back who can't block in the second round with the emphasis the team places on the RB's ability to block.

Save the projects for the later rounds.

BJGE was never going anywhere, he was an exclusive rights FA and having unrestricted free agency after three years was never on the table.

 

[thodoks]

The story? He's just not very good.

 

[Armchair Quarterback]

BJGE was never going anywhere, he was an exclusive rights FA and having unrestricted free agency after three years was never on the table.

Green-Ellis was NOT an unrestricted free agent. He was an RFA who we had a right to match. I suppose that if he were offered $4M a year, that you think Belichick would have felt he was forced to pay. Drafting 2 running backs gave us insurance. Besides, we had at least two open running back roster spots.

Is there some sort of group discount this board could get on a reading comprehension class?

BB told Faulk before the lockout he wanted him back on the team, Woodhead was already signed and BJGE had no chance at unrestricted free agency. We don't need a fifth RB if he never sees the field or play much special teams.