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Discussion in 'Political Discussion' started by Fogbuster, Mar 3, 2007.

  1. Fogbuster

    Fogbuster Rookie

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  2. Harry Boy

    Harry Boy Look Up, It's Amazing PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Imagine what the "Bush Haters" would do with this if it were Laura or Barbara Bush's family :singing: :singing:

    Hillary's people probably dug this up, this is the kind of things they do when they aren't "killing cats".
    Last edited: Mar 3, 2007
  3. wistahpatsfan

    wistahpatsfan Rookie

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    #75 Jersey

    Great-great-great-great grandfather, huh?
    HE'S A SLAVER!

    Hate to know what my great-great-great-great grandfather was up to.
  4. Fogbuster

    Fogbuster Rookie

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    So would I.


    :eek:


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  5. PF1996

    PF1996 Rookie

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    Why would this be an "inconvenient truth" when it's a reality that's probably fairly common within the "black community"? It was common for slave owners to rape their black female slaves and the offspring of those rapes were categorised as "black", so it's likely that many "black" Americans have biological ancestors who were slave owners. In fact, many "black" Americans probably have not only ancestors who were slave owners but ancestors who were owned by their OTHER ancestors - which is certainly far more appalling than Obama's history.

    Ironically, the "lukewarm" reception for Obama within the "black community" has nothing to do with the fact that his mother is white but rather is based on the fact that his father is African and that he spent part of his childhood abroad. There are many "blacks" with white mothers who are accepted as being "black" - i.e. Halle Berry and Alicia Keyes are obvious examples. American blacks do not particularly care for native Africans, despite their many vocal tributes about "mother Africa" and their insistence on being called "African Americans". That's actually the "inconvenient truth" for Obama.
  6. wistahpatsfan

    wistahpatsfan Rookie

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    #75 Jersey

    Very good post and observations.
    Black Americans, like all other native-born Americans, resent newcomers and foreigners because they add to the competition for jobs. Simple as that. I hate the term African-Americans or black Americans for that matter. Referring to one of the oldest non-native groups by any other term than "American" doesn't seem right to me.
  7. Harry Boy

    Harry Boy Look Up, It's Amazing PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Your right Wistah, if they are citizens they are "Americans" the same people that claim to be Color Blind call them "Black Americans" yet if I were to say "I'm a "white American" I would be called a "bigot" (again).

    I have an old friend that I see often we were kids running the streets together way back when, he lost a leg at Normandy, I think I wll start calling him a "One Legged American".

    The Looney Politically Correct Saviours have a new target now, "fat people" they are trying to blame "McDonalds" because there are Fat People all over the country who need two seats wherever they go, we should now start calling these people "Fat Americans"

    Bush is to blame for everything
    McDonalds is to blame for fat people
    Kill McDonald
    Send your old worms to the Governor Of Massachusetts.
    Last edited: Mar 3, 2007
  8. Fogbuster

    Fogbuster Rookie

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    As they say in Harley-ville: if I have to explain you wouldn't understand.


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  9. Real World

    Real World Moderator Staff Member

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    I started a thread on this yesterday. This is beyond idiotic. Thomas Jefferson and George Washington owned slaves once. This story, labeled a "Sun Exclusive" is about as stupid, moronic, and irrelevent as can be. Politics are beyond ridiculous now. I sure hope none of these guys felt a girl up before 5th grade or there will be hell to pay! :mad:
  10. Fogbuster

    Fogbuster Rookie

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    T'would appear things are just warming up.

    Limosine liberals want to tell us how to live, while they do as they please. Right.

    I mean: Wrong.


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  11. PatsFanInVa

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    You guys are just so lost in the partisan bunker, you're a little oblivious to the electability problem one faces when the electorate is 70% or so non-hispanic white:

    Getting white people to vote for you.

    I saw a woman on the Colbert Report who'd just done a book on Obama, and how he's not "really Black," basically, in that he does not truly understand the African-American experience.

    What's comical is the right wing sees this as possibly detracting from his electability -- as if "not really Black" Democrats have trouble with pulling votes from that demographic.

    All of this attention to how Obama is "not really Black enough" translates in the suburbs to "Oh look honey! He's not really that Black!"

    Since judging by the content of a man's character rather than the color of his skin seems not to have much of a track record, I think it's pertinent to note that Obama may just be in better shape after this inconvenience than before. Unless his family owned Sharpton's at some point. (Notice how nobody, Thurmond or Sharpton, finds that the least bit embarassing? That's because neither of them is a slave or a slaveowner.)

    PFnV
  12. Zuma

    Zuma Rookie

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  13. Fogbuster

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    Not sure who you are referring to here, PF, but for me I kind of like the guy! Obama as a candidate, that is. If given the hypothetical limited choice of him or Hillary I probably would choose him.

    One reason for starting this thread is to point the never-ending flow of ironies and apparent-but-not-real contradictions that continue to abound in politics!! I find it delightfully amusing!! I mean, a guy most identify as "black" who has ancestors who owned slaves!!

    Slavery is not a funny thing by any stretch of the imagination, but to see the irony of how people look at whites as "oppressors" and blacks as "the oppressed" in such stark contrast -- well, this tidbit on Obama just makes a mockery of the black/white dynamic as being so... cut and dried. It ain't necessarily so!!


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  14. PatsFanInVa

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    Well, Fog, it's necessarily so in a limited, on-the-ground way. Like, at a traffic stop. But in terms of who has what "in the woodpile," there's some silliness there for sure. If it weren't that there is a totally different experience between being of these two "races," I would just say the whole thing is a joke. It should be a joke. The thing is, it's not one, when you're looking for work, looking for an apartment/house/loan, or looking into mirrored glasses on a trooper in a lot of cases.

    PFnV
  15. Holy Diver

    Holy Diver Rookie

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    #80 Jersey

  16. Real World

    Real World Moderator Staff Member

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    It was a question presented by many, even some in the black community, of Obama's "blackness". The question was asked because his father is an actual African, and not African American, and his mother is white. Basically, he is first generation african-american, and thus people wondered if he had experienced the same historical struggle that other generational A-A's had suffered through. I think some hear "is he black enough" and quickly think along the lines of his being a white man trapped in a black mans body, or that it's some white folk trying to make him look bad. Where both latter thoughts are legitimate, and hold truth (in a bad way), so is to does the former. Does he, as a first generation A-A, understand the true hardship faced by A-A families who have passed on the struggle from our nations birth? Personally, I think it's ok to discuss such a question if presented in such a manner. Does anyone understand what I'm saying here? It's a fine line.
  17. PatsFanInVa

    PatsFanInVa PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Sure, RW... the disconnect here, is that the "embarassing" slaveholders on one side of his family has nothing to do with this discussion... as another poster pointed out, it's such a common situation in the AA community that (if you ask me,) it's a non-issue. Not that it wouldn't be by now anyway.

    Now, the topic you bring up is worth some discussion, and it's already come up, among African American political pundits primarily. Of course the usual suspects will jump on the story.

    In terms of political impact, however:

    What I was trying to say was that, while African Americans may see Obama as not "really" Black, not experiencing everything they have, etc., African Americans did not see Clinton as Black either (for instance), but did see him as capable of representing issues key to African Americans. The idea that Obama would lose significant support among African Americans is ridiculous. The idea that White Americans find him less threatening based on this type of publicity makes much more sense.

    I see the Right Wing-nuts jump up and down at the "new discovery!" that Obama's "Not Really Black!!!" and it sort of tickles me. It's the sort of story that will sell to the right-wing media outlets, and will end up doing very little for the Rightist agenda.

    As to Obama's experience of the American racial divide? It's probably more mild than most African Americans have seen, but not an absolute zero. But then, we're always talking about millionaires as "representing" us, so it's a bit of a muddle that way anyway.

    PFnV
  18. Fogbuster

    Fogbuster Rookie

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    Sad but true. How many black players have left Boston/New England because they felt unwanted, uncomfortable? Too many. If it's bad for them, must be ten times worse for an average black joe.

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  19. Real World

    Real World Moderator Staff Member

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    That last paragraph is what I think the sincere were asking. The other crap, about stupid slave owner stuff, is purely political BS that the simpletons of a party would spew. Sadly, it happens far too often, and comes from both sides. IT's why I dislike the extremist/party over principle people. I think it's ok to align yourself with a party's general beliefs, but to sign your life away to them is silly. When you do so, you have people bringing up ridiculous crap like Obama's anscestors.
  20. PatsFanInVa

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    Wow. I think we agree.

    Fugg. Now the moon will turn blood red, dogs will lie down with cats, and Peter Gabriel will play trumpet. Or whatever... I'll check the details on the religion forum...

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