What is Bernard Pollard, an idiot?

[HEY BRO! WHAT UP?]

So does everyone else in the league. Pats fans are the only people who can't seem to admit it.

I agree, it was dirty and uncalled for.

 

[mgcolby]

So does everyone else in the league. Pats fans are the only people who can't seem to admit it.

I can. The ball was out well before Vince left his feet and had no reason to make contact at all. Especially given that 2 1/2 steps prior, any contact on the QB became a late hit.

Player A hits the QB intentionally in the knee with his elbow, well after the ball has been released.

Player B is blocked to the ground and lunges at a QB who still has the ball and simultaniously steps towards the lunging defender in order to deliver the football.

Yet player A is defended, while player B is the anti-christ.

 

[Deus Irae]

I can. The ball was out well before Vince left his feet and had no reason to make contact at all. Especially given that 2 1/2 steps prior, any contact on the QB became a late hit.

Player A hits the QB intentionally in the knee with his elbow, well after the ball has been released.

Player B is blocked to the ground and lunges at a QB who still has the ball and simultaniously steps towards the lunging defender in order to deliver the football.

Yet player A is defended, while player B is the anti-christ.

Player A made a clean play and had a path to the QB, was taken down from behind, and had less than a tenth of a second to react. Player B made a lunge at a knee after being blocked to the ground.

They are different. That's why one is defended and the other is not.

 

[Kontradiction]

Alright, this sounds cheap but the talk of the Wilfork act actually made me go and look at the replay and Deus is right.

YouTube - Wilfork hits Losman, Pats vs Bills

I was going with what I saw when I actually watched the game live when I made my comment that it was dirty. I had never watched the replay again because a knee bending like Losman's does grosses me out. But when you watch the slow motion replay of the hit, you can tell that Vince was tripped from behind and put his arm out to try to break the fall (a normal reaction). I'm going to pull an Arlen Specter here and do the switcharoo.

 

[mgcolby]

Alright, this sounds cheap but the talk of the Wilfork act actually made me go and look at the replay and Deus is right.

YouTube - Wilfork hits Losman, Pats vs Bills

I was going with what I saw when I actually watched the game live when I made my comment that it was dirty. I had never watched the replay again because a knee bending like Losman's does grosses me out. But when you watch the slow motion replay of the hit, you can tell that Vince was tripped from behind and put his arm out to try to break the fall (a normal reaction). I'm going to pull an Arlen Specter here and do the switcharoo.

I just watched it prior to talking about it. I don't see it that way. He seems to over extend to make the contact and it was well after the ball was out of his hands.

 

[mgcolby]

Player A made a clean play and had a path to the QB, was taken down from behind, and had less than a tenth of a second to react. Player B made a lunge at a knee after being blocked to the ground.

They are different. That's why one is defended and the other is not.

No player B made a lunge and the QB stepped up at the same time and the player made contact with the knee. Not to mention the player was being held.

If this was any other QB most folks on here wouldn't think it was dirty.

I honestly cannot see how anyone can watch the Pollard hit and see anything but a guy giving maximum effort. Fighting through a block and ultimately getting to where he needed to be.

I would rather have 11 Pollards than 11 guys that just lay there and quit!

 

[Yehoodi]

Alright, this sounds cheap but the talk of the Wilfork act actually made me go and look at the replay and Deus is right.

YouTube - Wilfork hits Losman, Pats vs Bills

I was going with what I saw when I actually watched the game live when I made my comment that it was dirty. I had never watched the replay again because a knee bending like Losman's does grosses me out. But when you watch the slow motion replay of the hit, you can tell that Vince was tripped from behind and put his arm out to try to break the fall (a normal reaction). I'm going to pull an Arlen Specter here and do the switcharoo.

i am going to have to respectfully disagree . . . as i mentioned in a earlier post players know where there bodies & limbs are going . . . I see ur point but think you got a tough hill to climb to support it . . . for me a natural reaction to brace a fall would be to extend ur hand towards the ground, or failing that, extend your elbow towards the grounds - and if one had to extend the elbow you would do it in such a manner that is not complete 90 degrees (with respect to the side of ur body) but something less than 90 degrees so that when contact is made with the ground ur arm takes the force and is then tuck under the body (and up againsts ur side) as a result of the impact and then ends up in a normal body position (i.e. near ur side); if one extends the elbow beyond 90 degrees, or in vince's case nearly 150-170 degree (and almost parellel to the ground) all that can happen on impact with the ground is ur eblow meeting the top of ur head and ur shoulder would not appreciate that and perhaps get injured. that type of extension is against and human instinct for safey and perhaps then is an intentional act by Vince. i know is a long way to explain my point that Vince's response was not one, IMO, of a reflex action to brace a fall, but an intentional act to extend the elbow to make contact with the QB . . .

 

[Deus Irae]

No player B made a lunge and the QB stepped up at the same time and the player made contact with the knee. Not to mention the player was being held.

If this was any other QB most folks on here wouldn't think it was dirty.

I honestly cannot see how anyone can watch the Pollard hit and see anything but a guy giving maximum effort. Fighting through a block and ultimately getting to where he needed to be.

I would rather have 11 Pollards than 11 guys that just lay there and quit!

Here, focus on the one in the 40-45 second range:

YouTube - Chiefs safety Bernard Pollard Drills Tom Brady's Knee!! Visit: www.mandurahomebiz.com

There's really not much of a question here. He clearly targeted knee height.

Also, regarding the "if it was any other QB" stuff.... Read the following thread and you'll find a pretty even handed discussion of the Pollard hit in comparison to the Wilfork situation:

http://www.patsfans.com/new-england-patriots/messageboard/10/119026-more-you-think-about-see-photos-dirty-hit.html

It's not always about knee jerk homerism, after all.

 

[Kontradiction]

i am going to have to respectfully disagree . . . as i mentioned in a earlier post players know where there bodies & limbs are going . . . I see ur point but think you got a tough hill to climb to support it . . . for me a natural reaction to brace a fall would be to extend ur hand towards the ground, or failing that, extend your elbow towards the grounds - and if one had to extend the elbow you would do it in such a manner that is not complete 90 degrees (with respect to the side of ur body) but something less than 90 degrees so that when contact is made with the ground ur arm takes the force and is then tuck under the body (and up againsts ur side) as a result of the impact and then ends up in a normal body position (i.e. near ur side); if one extends the elbow beyond 90 degrees, or in vince's case nearly 150-170 degree (and almost parellel to the ground) all that can happen on impact with the ground is ur eblow meeting the top of ur head and ur shoulder would not appreciate that and perhaps get injured. that type of extension is against and human instinct for safey and perhaps then is an intentional act by Vince. i know is a long way to explain my point that Vince's response was not one, IMO, of a reflex action to brace a fall, but an intentional act to extend the elbow to make contact with the QB . . .

Wilfork is about 325 pounds and was coming through that whole at full speed before he was tackled from behind. If Losman wasn't there, he would have probably landed in the way which you have described. As it stands, not only was Losman in the way, but Wilfork also had extra weight on top of him when you consider the guy that was doing the tackling (believe it was an OL but can't be sure who).

Besides, at the speed Wilfork was going, it would be hard to put that perfect of a dirty hit on the quarterback. I used to think it was filthy but now that I watch it, it looks like coincidence. Something that is produced due to the size of the person combined with the speed of the game.

 

[SHOWTIME15]

Wilfork is about 325 pounds and was coming through that whole at full speed before he was tackled from behind. If Losman wasn't there, he would have probably landed in the way which you have described. As it stands, not only was Losman in the way, but Wilfork also had extra weight on top of him when you consider the guy that was doing the tackling (believe it was an OL but can't be sure who).

Besides, at the speed Wilfork was going, it would be hard to put that perfect of a dirty hit on the quarterback. I used to think it was filthy but now that I watch it, it looks like coincidence. Something that is produced due to the size of the person combined with the speed of the game.

it looks like wilfork was reaching with his elbow for losman's knee instead of the ground.

 

[Kontradiction]

it looks like wilfork was reaching with his elbow for losman's knee instead of the ground.

Another thing you should look at is that Wilfork's facemask isn't turned in the direction of Losman's knee. He wasn't even looking at him at the time. That, combined with the speed he is going, makes me think it wasn't a cheap shot. A lucky shot, but not a cheap one.

 

[abejarano12]

Wow! what a dumbA** he must really like losing every year

 

[nashvillepatsfan]

No player B made a lunge and the QB stepped up at the same time and the player made contact with the knee. Not to mention the player was being held.

If this was any other QB most folks on here wouldn't think it was dirty.

I honestly cannot see how anyone can watch the Pollard hit and see anything but a guy giving maximum effort. Fighting through a block and ultimately getting to where he needed to be.

I would rather have 11 Pollards than 11 guys that just lay there and quit!

Not that anyone cares what i think, but i blame Brady.

 

[pencilneckgeek]

Another thing you should look at is that Wilfork's facemask isn't turned in the direction of Losman's knee. He wasn't even looking at him at the time. That, combined with the speed he is going, makes me think it wasn't a cheap shot. A lucky shot, but not a cheap one.

He turned his head away after the ball was released, but he was still reaching for Losman not the ground unless Wilfork's plan was to brace his fall with his chest, because he was reaching out horizontally.

You also have to consider the fact that Wilfork has a bit of a history as a dirty player. Heck he went to the University of Miami.

 

[Kontradiction]

He turned his head away after the ball was released, but he was still reaching for Losman not the ground unless Wilfork's plan was to brace his fall with his chest, because he was reaching out horizontally.

You also have to consider the fact that Wilfork has a bit of a history as a dirty player. Heck he went to the University of Miami.

Besides the Losman hit (which is currently up for debate) and the Brandon Jacobs eye poke, what has Wilfork done here or at Miami that can be considered "dirty"?

 

[PatsFanSince74]

I was astounded when I read this story in King's weekly column. I imagine that the Chiefs' players will "self police" this in the locker room with the door closed and that Pollard is on a very short leash and may even be on his way out of town before next season; I don't think that Scott has time for this kind of guy.

As to the hit on Tommy last year, "It happened." Was it a dirty hit under the rules? Brady and the league said it wasn't, so I'll take that (Brady is one of the league's greatest draws, if not its greatest; if the league thought it was dirty they would have said so--this is not a case of the haters winning the day). But the fact that it is now against the rules speaks volumes.

As to the thread's question, I think the answer is pretty clearly, "Yes."

 

[pencilneckgeek]

Besides the Losman hit (which is currently up for debate) and the Brandon Jacobs eye poke, what has Wilfork done here or at Miami that can be considered "dirty"?

What else do you need to see? He's had a few nasty, head-twisting facemasks (e.g., Michael Turner) and late hard hits (Witten, a few QBs, including going out of his way to hit Jay Cutler after the play away from the ball). The eye poke and the Losman hit were simply the most blatant of a series of plays that have gotten him fined a half-dozen times. Don't get me wrong. There are fines handed out that make me scratch my head, but Wilfork seems to earn his. I'm enough of a homer to overlook this sort of stuff (never could figure out how Rodney got labelled dirty), but between Wilfork's actions and UM pedigree, I'm not inclined to give him the benefit of the doubt.