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What impact will Seymour's '08 performace have on his remaining career in NE?

Discussion in 'PatsFans.com - Patriots Fan Forum' started by sebman2112, Apr 16, 2008.

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  1. sebman2112

    sebman2112 In the Starting Line-Up

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    When healthy, Richard Seymour has been one of the best D-linemen in the NFL, and a huge factor in NE's past success. Over the past few seasons Richard has flashed signs of continued dominance, but he's also fought through various injuries that have effected his ability to get on the football field, and play at a high level.

    Here are my questions, and I'll give a few possible outcomes to his '08 campaign, to see where the board stands. I'm also going to throw in my own opinion on each possibility.

    If Seymour struggles through injuries during the 2008 season, and plays at a decent level when on the field, but not a dominant level, what effect would that have on his future in NE?

    My opinion: Restructuring his contract would seem like a good idea, but I'm not sure Seymour would be willing to take a team friendly restructure, so he might end up on the trading/chopping block prior to the '09 season.

    What if Seymour is able to stay healthy this season, and plays at the dominate level we became used to in prior seasons?

    My opinion: His $9.7M '09 cap hit becomes a little easier to swallow, and maybe the Patriots would try to work something out to keep him around a few more years, while slightly lowering that '09 cap hit.

    The other question is, if Seymour does play at a high level the next season plus, would he resign with NE before he's actually scheduled to become a free agent, or would he want to test the market? Also, would Seymour hold out, if the Patriots franchised him in 2010?

    My opinion: Richard wouldn't resign before he's actually scheduled to hit free agency, as he'll want to cash in one last time. I also think he would hold out if the Patriots were to franchise him. this all hinges on his being healthy and playing at a high level going forward though, since I don't think the Patriots would resign or franchise him, if he continues to have injury issues. Wilfork might be a better candidate for the tag, but I hope the Patriots can resign him before he's actually scheduled to hit free agency.
     
    Last edited: Apr 16, 2008
  2. JoePats

    JoePats In the Starting Line-Up

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    Part 1 I agree. Besides him being hurt all year this would accelearate his departure. Also if he shows flashes here and there but was injured and mostly above-average but not Pro Bowl, I could see him wanting to a bigger contract then the Pats would offer, based on the annual hope that he'll stay healthy.

    Part 2 Agree. Unless there's a team that offers a bounty in the trade market and the Pats still think he is an injury risk. This would come with an extension for Jarvis Green. It also depends on what happens next weekend.

    Part 3 There's no way he would sign before he hits free agency. I could see him getting cut under this situation. The Pats would definately franchise Big Vince over Seymour IMO, but hopefully it doesn't come to that.
     
  3. Jimke

    Jimke In the Starting Line-Up

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    I expect Seymour to hold out next year unless the Patriots agree

    not to franchise him.
     
  4. MoLewisrocks

    MoLewisrocks PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Seymour and Wilfork are why I hope they get an extension done with Brady THIS season. The organization doesn't like to be on the hook for more than 1-2 top level bonus/guarantee deals in any given period. So it will likely be Brady and one of Wilfork/Seymour with the other either traded in 2009 or tagged and likely traded in 2010. I don't see Seymour being cut unless he's not worth a day 1 draft pick in trade...

    Of course the monkeywrench in all of this is the CBA and the opt out and whether or not there is NFL football as we know it come 2010. Teams are going to be less willing to commit to big bonus money going forward if the owners do opt out in November. Which is in some ways a poison pill that the union should see as motivation to reach some sort of meeting of the minds to avoid a looming work stoppage. Being a FA even IN 2009 could prove to be a rude awakening unless you want to play that season maybe with a Redskins team pulling out all the stops in anticipation of a 2010 work stoppage...as owners are going to begin to belt tighten for the worst case financial scenario.
     
  5. PATRIOTSFANINPA

    PATRIOTSFANINPA Pro Bowl Player

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    If Seymour goes through more injuries and becomes MIA again in 2008 theres no reason to worry about extending him as another injury filled and subpar year will not make me kept awake worrying about whether he will return in 2009.

    Anything less than a good performance this year from Sey would probably mean his end of his career here in NE unless he takes a sharp drop in money.
     
  6. Spiral

    Spiral PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    I see a highly-paid veteran who either has lost his motivation to be great, or has a career-limiting knee injury (or injuries). In the recent PFW article, he refers to the knee injury that happend when he was playing FB. That was 2005. The other knee injury that I recall was from Mawai back in '04. I don't think he's ever going to be the player he was.

    I hope he proves me wrong, but I don't see the Patriots keeping him in 2009.
     
  7. KontradictioN

    KontradictioN Do you even lift? PatsFans.com Supporter

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    No Jersey Selected

    I really hate to say this, but I think he'll be gone after 2008. I can't see him returning to the dominant level he was once at (even that Sey at an injured level still needs to be accounted for... that's how good he is). And I can't see the Pats sinking any more dollars into him if he gets injured again this year. It's a shame and I love Sey, but I can't see him in a Pats uniform in 2009. :(
     
  8. Ochmed Jones

    Ochmed Jones Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract

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    I think it is either Wilfork or Seymour for 2009, and based on his declinging play and injury history, I can not see Seymour with us after this year.
     
    Last edited: Apr 16, 2008
  9. BradyManny

    BradyManny Veteran Starter w/Big Long Term Deal

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    I think all of your answers are spot on here. To me, the above is the most important question though. In an ideal world, Seymour goes out and earns that contract and makes everything else a non-issue.
    Seymour himself has stated that missing so much of last season was a huge factor, hopefully full offseason and TC will bring him back to his previous level of effectiveness.
     
  10. BradyManny

    BradyManny Veteran Starter w/Big Long Term Deal

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    I really don't see a scenario in which Tom Brady is not a member of the New England Patriots. He wants to be here, we want him here, it'll get done. I agree, the sooner the better. But Brady's already proven he's not a guy who is concerned about being the highest paid at his position, he's also proven he will put the team in front of money. He's also made enough money for life, and to add to that, he's currently dating a woman making $30 mill a year. I'm not saying Brady will play for peanuts, but I do think he will take considerably less if it means retaining Wilfork AND Seymour, for instance.
     
  11. jeffbiologist

    jeffbiologist Rotational Player and Threatening Starter's Job

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    There are several factors that just cant be seen now. The CBA is first and foremost, there is the draft(cant cut him unless we have a replacement with at least a year of experience), there is the franchise tag, and there is health....
    I think the CBA will be extended, no uncapped year. This keeps the rest of the options open.
    We could very easily pick up Ellis in the draft and that would cover us in several aspects....
    I think that drafting and grooming a guy like Ellis will force one of them(Vince or Sey) to take a discount or be franchised...Brady wont have to be franchised...
    Health is always a concern, but Sey has no excuses this year like he has the last couple. Remember we kept Ty Law on for $10M and he barely played....we still won the super bowl!
    What is clear is that DL is maybe the 2nd most important position on the team. Guys like Watson, Mankins and Maroney will ALL be gone unless they take hometown discounts. Drafting their backups this year should be a priority too. If I had to guess....I would extend Vince, draft a guy, hope for the CBA and if necessary franchise Sey.
     
  12. castlelong1

    castlelong1 Banned

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    Seymor's contract hit would put too much dead money on the cap. For good or bad he serves his contract with the team.

    Of course that all depends on the CBA, etc. Oh, duh, 2009. My bad.
     
    Last edited: Apr 17, 2008
  13. MoLewisrocks

    MoLewisrocks PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Seymour's dead cap in 2009 would be $6M (and a $3.79M cap savings) on a $120M+ or so cap. To put that in perspective, in 2002 Drew Bledsoe's dead cap was $6.67M on a $71M cap and yet we moved him. So dead cap won't be an issue if they decide to part company. If he's not performing like a $10M DE, or if they believe they cannot get him extended in a deal that represents value and he has first round trade value he will be gone either in a 2009 trade or more likely as a tag and trade in 2010. He's not a player who would play through a tag. He's also not a player who would actually give back money (restructure that last year to lower cap) particularly given his deal wasn't backloaded with salary - he got most of it up front in signing and option bonus in 2006-2007.

    Hopefully he will finally fully rebound, but it's something we will have to wait to see.
     
    Last edited: Apr 17, 2008
  14. patsfaninpittsburgh

    patsfaninpittsburgh Banned

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    Even with a good 2008, it's tough to see an eye popping extension. If the Pats draft Ellis, I would say that it's a good bet they don't see Seymour long term. Personally, I would keep Vince anyways.

    Also, at this point, does Sey become a 4-3 type guy?

    The other point is that since the Pats always contend, players are on an accelerated career path. TB has already played an extra season of football due to all the playoff games. One has to wonder if the 10-12 year career concept works with the Pats.
     
  15. BionicPatriot

    BionicPatriot In the Starting Line-Up

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    The only way Seymour pushes for ANYTHING at all at this point is if he goes out and has a dominating season. I can't believe people question who the Pats will re-sign in 09. Obviously Wilfork. He's the NT of our 3-4, very young and DURABLE. Seymour better have two good years before he demands crap. I really hope he doesn't have one great season then tries to demand the roof.

    Plain and simple, this is a make or break year for Seymour. I think he's gonna deliver though, players always do with the money.
     
  16. Relentless649

    Relentless649 On the Roster

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    That man's coming off an injury, a significant injury, not turf toe or something like that. Give him a break, he'll be back next season to his pro bowl caliber form.
     
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