What if Dez Bryant slides to twenty-two?

[upstater1]

I'd like to see who you are counting as a bust because I just looked through the drafts since 2002 (not including last year's draft for obvious reasons) and I came up with very different numbers.

9 starters, 9 busts, 6 middling

Busts

Stallworth
Lelie
Rogers
Reg Williams
Woods
Clayton (80 receptions first year and then blotto)
Edwards
Williamson
M Jones

Starters

J Walker
A Johnson
Fitzgerald
Evans
White
Holmes
Cal Johnson
Bowe
Meacham


Middling

B Johnson
Roy Williams (maybe a bust because picked so high, but he did nab his team a 1st rounder)
Jenkins
Mark Clayton
Ginn
Gonzalez

 

[HarkDawg]

how is Stallworth a bust?


edit- Pats will not take a WR at 22. 98% certain of this (no way)

 

[FoxboroFlyer]

I'd like to see who you are counting as a bust because I just looked through the drafts since 2002 (not including last year's draft for obvious reasons) and I came up with very different numbers.

9 starters, 9 busts, 6 middling

Busts

Stallworth
Lelie
Rogers
Reg Williams
Woods
Clayton (80 receptions first year and then blotto)
Edwards
Williamson
M Jones

Starters

J Walker
A Johnson
Fitzgerald
Evans
White
Holmes
Cal Johnson
Bowe
Meacham


Middling

B Johnson
Roy Williams (maybe a bust because picked so high, but he did nab his team a 1st rounder)
Jenkins
Mark Clayton
Ginn
Gonzalez

To be honest I didn't do the research. I got my info. from an article posted on niners nation. They didn't give names just #'s. But in all fairness I still only see 4 non-bust 1st rounders on that list. IMO if you're spending a 1st on a WR they are drafted to be ELITE not above avg.

C. Johnson
A. Johnson
R. White
L. Fitzgerald

 

[Nonentity]

To be honest I didn't do the research. I got my info. from an article posted on niners nation. They didn't give names just #'s. But in all fairness I still only see 4 non-bust 1st rounders on that list. IMO if you're spending a 1st on a WR they are drafted to be ELITE not above avg.

C. Johnson
A. Johnson
R. White
L. Fitzgerald

No, that's not fair. If you draft a WR in the top 10 then you should expect them to be elite, but there's never the depth in the 1st round to make everyone there elite. The best player at a position isn't necessarily elite.

I like upstater1's list, I might swap Ted Ginn and Braylon Edwards but that's about it.

 

[FoxboroFlyer]

No, that's not fair. If you draft a WR in the top 10 then you should expect them to be elite, but there's never the depth in the 1st round to make everyone there elite. The best player at a position isn't necessarily elite.

I like upstater1's list, I might swap Ted Ginn and Braylon Edwards but that's about it.

To each their own, but you can find the same talent, and better than those players in rounds 2 through 7.
To name a few off the top my head G. Jennings in the 2nd, Marshall in the 4th, Colston in the 7th they all say hi! I'm sure I could find plenty more that I would much rather have than your list of 1st rounders there, with the exception of the 4 I listed.

 

[upstater1]

To each their own, but you can find the same talent, and better than those players in rounds 2 through 7.
To name a few off the top my head G. Jennings in the 2nd, Marshall in the 4th, Colston in the 7th they all say hi! I'm sure I could find plenty more that I would much rather have than your list of 1st rounders there, with the exception of the 4 I listed.

Except the bust rate in the lower rounds is much higher, as it should be.

I mean, Chad Jackson, Bethel Johnson ring a bell?

You're actually calling all these players busts:

Javon Walker, Lee Evans, Santonio Holmes, Dwayne Bowe, Robert Meacham

These are all good players when they're healthy.

 

[FoxboroFlyer]

Except the bust rate in the lower rounds is much higher, as it should be.

I mean, Chad Jackson, Bethel Johnson ring a bell?

Deion Brach, and Givens ring a bell? My point is the risk is less later considering the success rate in general from 1st to 7th round.
oops, I almost forgot Edelman.

 

[FoxboroFlyer]

Except the bust rate in the lower rounds is much higher, as it should be.

I mean, Chad Jackson, Bethel Johnson ring a bell?

You're actually calling all these players busts:

Javon Walker, Lee Evans, Santonio Holmes, Dwayne Bowe, Robert Meacham

These are all good players when they're healthy.

They're above avg. Would you give up a 1st rounder for any of these players today? I certainly wouldn't

 

[FoxboroFlyer]

I guess the criteria I'm using to determine if a 1st round WR is a bust would logically be would I be willing to give up a 1st rounder today for that player, and the answer is no to everyone on that list except the 4 I mentioned. Like I said it's all about value, and to me those players are poor 1st round value.

 

[TriplecHamp]

Yup! To heck with Bryant; he has a very high bust potential. The Patriots have to take a pass rusher (or maybe a CB is someone special is on the board).

Every Pass rusher projected to go in the first round has very high bust potential because you dont know how they will do in the 3-4. Well except Sergio Kindle whos played standing up before.

 

[ctpatsfan77]

I guess the criteria I'm using to determine if a 1st round WR is a bust would logically be would I be willing to give up a 1st rounder today for that player, and the answer is no to everyone on that list except the 4 I mentioned. Like I said it's all about value, and to me those players are poor 1st round value.

By that logic, Randy Moss would be a bust.

 

[FoxboroFlyer]

By that logic, Randy Moss would be a bust.

Ok let me rephrase that. Would you be willing to give up a 1st for these players 3 or 4 years into their career? Better?

 

[upstater1]

They're above avg. Would you give up a 1st rounder for any of these players today? I certainly wouldn't

For Dwayne Bowe? At his salary? Yes.

But the other guys are older than your 3rd year criteria. I mean, Lee Evans panned out for the Bills, but he's getting on in years. That doesn't mean he wasn't a good pick when he was younger, so he's no longer worth a 1st rounder, but he was certainly a good pick in his prime.

Meacham was picked at the end of the first round. He had a lot of TDs last year.

 

[FoxboroFlyer]

I in no way want them to select a WR in the 1st reguardless of who is there at 22, but if they do I hope it's Tate. He's very smart, versatile, and comes from the most nfl ready offense.
In all reality we all know Bryant will not even be there. Someone will move ahead of us if he is still there at picks 15-21.

 

[FoxboroFlyer]

For Dwayne Bowe? At his salary? Yes.

But the other guys are older than your 3rd year criteria. I mean, Lee Evans panned out for the Bills, but he's getting on in years. That doesn't mean he wasn't a good pick when he was younger, so he's no longer worth a 1st rounder, but he was certainly a good pick in his prime.

Meacham was picked at the end of the first round. He had a lot of TDs last year.

I also realize that alot of these guys were just victims of the teams that selected them. We'll never truly know what they could have done in an offense with a real QB. Victims of circumstance.
I say do away with the draft, and make them all free agents! Imagine that.

 

[crowell33]

no. 10 char.

 

[furley]

You don't want to have to feel as if you distrust him if you're Kraft, Belichick and staff. Will he be a responsible person off the field. That is, if football helps to maintain a certain level of focus for him. What then when he's away from football?

In recent years, New England did draft players who'd "questionable characters" and publicized incidents prior to their selection. For example, Christian Peter and Brandon Meriweather.

Why did he not tell NCAA investigators last fall of his meeting in the home of Deion Sanders? Why did he lie about it to investigators when asked on two separate occasions? It cost Bryant his final nine Oklahoma State games, since the NCAA suspended him for "unethical conduct." For lying about a visit that was actually perfectly legal.

Why lie?

So, the combine question was not the player -- it was the young man.

Honest enough? Driven enough? Smart enough? Mature enough? A high draft pick you can depend on to keep himself out of big troubles?

"He seemed like a good guy to us," said one NFL scout, who was present when his team interviewed Bryant at the combine. "But the background overall, you really have to examine. It's scary. The family situation was a disaster. The academic background is highly questionable. If you were going to draft him, you would really have to do due diligence. This was critical for him to be here, to shake hands and meet people. He needed to sell himself. The football part? Tremendous ability. Tops in all areas as a receiver."

The scout was asked, all things considered, if he thinks Bryant will remain a top-10 pick?

"Yes," he answered. "But the team that drafts him has to be smart. They must realize he needs to be monitored. Like I said, he comes from a scary situation."

"He is someone I had grown to care a great deal about, who I recruited and saw all the homes he was staying in and sat on the couches he slept on and walked the floors of other places where he had slept," Brewer said. "I knew of the classes he had to re-take in high school and how hard he worked to become eligible for college. And the one thing he had motivating him to do all of those things was football. For this young man, the football field a while ago became his workplace, his comfort zone. Football for him, when everything was going wrong, would make it right.

"He can do anything he sets his mind to do on the next level. I had the opportunity to coach Randy Moss in college. Same thing with him: The football field was his workplace, his comfort zone. Dez is a different element when he is there. He sets himself apart. He has hands like a waffle iron. He comes across the middle and breaks tackles. He can return punts and kickoffs. He gives you great value in that he can play more than one receiving position."

Brewer agrees with other NFL experts: Draft Dez Bryant and invest in the person as much as in the player. Give him guidance, said Brewer, and also remember that he is exiting college as a junior.

And Bryant said he will do the rest.

The Interrogation of Dez Bryant -- NFL FanHouse

 

[FoxboroFlyer]

:rocker::rocker::rocker:
:agree:

 

[FoxboroFlyer]

no. 10 char.

:singing::rocker::singing::rocker:
:agree:

 

[FoxboroFlyer]

Both of my responses are in reference to Crowell33's comments. I'm just a little "to slow" to be able to determine what the hell I'm doing:singing: