What do you think is holding up the Welker signing?

[Ivan]

The real problem is Brady, he simply doesn't have the arm Jay Cutler has, and he's limiting the offense because Cutler could really stretch the field. Trade Brady for Cutler and let Welker go and bring in Chad Jackson and Mike Williams, that would be awesome.

 

[eom]

lol madden!!!!!!!!

 

[MoLewisrocks]

I think it's way too early to be worried about this. For all we know, Welker could be on vacation with his new fiancee, trying to forget about how the season ended. Or visiting family, or doing any number of other things that take him out of Foxboro. Perhaps his agent is actively negotiating the deal on his behalf, and they are just doing a great job of keeping it under wraps. As other posters have pointed out, no other teams have signed their key free agents this offseason.

If it gets to be early March and we still haven't heard anything, then I'll get nervous. For now, let's just all acknowledge that we are desperate for some positive Pats news. Relax.

Vince's deal was done about a week after he was tagged. All doom and gloom prior to that. Mankins got tagged and reported once the lockout was over and voila, his deal was done. Again, all doom and gloom prior to that. This is the ADHD age in sports fandom and media.

The staff wrapped up their exit interviews last Thursday and were off thru yesterday. They had yet to complete their post season roster evaluations or even begin to address free agents per Jonathan on Friday. That all starts this week. And of course it will be inturrupted by the combine next week. Because we were in the Super Bowl our staff was stretched a little thin over the last couple of weeks and our contracts guy (Reese) was out scouting the Senior Bowl with college scouting staff so Bill and the coaches and Caserio could remain focused on the task at hand.

 

[Ivan]

I don't agree but we could go around in circles all day long with this!

I do think it's a tad unfair to label people who don't think with the grain as 'morons' or 'fantasy football GM's and Maddenites' though...I've seen a few arguments for moving on from Welker and the logic is there IMO...just like there is logic with your argument also.

It's an interesting debate Don't start labeling people because you think you're right and you don;'t agree with the other perception.

I don't label people as morons because they disagree, I label people who have been proven wrong over and over and over again but keep repeating the same arguments as morons because they refuse to acknowledge reality and insist they are right though they have been proven wrong to a degree that is absolute. This is why I brought up Brady and Bledsoe, those who kept saying that they should have kept Bledsoe eventually had to shut up and imo that's exactly what those saying they should get rid of Welker should do. Welker showed yet again just how good he is this year, and his doubters have been proven 100% wrong, they should acknowledge that instead of continuing to insist otherwise.


It's nothing personal to those saying they should let Welker go because i think anyone who says that is an idiot, and i could care less if it's my best friend or someone who i don't like.

 

[MoLewisrocks]

The real problem is Brady, he simply doesn't have the arm Jay Cutler has, and he's limiting the offense because Cutler could really stretch the field. Trade Brady for Cutler and let Welker go and bring in Chad Jackson and Mike Williams, that would be awesome.

Don't be surprised if you get a lot of likes from people with no sarcasm detector.

 

[Ivan]

Don't be surprised if you get a lot of likes from people with no sarcasm detector.

Sometimes i just can't help myself, there are some fans who simply refuse to acknowledge reality and insist over and over that the measurables or fantasy numbers etc... are what really matters. people like this would say over and over and over that Danny Woodhead simply can't play football because he's too small, and no amount of prooff otherwise would ever sway them. he would always need to be replaced because he's too small, and relaity would never stop them from insisting otherwise. That is what is going on here with Welker, he's 5'10 isa all that matters, and Garcon is taller, that's what really matters, screw production Garcon is unstoppable in Madden, that's what really matters.......


I'm sorry, but people like that are braindead and I have no polite way of saying that.

 

[UK_Pat37]

Sometimes i just can't help myself, there are some fans who simply refuse to acknowledge reality and insist over and over that the measurables or fantasy numbers etc... are what really matters. people like this would say over and over and over that Danny Woodhead simply can't play football because he's too small, and no amount of prooff otherwise would ever sway them. he would always need to be replaced because he's too small, and relaity would never stop them from insisting otherwise. That is what is going on here with Welker, he's 5'10 isa all that matters, and Garcon is taller, that's what really matters, screw production Garcon is unstoppable in Madden, that's what really matters.......


I'm sorry, but people like that are braindead and I have no polite way of saying that.

Okayyyyyyyyyy.

You're not someone people can debate with clearly...no need to rant on any more

 

[MoLewisrocks]

Okayyyyyyyyyy.

You're not someone people can debate with clearly...no need to rant on any more

Some things just aren't clearly debatable. Attempting to intelligently debate those with people who don't grasp that is just wasted time and energy.

 

[UK_Pat37]

Some things just aren't clearly debatable. Attempting to intelligently debate those with people who don't grasp that is just wasted time and energy.

That's your opinion.

 

[Deus Irae]

He's a 5'10" 185 lbs slot receiver lining up at split end.... what part of that isn't occasionally limiting?

I'm not saying he does all the time, but when you match him up against a big, physicaly corner and they clog the middle, we're done for. Welker can't stretch the field!

My argument is the Pats could get enough production over the middle, get what they can for him and just make some move for someone like Meachem. Lloyd, Wayne and a rookie. We could actually improve our offense.

I'm not insane...just looking at it in a different light It would be dull if everyone said 'oooo but we love Wes so he has to stay'...there are both pros an cons to both keeping him on the field and in terms of economics imo.

Welker isn't limiting the offense at all. What's limiting the offense is that Moss is gone, and his replacements (Aiken/Tate/Johnson) have stunk. Wes Welker is the most productive slot man in the history of the NFL. Getting rid of him would for the likes of Meachem or Wayne would, despite your insistence to the contrary, be insane.

 

[ivanvamp]

Welker isn't limiting the offense at all. What's limiting the offense is that Moss is gone, and his replacements (Aiken/Tate/Johnson) have stunk. Wes Welker is the most productive slot man in the history of the NFL. Getting rid of him would for the likes of Meachem or Wayne would, despite your insistence to the contrary, be insane.

Wes Welker does some things better than any other receiver in football right now. He's well worth keeping (obviously depending on the price...he's not worth keeping at $15 million a year), and I'd very much prefer if he stayed with New England.

However, this would still be a dynamic offense if they let Welker go and instead brought in Wayne and Lloyd. They'd still have tons of excellent receiving options. The offense would look a little different, but that's ok.

My preference, of course, is to keep Welker and bring in another really good receiver like Lloyd or Meacham or Wayne. I think Lloyd makes the most sense for a number of reasons. But have that twosome at WR, with Gronk/Hernandez, keep Branch as the 3rd WR, and then go crazy with the defense.

 

[Elijah T.]

Sometimes i just can't help myself, there are some fans who simply refuse to acknowledge reality and insist over and over that the measurables or fantasy numbers etc... are what really matters. people like this would say over and over and over that Danny Woodhead simply can't play football because he's too small, and no amount of prooff otherwise would ever sway them. he would always need to be replaced because he's too small, and relaity would never stop them from insisting otherwise. That is what is going on here with Welker, he's 5'10 isa all that matters, and Garcon is taller, that's what really matters, screw production Garcon is unstoppable in Madden, that's what really matters.......


I'm sorry, but people like that are braindead and I have no polite way of saying that.

Are you having a bad day??

There's a legit argument to be made that it isn't fiscally sound to commit 9 million per year to a slot receiver who is 31 years old and two years removed from reconstrucive knee surgery.

I mean, we have two pretty good seam, shallow, and intermediate threats in Gronkowski and Hernandez, don't we????

What is Welker doing that they aren't?

When have you seen Welker run the deep half of a route tree, the deep out, deep comeback, deep post, or the go route? When has Welker seperated from press-man or when has he forced a secondary to extend to the perimeter of the field??? I can't remember the last time Welker made a catch outside the numbers.

These are questions all personnel evaluators will ask about Welker in regard to his value.

I'm sure everyone here likes Welker, but he isn't irreplaceable...

It wouldn't bother me to see the FO take Welker's 9million and spread it out to Marques Colston, re-sign Branch (put him in slot) and pay out a couple extra million to get Brandon Lloyd in here.

I like Welker, would love to see him stay, but wouldn't be surprised or upset if hey went a different direction.

 

[UK_Pat37]

Welker isn't limiting the offense at all. What's limiting the offense is that Moss is gone, and his replacements (Aiken/Tate/Johnson) have stunk. Wes Welker is the most productive slot man in the history of the NFL. Getting rid of him would for the likes of Meachem or Wayne would, despite your insistence to the contrary, be insane.

Again, you're not understanding what I've been saying. Welker's a slot receiver yes..who's lining up more than he should be as a split end. Welker hasn't got the frame or speed to play split end, yet he lines out wide for much of the game matched up on bigger, more physical corners.

When we play aggressive and better defenses, this hurts us.

Now when you talk about replacing his production you look at who lines up in the slot and can the production over the middle be replaced or sustained? Well we have Gronkowski, Hernandez (and I do think Edelman could do a job for us when asked).....if you resign Branch as your veteran with experience and bring in a player that is a more legit down the field threat, then I think our offense would be absolutely fine.

The team's issue is all we have is the middle of the field! In that way, Welker's inability to go wide and play as a traditional split end isn't highlighted enough.

 

[Deus Irae]

Again, you're not understanding what I've been saying. Welker's a slot receiver yes..who's lining up more than he should be as a split end. Welker hasn't got the frame or speed to play split end, yet he lines out wide for much of the game matched up on bigger, more physical corners.

When we play aggressive and better defenses, this hurts us.

Now when you talk about replacing his production you look at who lines up in the slot and can the production over the middle be replaced or sustained? Well we have Gronkowski, Hernandez (and I do think Edelman could do a job for us when asked).....if you resign Branch as your veteran with experience and bring in a player that is a more legit down the field threat, then I think our offense would be absolutely fine.

The team's issue is all we have is the middle of the field! In that way, Welker's inability to go wide and play as a traditional split end isn't highlighted enough.

I fully understand what you're saying. It's just not a good argument on your part.

 

[eom]

Are you having a bad day??

There's a legit argument to be made that it isn't fiscally sound to commit 9 million per year to a slot receiver who is 31 years old and two years removed from reconstrucive knee surgery.

I mean, we have two pretty good seam, shallow, and intermediate threats in Gronkowski and Hernandez, don't we????

What is Welker doing that they aren't?

catching 120 balls for 1500 yards.

 

[Ivan]

Are you having a bad day??

There's a legit argument to be made that it isn't fiscally sound to commit 9 million per year to a slot receiver who is 31 years old and two years removed from reconstrucive knee surgery.

I mean, we have two pretty good seam, shallow, and intermediate threats in Gronkowski and Hernandez, don't we????

What is Welker doing that they aren't?

When have you seen Welker run the deep half of a route tree, the deep out, deep comeback, deep post, or the go route? When has Welker seperated from press-man or when has he forced a secondary to extend to the perimeter of the field??? I can't remember the last time Welker made a catch outside the numbers.

These are questions all personnel evaluators will ask about Welker in regard to his value.

I'm sure everyone here likes Welker, but he isn't irreplaceable...

It wouldn't bother me to see the FO take Welker's 9million and spread it out to Marques Colston, re-sign Branch (put him in slot) and pay out a couple extra million to get Brandon Lloyd in here.

I like Welker, would love to see him stay, but wouldn't be surprised or upset if hey went a different direction.

Not a bad day at all, just sick and tired of the same worn out arguments that have been proven wron g repeatedly but keep getting trotted out, just like the one you just made. to put it simply you guys don't know what you are talking about and Welker has proven that beyond any doubt.

You know what would be awesome, replace Brady with Cutler, he has a big arm, and bring back Chad Jackson on the cheap, he can stretch the field..................


Arguing with you guys about this is like arguing with Jet fanss who insist they are the better team regardless of the facts. Reality has no bearing to them, just has it is meaningless to you, all that matters is fantasy numbers and Madden, the reality is irrelevant.

 

[Elijah T.]

catching 120 balls for 1500 yards.

Welker is a talented player...no doubt.

But those numbers could easily be replaced by Branch, Gronkowski, Hernandez in the middle of the field.

The design of the system allowed Welker or Hernandez or Gronk (one of them) to be open on picks, rubs, seams, and crossing routes 15 yards inside the numbers.

The system and Brady's accuracy has much to do with Welker's numbers.

 

[Ivan]

catching 120 balls for 1500 yards.

Chad Jackson could catch 200 balls for 2500 yards, he can stretch the field and isn't 5'10

 

[Elijah T.]

Not a bad day at all, just sick and tired of the same worn out arguments that have been proven wron g repeatedly but keep getting trotted out, just like the one you just made. to put it simply you guys don't know what you are talking about and Welker has proven that beyond any doubt.

You know what would be awesome, replace Brady with Cutler, he has a big arm, and bring back Chad Jackson on the cheap, he can stretch the field..................


Arguing with you guys about this is like arguing with Jet fanss who insist they are the better team regardless of the facts. Reality has no bearing to them, just has it is meaningless to you, all that matters is fantasy numbers and Madden, the reality is irrelevant.

Ok sure...

I think you're the one who plays Madden, bro.

My arguments are legit...When has Welker run any routes that threaten the deep half of the field???

You pay wide receivers big money to play WIDE RECEIVER NOT INSIDE RECEIVER.

 

[PatsFan2]

Are you having a bad day??

There's a legit argument to be made that it isn't fiscally sound to commit 9 million per year to a slot receiver who is 31 years old and two years removed from reconstrucive knee surgery.

I mean, we have two pretty good seam, shallow, and intermediate threats in Gronkowski and Hernandez, don't we????

What is Welker doing that they aren't?

When have you seen Welker run the deep half of a route tree, the deep out, deep comeback, deep post, or the go route? When has Welker seperated from press-man or when has he forced a secondary to extend to the perimeter of the field??? I can't remember the last time Welker made a catch outside the numbers.

These are questions all personnel evaluators will ask about Welker in regard to his value.

I'm sure everyone here likes Welker, but he isn't irreplaceable...

It wouldn't bother me to see the FO take Welker's 9million and spread it out to Marques Colston, re-sign Branch (put him in slot) and pay out a couple extra million to get Brandon Lloyd in here.

I like Welker, would love to see him stay, but wouldn't be surprised or upset if hey went a different direction.

Couldn't have said it any better myself, i have seen people of this very board moved on before after the departure of some players who some feel were Irreplaceable...Welker is no different imo.