What are Jets Players & Fans so Angry About?

[zoostation]

No, it's either/or. Some fans of either team talk **** back and forth. Many of us don't care one way or the other. Personally I don't care - I just appreciated what they did in 2007.

of course you do.....

what part did you like best.... the blatant holding..... the in QB the grasp..... the off balance heave to nowhere....or the helmet catch?

 

[zoostation]

The Patriots dominance has simply gone on for far too long

....get used to it.... have you heard about our draft picks for next season?

 

[BmoreOrioleJet]

I'm curious what specifically you are referring to. Somebody ran some smack on an espn of PFT comment section? Guess what, fans of all 32 teams do that. And those that comment on places like that represent about 0.00001% of their team's fan bases. Even the people that comment here or call a radio station only represent about the same percentage.

One or two people getting caught up in the excitement of a win do not represent an entire fan base of any team.

I think perhaps the bolded portion above has more to do with it than you care to admit right now. As for the classy and arrogance part of your comment, how can a Jet fan point their finger at anyone else after the way your team has talked off the field ever since the day Ryan was named coach? Did it ever occur to you that some of the comments you may hear or read are in response to what people like Ryan and some of the players - and Jet fans - say?

There are plenty of reasons that the Jets could win Sunday. However that doesn't mean I or other Pats fans think the Jets will win Sunday. To me that's not arrogance; it's rational perspective on the situation that results in cautious optimism.

I can understand that you're tired of hearing the media talk about the Patriots. If I heard the media talk about a division rival more often year after year than the team I rooted for it would probably irk me too. But let's be honest here; they talk just as much about the Jets the last two years. I think you just notice them talking about the Pats more because the teams are in the same division.

I agree with some points of this passage, but not in its entirety.

Once again I cannot speak for other Jets fans, but I am not nearly as confident as Rex. After years of torture, I have been conditioned to expect the worse and hope for the best.

Truthfully I expect the Jets to get destroyed on Sunday. There has been nothing in the teams history to make me feel confident in their performance.

You are correct when you say it's mostly jealousy, however can you deny that Patriots fans have developed a sense of entitlement??

I have never seen a fan base (media included) give less credit to the opposition than the folks in New England. The sentiment around the team is that they are unbeatable, and the only way they can lose is if they beat themselves.

The fact is the Patriots have not won a championship in four seasons. Yes this fails in comparison to the Jets (40 years and counting) however there is no reason why you guys can't come back down to earth.

From my observation the Patriots over the last five seasons are nothing like the dynasty teams. These teams are "Colts esque'" in that they aren't really physical, and rely heavily on the passing game. This is always dangerous come playoff times, because if the passing game doesn't click one of these games against a good D the Patriots will be in trouble.

 

[NY10JETS28]

of course you do.....

what part did you like best.... the blatant holding..... the in QB the grasp..... the off balance heave to nowhere....or the helmet catch?

for me, i narrowed it down to the QB grasp or helmet catch..but helmet catch takes the cake

 

[Kontradiction]

I can't speak for anyone other than myself, but FOR ME it's a combination of jealousy, and the arrogance of Pats fans.

The Patriots dominance has simply gone on for far too long, and Pats fans have been anything but classy along the way. You guys are severely lacking in perspective.

Awesome. We're so happy that you registered at our forum to tell us about that.

 

[BigEZPatsFan76]

The Patriots dominance has simply gone on for far too long, and Pats fans have been anything but classy along the way. You guys are severely lacking in perspective.

Now that's f'ing rich !!! Talking about Pats' fans class. Have you gotten a good look or listen to that bag of wind coach of yours as of late, or your "star" defensive back the last 48 hours or so? Again, I will say it, the Jets remind me of the "school yard bully", who taunts everyone around them, then when some one finally punches them square in the face, and bloodies their nose, they run home to Momma. And as far the Pats domination going on too long, well why don't the Jets try to get their in place hack, that so called commissioner up there in New York to try to contrive some new reason(s) to take away another draft choice or two from us, like with that silly spy gate thing. Oh wait, that did not work out too well last time, because we're still here !!!!



EZ76

 

[Ron Sellers]

I agree with some points of this passage, but not in its entirety.

Once again I cannot speak for other Jets fans, but I am not nearly as confident as Rex. After years of torture, I have been conditioned to expect the worse and hope for the best.

Truthfully I expect the Jets to get destroyed on Sunday. There has been nothing in the teams history to make me feel confident in their performance.

You are correct when you say it's mostly jealousy, however can you deny that Patriots fans have developed a sense of entitlement??

Some have, yes.

No different than what one read or heard from a certain percentage of Saints fans this off season. Or a certain percentage of Steeler fans this or any other season. Or a certain percentage of Laker fans, Yankee fans, etc.

There's a vocal minority in every crowd.

I have never seen a fan base (media included) give less credit to the opposition than the folks in New England. The sentiment around the team is that they are unbeatable, and the only way they can lose is if they beat themselves.

I'm just curious, what time frame is that observation based on? If it's since the 45-3 game, then it's fairly accurate. But if you go back before that the mood was much different. Pre season most (with the exception of a small percentage of homers) looked at this year as 7-9 to 10-6, maybe one and done; a rebuilding year with an eye on 2011. All year long Pats fans questioned the defense. For three years Pats fans have specifically questioned the pass rush, among other things. Last year Pats fans were pretty much universal in agreement in crediting the Saints and Colts, for example, as being much better teams than the Pats were.

As for right now, this very moment, yes most fans are very optimistic and confident. Does that mean they can't be beat? Of course not; of course the Jets could win. I hear a lot of Pats fans say they're concerned about the Jets running game, and their pass defense for example. Maybe they just talk that way amongst themselves and not to Jet fans, I don't know. But why shouldn't fans of this team be confident? I would expect fans of both teams to go into the game with confidence.

The fact is the Patriots have not won a championship in four seasons. Yes this fails in comparison to the Jets (40 years and counting) however there is no reason why you guys can't come back down to earth.

From my observation the Patriots over the last five seasons are nothing like the dynasty teams. These teams are "Colts esque'" in that they aren't really physical, and rely heavily on the passing game. This is always dangerous come playoff times, because if the passing game doesn't click one of these games against a good D the Patriots will be in trouble.

You're absolutely right about some of the previous teams being different from the 2001-2004 teams. Bill Polian had the competition committee instruct the referees to call pass interference more tightly after the 2004 season. Belichick responded by revamping the offensive style of the Pats. Net result was the team you saw in 2007. It may not have won a championship, but it was a pretty good decision in my opinion, to react to the change in the rules of the game.

The comparison to the Colts is overstated and outdated, in my opinion. The Colts rely on speed and quickness from their team. I would say the Pats offensive line is just as physical as any other o-line in the NFL. Vince Wilfork and the rest of the d-line will never be considered finesse.

As for the reliance on the passing game, this isn't 1965. You have to be able to pass the ball to win in today's NFL. In addition the Pats can and do run the ball effectively. The Pats ran the ball for 19 TD and 4.3 ypc; the Jets ran it for 14 TD and 4.4 ypc. The idea that New England is a one-dimensional spread offense is outdated, it's just no longer valid.


Can the Patriots come back down to earth? Of course that's possible. Anything is possible. Any one of 32 teams could win the Super Bowl this year. But just because it could happen, that doesn't make it the most likely outcome.

That's why I have gone from being cautiously optimistic, to confident that the Patriots will win Sunday - and will also have a very good chance of being very competitive over the next few years. If that's arrogance, so be it - I guess I'm arrogant. I don't look at it that way, I think it's fairly objective, but that's just my opinion.

 

[BmoreOrioleJet]

Some have, yes.

No different than what one read or heard from a certain percentage of Saints fans this off season. Or a certain percentage of Steeler fans this or any other season. Or a certain percentage of Laker fans, Yankee fans, etc.

There's a vocal minority in every crowd.


I'm just curious, what time frame is that observation based on? If it's since the 45-3 game, then it's fairly accurate. But if you go back before that the mood was much different. Pre season most (with the exception of a small percentage of homers) looked at this year as 7-9 to 10-6, maybe one and done; a rebuilding year with an eye on 2011. All year long Pats fans questioned the defense. For three years Pats fans have specifically questioned the pass rush, among other things. Last year Pats fans were pretty much universal in agreement in crediting the Saints and Colts, for example, as being much better teams than the Pats were.

As for right now, this very moment, yes most fans are very optimistic and confident. Does that mean they can't be beat? Of course not; of course the Jets could win. I hear a lot of Pats fans say they're concerned about the Jets running game, and their pass defense for example. Maybe they just talk that way amongst themselves and not to Jet fans, I don't know. But why shouldn't fans of this team be confident? I would expect fans of both teams to go into the game with confidence.


You're absolutely right about some of the previous teams being different from the 2001-2004 teams. Bill Polian had the competition committee instruct the referees to call pass interference more tightly after the 2004 season. Belichick responded by revamping the offensive style of the Pats. Net result was the team you saw in 2007. It may not have won a championship, but it was a pretty good decision in my opinion, to react to the change in the rules of the game.

The comparison to the Colts is overstated and outdated, in my opinion. The Colts rely on speed and quickness from their team. I would say the Pats offensive line is just as physical as any other o-line in the NFL. Vince Wilfork and the rest of the d-line will never be considered finesse.

As for the reliance on the passing game, this isn't 1965. You have to be able to pass the ball to win in today's NFL. In addition the Pats can and do run the ball effectively. The Pats ran the ball for 19 TD and 4.3 ypc; the Jets ran it for 14 TD and 4.4 ypc. The idea that New England is a one-dimensional spread offense is outdated, it's just no longer valid.


Can the Patriots come back down to earth? Of course that's possible. Anything is possible. Any one of 32 teams could win the Super Bowl this year. But just because it could happen, that doesn't make it the most likely outcome.

That's why I have gone from being cautiously optimistic, to confident that the Patriots will win Sunday - and will also have a very good chance of being very competitive over the next few years. If that's arrogance, so be it - I guess I'm arrogant. I don't look at it that way, I think it's fairly objective, but that's just my opinion.

It's undeniable that the Patriots are built for the present and the future. However it's also undeniable that Tom Brady's passing game is the oil in the engine of the Patriots.

Do you really think the BJE and Danny Woodhead would be as effective in the Jets offense? The reason why they have the "9th" ranked rushing attack is because teams dare the Patriots to run the ball.

In principal this version of the Patriots D' is similar to that of the Colts. They bend, but don't break. This defense is designed to protect big leads. They haven't proven they can win a game with their defense or their running game.

 

[IcyPatriot]

Faces of the Patriots

Faces of the Jets

 

[runswithscissors]

Sorta how I felt about the Yankers, prior to 2004.

Bingo! We have Bingo! :agree:

 

[IcyPatriot]

​

 

[Ron Sellers]

It's undeniable that the Patriots are built for the present and the future. However it's also undeniable that Tom Brady's passing game is the oil in the engine of the Patriots.

Do you really think the BJE and Danny Woodhead would be as effective in the Jets offense? The reason why they have the "9th" ranked rushing attack is because teams dare the Patriots to run the ball.

In principal this version of the Patriots D' is similar to that of the Colts. They bend, but don't break. This defense is designed to protect big leads. They haven't proven they can win a game with their defense or their running game.

Whether or not they would be effective on another team is a moot point. Dwight Freeney is a great player, but he would not be effective in New England, for example.

What matters is whether or not BJGE and Woodhead are effective on this offense, not the Jets or any other offense. The reality is that they are.

As for the Pats defense, I think it's more than protect big leads. Based on the two previous seasons and this preseason there was no reason to believe the Pats were ever going to have big leads in 2010. The defense is built to eliminate the big play - i.e., bend don't break. Baltimore has transformed to the same concept since Ryan left the Ravens. It can be infuriating for fans to watch at times, but the upside is that there are fewer long gains in the wrong direction. Not as much fun to watch, but perhaps - up to debate - more conducive to winning the game.

I think the thing with this defense what you perhaps pay too much attention to is yardage stats, and what you pay too little attention to is a much more important stat: turnovers. The reality is that this defense has had as much to do or more with winning several games as any other unit has - as has the running game. Overall this Patriots team is nothing like the 2007 team.

 

[BradyFTW!]

In principal this version of the Patriots D' is similar to that of the Colts. They bend, but don't break. This defense is designed to protect big leads. They haven't proven they can win a game with their defense or their running game.

As long as Brady's upright, they won't have to win with their running game, and as for the defense, they've proven exactly as much as the Jets have. In fact, as of right now, I believe that the Pats have the better defense. (due largely to superior depth, Mayo, and Wilfork). Either way, to hold it against the D that the Pats' offense can actually score is kinda backwards.

 

[BigEZPatsFan76]

As long as Brady's upright, they won't have to win with their running game, and as for the defense, they've proven exactly as much as the Jets have. In fact, as of right now, I believe that the Pats have the better defense. (due largely to superior depth, Mayo, and Wilfork). Either way, to hold it against the D that the Pats' offense can actually score is kinda backwards.

Yeh, really, I mean when the offense is scoring an average of 30-38 points or per game, the defense does not usually HAVE to win many games. But, since he asked, I would say, it seems to me the defense made a key INT against the Colts to preserve the win there. And, they made key stops against the Packers a few weeks ago. So, I would say they have "risen to the occasion" when needed to. Of course I don't know if that "qualifies", but in my mind it does.


EZ76

 

[goheels22002]

I dont consider myself depressed

So why all the vitriol? Is it a ploy or just lack of discipline by Rex and the players?

It's totally stoking the crowd and it looks like it's stoking up the Patriots to come out and blast the Jets. Welker's press conference was a strong signal that these guys are determined. We know they come out focused on what they have to do. This just seems worse.

Your insights are most appreciated.

 

[BmoreOrioleJet]

Whether or not they would be effective on another team is a moot point. Dwight Freeney is a great player, but he would not be effective in New England, for example.

What matters is whether or not BJGE and Woodhead are effective on this offense, not the Jets or any other offense. The reality is that they are.

As for the Pats defense, I think it's more than protect big leads. Based on the two previous seasons and this preseason there was no reason to believe the Pats were ever going to have big leads in 2010. The defense is built to eliminate the big play - i.e., bend don't break. Baltimore has transformed to the same concept since Ryan left the Ravens. It can be infuriating for fans to watch at times, but the upside is that there are fewer long gains in the wrong direction. Not as much fun to watch, but perhaps - up to debate - more conducive to winning the game.

I think the thing with this defense what you perhaps pay too much attention to is yardage stats, and what you pay too little attention to is a much more important stat: turnovers. The reality is that this defense has had as much to do or more with winning several games as any other unit has - as has the running game. Overall this Patriots team is nothing like the 2007 team.

Ron,

You're pushing it a bit don't yout think?

BJE and DW are effective in your offense, BECAUSE you have a dominant passing game.

What happens when you guys have to play a team like the Ravens next week, who have pass rushers that can get to Tom Brady without blitzing? Brady wants no part of Terrell Suggs.


As for the defense they create turnovers, because teams are forced to take chances. The Pats O has been so dominante that they have forced teams into early holes.

Again.... You're passing game is GREAT, but is it unstoppable? I believe it will have to be in order for the Pats to win the Super Bowl.

 

[NY10JETS28]

So why all the vitriol? Is it a ploy or just lack of discipline by Rex and the players?

It's totally stoking the crowd and it looks like it's stoking up the Patriots to come out and blast the Jets. Welker's press conference was a strong signal that these guys are determined. We know they come out focused on what they have to do. This just seems worse.

Your insights are most appreciated.

What does what Rex and the players have do have to do with me not being depressed? But anyway..I dont see a problem with what Rex said or did. He said Belechek is one of the best, if not the best coaches of all time and Brady is a hell of a competitor, but that he just wants to win and get this game bad. He is passionate..Do you disagree with any of the points he said?

As for Cromartie I didnt think it was necessary to say any of the things he said. Not really worried about that either. Hes a grown man and can say what he wants. Its on him to back up his words.

 

[Zardoz]

Jets fans are a strange beast.

I know a bunch of them and they all share similar qualities. Every year I get trash talked about how the Pats are going down, how the Jets will take over the division, etc. and it never happens. But they keep doing it year after year. They lack the ability to learn from the past. It's like they have amnesia and forget the past year's failures and disappointments. Every other fanbase that has been routinely disappointed comes to expect more disappointment and holds back on trash talking for fear of looking stupid in the end. Jets fans don't do that, which makes them, in my humble opinion, the dumbest of all the NFL fanbases.

When the Jets get trounced by some silly score this weekend, I expect Jets fans to come down to earth, but only for a few weeks. The offseason will kick in, and they will go right back to talking about the Jets have Super Bowl 46 in the bag.

 

[Ron Sellers]

Ron,

You're pushing it a bit don't yout think?

BJE and DW are effective in your offense, BECAUSE you have a dominant passing game.

What happens when you guys have to play a team like the Ravens next week, who have pass rushers that can get to Tom Brady without blitzing? Brady wants no part of Terrell Suggs.


As for the defense they create turnovers, because teams are forced to take chances. The Pats O has been so dominante that they have forced teams into early holes.

Again.... You're passing game is GREAT, but is it unstoppable? I believe it will have to be in order for the Pats to win the Super Bowl.

I would say that you are again falling into the trap of making assumptions based on often repeated myths.

If I took the time to go back and chart each and every turnover by the Patriots defense, I'm quite confident that the vast majority came when the game was still close and the outcome was nowhere near yet determined. It sounds to me like you are implying that nearly all the turnovers came from desperate teams throwing Hail Marys, but I assure you that has not been the case. If anything the defense has been guilty of being less aggressive and giving up too much space with the lead.

As for the Ravens, news flash: the Patriots beat them this year - and that was long before the Pats hit their stride. And they beat the Steelers too. Ditto for the Packers and Bears. They've been able to handle just about every pass rush that has come their way. In several games when teams have been able to get to Brady with pressure they have quickly made successful in-game adjustments to negate that pressure.

For arguments sake, let's say that you are correct that BJGE and Woodhead are successful strictly because of the Patriots passing game. So what? It doesn't matter why - they're still successful! Regardless, I think you're not giving them nearly enough credit based solely on their lack of name recognition though.

 

[Lurks_All_Day]

If that's arrogance, so be it - I guess I'm arrogant. I don't look at it that way, I think it's fairly objective, but that's just my opinion.

Ron Sellers is my hero!