We're fine on the defensive line

[JackBauer]

Brace is absolutely not a wasted pick, because you still need a backup NT.

 

[tanked_as_usual]

Just wanted to note that Wilfork has position flexibility. If Brace can be a solid NT, then I think Wilfork could absolutely be starting RDE. We saw that when he went against Long in the Miami game.

Of course, that might not be the best use for Wilfork, but I'll let the coaching staff decide which combination of linemen is better to have on the field, and where they line up, in any given circumstance.

That begs the question, however, of Brace, and whether he'll ever amount to anything. Certainly his rookie year was a tremendous disappointment. Usually, the biggest leap in a pro's career is from the first to the second year, so 2010 means everything to Brace, and the Patriots.

the problem is that wilfork lacks the height to disrupt the QB's vision to be a DE

 

[Deus Irae]

We had such a need in 2009, unless you think that the trading of Seymour was just a whim.

1.) This team hasn't been in the offseason in need of a starter on the line since 2004, so the situation isn't normal turnover.

You know my position on Seymour, and a starting DE was clearly not a need prior to trading him away last season. The team hasn't needed a starting D-lineman in half a decade.

 

[tanked_as_usual]

Brace is absolutely not a wasted pick, because you still need a backup NT.

pryor and wright.......you don't use a 2nd round pick to back up a probowler.....hence the wasted pick

 

[Bostonian1962]

Odrick is still my pick at #22 also. There's some other 3-4 DE in the draft but not a lot and they're not first rounders, some guys who I would consider reaches but not too crazy in the second round. I think Odrick in the first round would be an excellent pick as our other needs like LB, OL, TE are deeper in the second round.

I've been considering Odrick as a 4-3 DT, but the more I think about it, he may just be the type of 3-4 DE that BB likes. He's about Seymours height and weight. My big concern would be will he be able to rush the passer for the DE position, although it'd be awful tough to rush against a D line with he and Wilfolk. VERY intriquing!

P.S. - I sure wish we could talk more draft on the main page.

 

[patsfaninpittsburgh]

Brace is absolutely not a wasted pick, because you still need a backup NT.

Anybody remember all the accolades Wilfork and Warren received after their rookie seasons? Were they not All Pro/All Universe?

Brace may turn be a waste. However, making definitive statements after rookie seasons is not that bright....and par for the course for some.

 

[mgteich]

????
Green and Burgess were two DE's on last eyar's squad. They had plenty of reps. They shared reps with Wright.

We need to use TWO roster spots for defensive ends. Do you disagree? Perhaps you think that Brace is playing DE?

Come on we need 22 all pros backed up by 31 former or future allpros or we are destined for 8-8.
If the weakest starter on the team is Mike Wright we will be playing at least into late January.
I agree with you that we need depth but I expect that on March 9th we need depth at many spots and the 15 or so players we are going to add to the 53 from here on are why.
As far as Brace, it amazes me that people think we can solve all of our problems with draft choices and then think we need to pretend last years draft choices dont exist while building our team.
People are actually saying draft a player to start at DE and throw last years #2 DT on the scrap heap??????

 

[JackBauer]

pryor and wright.......you don't use a 2nd round pick to back up a probowler.....hence the wasted pick

Pryor is a DE and Wright cannot stop the run.

 

[Ring 6]

Just wanted to note that Wilfork has position flexibility. If Brace can be a solid NT, then I think Wilfork could absolutely be starting RDE. We saw that when he went against Long in the Miami game.

Of course, that might not be the best use for Wilfork, but I'll let the coaching staff decide which combination of linemen is better to have on the field, and where they line up, in any given circumstance.

That begs the question, however, of Brace, and whether he'll ever amount to anything. Certainly his rookie year was a tremendous disappointment. Usually, the biggest leap in a pro's career is from the first to the second year, so 2010 means everything to Brace, and the Patriots.

Excellent point.
This was talked about when Vince was drafted but there was never need.
Seems silly to me that we want to draft a DE to start when we drafted Brace last year, and while he clearly has all of the ability to be a started (every 2nd rounder does, its how they adapt that determines their fate) he was slow to adapt to the NFL as a rookie. Many players, particularly DL (see Warren, Wilfork Green, Wright) make thier biggest strides between year 1 and 2.

 

[Ring 6]

????
Green and Burgess were two DE's on last eyar's squad. They had plenty of reps. They shared reps with Wright.

We need to use TWO roster spots for defensive ends. Do you disagree? Perhaps you think that Brace is playing DE?

Burgess did not play DE in the 34. Green and Wright played opposite Warren and Pryor as well. In a 34 Burgess was an OLB, but the majority of his time was in the nickel/dime as a DE, which is where our OLBs play.
Burgess was an OLB in every sense of the word, except that he was a backup in the base D.

If you are talking about a DE when we morph to a 43, or in the sub packages, that comes from the OLB spot.

Last year we carried 6 DL.....Warren, Wilfork, Green, Wright, Pryor, Brace typically. Sometimes we carry 7, but do not need to.
Replace Green and we have Warren, Wright, Pryor and the replacement.

When we cut down, that 5th DE/3rd NT (depending on the position flexibiity of the top 6) is always on the bubble, and ends up an inactive.

 

[tanked_as_usual]

Anybody remember all the accolades Wilfork and Warren received after their rookie seasons? Were they not All Pro/All Universe?

Brace may turn be a waste. However, making definitive statements after rookie seasons is not that bright....and par for the course for some.

neither looked like fools when they stepped onto the field............

warren started 4 games his rookie season......and the pats already had seymour,washington, hamilton, green.......warren did quite well as a rookie, and was a full time starter out of the gate in year 2.

wilfork started 6 games his rookie season even though they had traylor....

brace is more like Marquise Hill (RIP) than anyone else

you're not that bright for not being able to see it

 

[Ring 6]

how about we start with players who are prepared to play in the NFL.....brace was not........I'm hoping that a season of OTA's may get him to at least not get pushed around by one guy.

with wilfork extended, brace has become a wasted pick

Gotcha.....we need to give up on draft picks who arent great rookies.
The average career span of an NFL player would be about 1.4 years if everyone was in step with your overreacting approach.
I agree we need a 6th best DL who can dominate allpros as a rookie, damn it.

 

[tanked_as_usual]

Pryor is a DE and Wright cannot stop the run.

pryor played plenty of NT....not sure what you were watching

wright plays NT on passing downs..........and he was very effective at it

brace can't' stop anything....even himself from smacking into the QB on a late hit

 

[Ring 6]

neither looked like fools when they stepped onto the field............

warren started 4 games his rookie season......and the pats already had seymour,washington, hamilton, green.......warren did quite well as a rookie, and was a full time starter out of the gate in year 2.

wilfork started 6 games his rookie season even though they had traylor....

brace is more like Marquise Hill (RIP) than anyone else

you're not that bright for not being able to see it

Dude, you really dont need to insult anyone who disagrees with you.
Your last sentence makes you look like a total arrogant dlck.

Warren started at NT because Washington was hurt. Brace played when Wilfork was hurt too. Warrens rookie year would have resembled Braces a lot if Ted W didnt break his leg.
Warren made tremendous strides between his 1st and 2nd seasons.

 

[Amnorix]

the problem is that wilfork lacks the height to disrupt the QB's vision to be a DE

I know he lacks the height that they really want on the ends. That doesn't mean he can't play there situationally, or that they may not decide that, height or not, he CAN play the position adequately and that the best combo involves him at that spot.

That said, he's an all-pro NT. You need to be pretty confident about what is going on at NG to move him anywhere. Hard to see havign that confidence in anyone atm, much less Brace.

 

[tanked_as_usual]

Gotcha.....we need to give up on draft picks who arent great rookies.
The average career span of an NFL player would be about 1.4 years if everyone was in step with your overreacting approach.
I agree we need a 6th best DL who can dominate allpros as a rookie, damn it.

great rookies?????? how about at least being able to step on the field without being laughed off of it???

where did I say great? I said he wasn't ready to be in the NFL and I was right......there's huge gap from where brace is to where he needs to be........and I simply don't see it......he deserves another year......just like chad jackson......just like marquise hill(RIP)

 

[tanked_as_usual]

Dude, you really dont need to insult anyone who disagrees with you.
Your last sentence makes you look like a total arrogant dlck.

Warren started at NT because Washington was hurt. Brace played when Wilfork was hurt too. Warrens rookie year would have resembled Braces a lot if Ted W didnt break his leg.
Warren made tremendous strides between his 1st and 2nd seasons.

kiss off......the previous post explained that anyone who thinks like I do can't be too bright, so I responded in kind......you don't like it??? tough

 

[tanked_as_usual]

anybody remember all the accolades wilfork and warren received after their rookie seasons? Were they not all pro/all universe?

Brace may turn be a waste. However, making definitive statements after rookie seasons is not that bright....and par for the course for some.

hey andy!!!!!

Ream him instead!!!!!

 

[Ring 6]

kiss off......the previous post explained that anyone who thinks like I do can't be too bright, so I responded in kind......you don't like it??? tough

My bad, I didnt see that. I would have done the same thing.

 

[Amnorix]

Excellent point.
This was talked about when Vince was drafted but there was never need.
Seems silly to me that we want to draft a DE to start when we drafted Brace last year, and while he clearly has all of the ability to be a started (every 2nd rounder does, its how they adapt that determines their fate) he was slow to adapt to the NFL as a rookie. Many players, particularly DL (see Warren, Wilfork Green, Wright) make thier biggest strides between year 1 and 2.

There's no doubt that the biggest leap for nearly all players at all positions is from year 1 to year 2. For most very good players, the leap goes from part time player to full time starter. For Brace, hopefully it at least means getting onto the field.

While he lacks classic size, my only point really is that Wilfork is fully capable of playing DE, and that the Pats may use him in that role, even if only in certain situations, if they think they have another guy who can play NT adequately.