Welcome to the New England Patriots, Safety Duron Harmon

[Mike the Brit]

OTG doesn't always criticise BB. Right

I don't always agree with OTG, but he's a great poster who knows his onions, in fairness. Right

So anyway, I'd had a few too many beers watching the Draft on my own last night and slipped into unconsciousness about the middle of the third round. When I came too about 4AM, and tried to see who we'd picked with our third round choices all the while with just one eye open, I saw a name that I'd seen mentioned a maximum of three times in the pre-Draft evaluation process, and I had a nightmare that Bill had pulled his smartest guy in the room trick again, with Stedman Bailey sat there begging to be picked. Absolutely. Just so that I can prove that coaching and coachability matter more than talent ...

Alas the nightmare is true.

We'll see how Tavon Wilson MK2 plays out, but welcome to the Patriots fella! Quite right! He's wearing the jersey now.

Excellent post. :ukflag:

 

[ausbacker]

Swearinger was playing against much more elite competition.

Didn't pay attention to that already made qualifying comment? Elite or not, I don't buy into names, I buy into players. I don't deny I wouldn't have liked Swearinger to be on the Patriots roster, I'm just not that fussed that he isn't given the Patriots have drafted a supposedly comparable talent according to their draft board.

 

[Off The Grid]

please ignore off the grid. This is the guy who said Stevan Ridley was a terrible pick. Rated Bequette as a superb pick... always criticizes BB after the draft, every year without fail

Seriously...You should take something for that.

...Whatever it is.

 

[Off The Grid]

OTG doesn't always criticise BB.

I don't always agree with OTG, but he's a great poster who knows his onions, in fairness.

So anyway, I'd had a few too many beers watching the Draft on my own last night and slipped into unconsciousness about the middle of the third round. When I came too about 4AM, and tried to see who we'd picked with our third round choices all the while with just one eye open, I saw a name that I'd seen mentioned a maximum of three times in the pre-Draft evaluation process, and I had a nightmare that Bill had pulled his smartest guy in the room trick again, with Stedman Bailey sat there begging to be picked.

Alas the nightmare is true.

We'll see how Tavon Wilson MK2 plays out, but welcome to the Patriots fella!

Excellent post. :ukflag:

Thanks for the kind Words, British Brothers!!

Looks like I went 2 for 3 with the British, this Morning ~ and who gives a rat's @$$ what Leemo thinks, anyway??

~ so I feel quite Honored. Thank you, Gents!!

 

[Kontradiction]

Didn't pay attention to that already made qualifying comment? Elite or not, I don't buy into names, I buy into players. I don't deny I wouldn't have liked Swearinger to be on the Patriots roster, I'm just not that fussed that he isn't given the Patriots have drafted a supposedly comparable talent according to their draft board.

No, I missed it. But you're "I buy into players" analysis is fatally flawed right from the start, and plays right into my hands. It's also a direct contradiction. If you buy into players, you should realize that Swearinger was playing against future professionals on a weekly basis where Harmon was not. To further hammer that point home, the SEC just set a record for the amount of players selected in the initial rounds. So, all that being said, if you "buy into players", you should be buying into Swearinger instead of excusing a very bad reach for Harmon. It was a bad reach, especially given other players on the board at positions of need. How so many of you are having trouble admitting that out of loyalty to the coach is beyond me.

 

[kennyb]

The only explanation I think is that bb not only had him rested highly but knew other teams did as well. People bring up vollmer but some public sites had him highly ranked. If belichick thought there was a good chance that he could get him much later then he should have gambled and gotten him for free. That's what hood scouting is supposed to do. You find diamonds in the rough and get them for nothing.

So its possible that they knew other teams liked him too.

I saw some highlights of his looks pretty good. In the end I think he'll be good. Course I thought tavon Wilson was pretty good. Maybe not second round good but shows promise.

 

[ausbacker]

No, I missed it. But you're "I buy into players" analysis is fatally flawed right from the start, and plays right into my hands. It's also a direct contradiction. If you buy into players, you should realize that Swearinger was playing against future professionals on a weekly basis where Harmon was not. To further hammer that point home, the SEC just set a record for the amount of players selected in the initial rounds. So, all that being said, if you "buy into players", you should be buying into Swearinger instead of excusing a very bad reach for Harmon. It was a bad reach, especially given other players on the board at positions of need. How so many of you are having trouble admitting that out of loyalty to the coach is beyond me.

No, it does nothing of the sort. I couldn't give a rat's arse which conference a player is chosen from if the Patriots believe that player to be a good player. I admit, I have binkies but I don't allow that to cloud my analysis of the Patriots taking players in positions of need. It's been obvious for years that their draft board is incredibly different from every other team. What's also obvious is that the Patriots are excellent performers come draft time. Sure they hit and miss and sure they reach at times, but that's not a good enough reason to be down.

The SEC can produce as many NFL ready talents as they like. It makes no difference to me because there are many good players outside of the SEC that deserve just as much attention as SEC players. Did we reach? Probably. Do I care? Not really.

 

[Ring 6]

The only explanation I think is that bb not only had him rested highly but knew other teams did as well. People bring up vollmer but some public sites had him highly ranked. If belichick thought there was a good chance that he could get him much later then he should have gambled and gotten him for free. That's what hood scouting is supposed to do. You find diamonds in the rough and get them for nothing.

So its possible that they knew other teams liked him too.

I saw some highlights of his looks pretty good. In the end I think he'll be good. Course I thought tavon Wilson was pretty good. Maybe not second round good but shows promise.

Well of course BB felt there was a good chance that he wouldn't be there at 102. If he thought the draft guides were gospel, he would have waited until the 200s.
People on this board will have you believe that Belichick sat there and said "I know this guy won't be drafted by anyone else, and we could get him as a UDFA, but I'm just going to waste this pick and draft a guy no one wants. I really don't care about this team, so I'm gonna burn a pick, F Bob Kraft"

 

[Ring 6]

No, I missed it. But you're "I buy into players" analysis is fatally flawed right from the start, and plays right into my hands. It's also a direct contradiction. If you buy into players, you should realize that Swearinger was playing against future professionals on a weekly basis where Harmon was not. To further hammer that point home, the SEC just set a record for the amount of players selected in the initial rounds. So, all that being said, if you "buy into players", you should be buying into Swearinger instead of excusing a very bad reach for Harmon. It was a bad reach, especially given other players on the board at positions of need. How so many of you are having trouble admitting that out of loyalty to the coach is beyond me.

You just confirmed what Ausbacker said, not contradicted it.
He said he buys into players, not names. You just argued the by being associated with the SEC Swearinger must be better.
Ausbacker says the man making the pick should evaluate the players and pick the best one, and if we never heard of him, so what.
You said, pick the SEC guy because he is famous and the SEC is good.

I know who I agree with there, but thats not the point, the point is that you are touting buying into names, and he is touting buying into players, and you didn't get the definition.

 

[hambone1818]

Well of course BB felt there was a good chance that he wouldn't be there at 102. If he thought the draft guides were gospel, he would have waited until the 200s.
People on this board will have you believe that Belichick sat there and said "I know this guy won't be drafted by anyone else, and we could get him as a UDFA, but I'm just going to waste this pick and draft a guy no one wants. I really don't care about this team, so I'm gonna burn a pick, F Bob Kraft"

That's what I don't get...people like to act like the Patriots could have made this pick in round 7, it's Tavon Wilson all over again. Then word came out that two or three other teams with safety needs had Wilson with a second round grade.

The simple fact is that no matter how much research people on this board do, no matter how much ESPN and scouting services spend in putting their boards together, they pale in comparison to what an NFL team spends, not to mention the scouts and personnel they employ.

If Belichick thought Harmon would have been there later in the draft he wouldn't have taken him in the 3rd, that seems pretty logical to me. Now, maybe he WOULD have been there in the 4th, or the 7th...we'll never know. My guess, though, is that just like with Wilson we'll find that a few teams liked Harmon quite a bit, despite where the 'experts' thought he'd go.

 

[BelichickFan]

The haters should note that Greg Cosell likes Harmon :

Greg Cosell ‏@gregcosell 5m

Based on my film study really liked Pats picks WR Dobson and S Harmon. Harmon smart with excellent play recognition + awareness.

 

[Ring 6]

True Story.

Too many Patriot Fans think it's Blasphemy to say that Coach Bill screwed up.

Coach Bill is AWESOME.

But he IS Human.

And he DOES screw up.

Just ask Kevin OConnell.

...or Ryan Mallett.

...or Derick Burgess.

...or Ras I Dowling.

...or Tavon Wilson.

Coach Bill is the BEST.

He just isn't PERFECT.

And it's actually OK to say so.

This is an interesting concept.
First, I don't think anyone, anywhere has ever said BB is perfect.
I think many fans feel that his decisions are correct more often than most NFL decision makers and ALL fans. Seriously even a fan with equal ability to BB would be making the decision with a modicum of the information accessible to BB, so its ignorant to proclaim otherwise. The reality is that the rate of fail on NFL decisions is pretty high, so anyone can find decisions they disagreed with that turned out bad.
For example if I flip a coin 100 times I will guess wrong on heads or tails right about 50 times. Had I possessed amazing ESP skills and got 60 correct, you could point out 40 times you knew I was wrong, and therefore claim you know more than me.
In the end BB is perfect in one way. He makes decisions consistent with his level of knowledge, skill, experience and proficiency and always with the sole goal of what is best for the NEP.
That criteria results in being right more than anyone else would be in that position, or at least almost anyone else. Therefore to say IN BB WE TRUST is not to say he is perfect, but to say that given him believing in the decision and you (euphamisitcally) not, I would be much more confident he is right.

 

[IllegalContact]

Seriously...You should take something for that.

...Whatever it is.

your signature is annoying

 

[JMC00]

How were Mallett and Wilson screw-ups? Seriously. Mallett has beat out the competition to be Brady's back-up, instilling enough confidence in the Pats that they didn't need to carry a 3rd QB.

Wilson had a respectable rookie season,.

Just because they weren't your binkies doesn't mean the Pats screwed up. That's pretty friggin arrogant to say.

Wilson had a comparable year to Mark Barron (the best safety in that draft) last year playing primarily in a sub role.

 

[mgteich]

Good find!

I think the hate is because of the over-reach, not because of the player. Harmon is an OK upgrade over Ebner as our developmental 5th safety, hopefully to take Gregory's place in 2014.

The haters should note that Greg Cosell likes Harmon :

Greg Cosell ‏@gregcosell 5m

Based on my film study really liked Pats picks WR Dobson and S Harmon. Harmon smart with excellent play recognition + awareness.

 

[Kontradiction]

No, it does nothing of the sort. I couldn't give a rat's arse which conference a player is chosen from if the Patriots believe that player to be a good player. I admit, I have binkies but I don't allow that to cloud my analysis of the Patriots taking players in positions of need. It's been obvious for years that their draft board is incredibly different from every other team. What's also obvious is that the Patriots are excellent performers come draft time. Sure they hit and miss and sure they reach at times, but that's not a good enough reason to be down.

The SEC can produce as many NFL ready talents as they like. It makes no difference to me because there are many good players outside of the SEC that deserve just as much attention as SEC players. Did we reach? Probably. Do I care? Not really.

Sure it did. If you really "cared about the players", you would care about level of competition or at least take that into account with an asterisk when trying to compare two players to one another using statistics. Not doing so is disingenuous at best and reeks of someone stretching as far as they can to defend a decision that they ultimately know was a bad one (as evidenced in your last four sentences). But it's good to see that you don't care that your favorite team reached.

:bricks::bricks::bricks:

 

[RayClay]

If belichick thought there was a good chance that he could get him much later then he should have gambled and gotten him for free. That's what hood scouting is supposed to do. You find diamonds in the rough and get them for nothing.

So its possible that they knew other teams liked him too.

I disagree with this (except for the last part). For one thing, players that haven't been picked by the end of the second day don't deserve to be ranked anyway. that's like ranking which Baskin Robbins flavors will sell that day after eliminating chocolate and vanilla.

With a very early 4th, he's looking to get a player he wants now, not a bargain for nothing he might miss on. Any team might pick him over another safety not good enough to go in three rounds.

Value means something you can use, not the best deal on an air conditioner in Alaska.

McCourty, Ryan and Harmon know each others families and are probably talking about next year's defense now. That's unique. He's good enough to be the Baskin Robbins flavor some GM chooses, then we'd have to find another safety who had dinner with McCourty and Ryan's mom. Not likely.

If we missed something urgent in round 4 (lol) we've got the 5th pick. That's how you play multiple picks.

 

[Kontradiction]

The haters should note that Greg Cosell likes Harmon :

Greg Cosell ‏@gregcosell 5m

Based on my film study really liked Pats picks WR Dobson and S Harmon. Harmon smart with excellent play recognition + awareness.

A lot of people were saying the same thing about Tavon Wilson last season. Then he got torched on the same play twice and appeared to be thrown in the dog house.

 

[BelichickFan]

A lot of people were saying the same thing about Tavon Wilson last season. Then he got torched on the same play twice and appeared to be thrown in the dog house.

Who cares. What Wilson did is irrelevant to Harmon. Harmon has been spoken of well by the respected Cosell. Maybe we have a sleeper, maybe a bust. But what Wilson did is irrelevant.

 

[Kontradiction]

Who cares. What Wilson did is irrelevant to Harmon. Harmon has been spoken of well by the respected Cosell. Maybe we have a sleeper, maybe a bust. But what Wilson did is irrelevant.

It's actually a very valid example of how a player's awareness can be talked up (particularly one that was considered a reach by the greater majority) only to have that player show very little awareness. But choose to dismiss it as irrelevant if you must...