We Have At Least $11M Cap Money Available!!!

[Gwedd]

Still and all, whether 11 million or 4 million, there's still money left over and I'd prefer they were a but frugal with what remains, rather than just go shopping, as it were.

At this stage, what more can we add besides numbers? I'd offer that it's more important right now to see what happens over the next 2-3 pre-season games with the horses already in the stable. After that, if there is a need, then try and address it.

 

[Rob0729]

I just don't care about logic. I am going to believe after adding a bunch of free agents, trading for players, resigning Mankins and a few others, and signing the rookies that the Pats have basically the same cap room they started free agency with. I want to believe that Floyd Reese is a capologist superman and can actually create more cap room by adding more contracts to the cap.

 

[signbabybrady]

What aren't you understanding?

Miguel's Page does not have Mankins' new numbers. So the 11.5 million he lists for free space is without Mankins' extension. Meaning that more money will be freed up.

Miguel's page also doesn't list Mark Anderson. Anderson's salary is 1.375 Million. That put's him in the top 51 and knocks Ryan Wendell out of the top 51., The difference between Wendell's cap number and Anderson's cap number is 800K (give or take a few 10K). So, when you add Anderson and subtract Wendell the cap space is only reduced by the 800K. Not the 1.375 mil.

Here is what I get:

Miguel has us at 11.5 million With the $3 million credit. But that also includes Mankins at his old number of 10.3 Million.

You add in Mark Anderson at 1.375 million and that knocks Ryan Wendell ($533K) out of the Top 51. With a difference of about 800K. So, it would drop the Pats to about 7.8 million in free cap space.

You got me a little confused too.

Your starting point is 11.5 (which includes 10.3 for Mankins that will likely get smaller which is a mute point for this math)

11.5 - 1.375 = 10.125 then you Add in .533 because Wendell is knocked off the top 51 which = 10.658 yet somehow you drop to 7.8 with no explanation?

I am not saying your wrong just do see where you get there?

 

[MoLewisrocks]

You got me a little confused too.

Your starting point is 11.5 (which includes 10.3 for Mankins that will likely get smaller which is a mute point for this math)

11.5 - 1.375 = 10.125 then you Add in .533 because Wendell is knocked off the top 51 which = 10.658 yet somehow you drop to 7.8 with no explanation?

I am not saying your wrong just do see where you get there?

Chad got a $4.5M signing bonus, not the $1.5M prorated? roster bonus initially reported. That takes another $1M off Miguel's estimate. And Haynesworth got a ton of incentives on top of his $1.5M base salary, some of which are LikelyToBeEarned (LTBE) which means they will count on the cap this year and be adjusted out in 2012 if he doesn't earn them. DB is estimating them (IMO) a little on the high end at $2M+, but who knows. They are likely based on playing time last season. I'd guess at least a million of them are easily reached if he works out.

He also began as I did by backing out the $3M cap credit Miguel presumed we have taken because we don't know that for a fact.

 

[conway]

Whether it's $4M or $11M, that's still a lot of... straight cash homey.

First team O: Ocho-Welker-Gronk-Branch

Second team O: Moss-Edelman-Hernandez-Tate/Price


Very little drop-off. Everyone stays fresh. Wouldn't cost much.

 

[MoLewisrocks]

Rapsheets version of the details. He has Chad's signing bonus as $4.75M and a cap hit of $2.6M though... First reports of contract terms are usual agent spin or misinterpretation. You never know what a contract entails until the full terms are leaked, and sometimes they never are. That is why Miguel posts his page with caveats...

BostonHerald.com - Blogs: Rap Sheet» Blog Archive » Understanding the contracts for Ochocinco, Haynesworth, and more!

 

[signbabybrady]

Chad got a $4.5M signing bonus, not the $1.5M prorated? roster bonus initially reported. That takes another $1M off Miguel's estimate. And Haynesworth got a ton of incentives on top of his $1.5M base salary, some of which are LikelyToBeEarned (LTBE) which means they will count on the cap this year and be adjusted out in 2012 if he doesn't earn them. DB is estimating them (IMO) a little on the high end at $2M+, but who knows. They are likely based on playing time last season. I'd guess at least a million of them are easily reached if he works out.

He also began as I did by backing out the $3M cap credit Miguel presumed we have taken because we don't know that for a fact.

I am thinking he must have taking this out without noting it in his math as it fits in the math.

Let me ask this while that 3 mil credit may not have been applied to anyone yet is there any reason not to apply it to someone? In other words cant we assume that it will be saved especially if there is another move to be made.

 

[MoLewisrocks]

I am thinking he must have taking this out without noting it in his math as it fits in the math.

Let me ask this while that 3 mil credit may not have been applied to anyone yet is there any reason not to apply it to someone? In other words cant we assume that it will be saved especially if there is another move to be made.

The reason is it comes off of later caps when you may need it even more. It's a loan on future cap, not a use it or lose it credit. And the player you use it on must remain on the roster (or IR) for the entire season or the credit gets backed out. So you really need to know who it was used on. I understand why Miguel presumed it at the time he did. He had us within about $100K of the cap with outstanding deals yet to be factored in at the time... But that doesn't mean the FO was at that same point because they knew things he couldn't have known...

 

[patsfaninpittsburgh]

I saw that report. The only question is, does Carter play a Dr. on tv, or does he have inside information.

He was at a Holiday Inn last night.

Besides, the real question is if Osi thinks Chris Carter is correct.

 

[MoLewisrocks]

Time for patsfans to step away from their fantasies...sounds like by not panicing and holding their ground the Giants will come out the winners (if in fact there is anything to win) in the Osi debaucle.

Osi Umenyiora will return to practice with New York Giants Monday if Atlanta doctor clears him

 

[Rob0729]

Time for patsfans to step away from their fantasies...sounds like by not panicing and holding their ground the Giants will come out the winners (if in fact there is anything to win) in the Osi debaucle.

Osi Umenyiora will return to practice with New York Giants Monday if Atlanta doctor clears him

Although I doubt that the Pats will get him, I still expect a divorce between Umenyiora and the Giants before the season.

 

[MoLewisrocks]

»
RapSheet Ian R. Rapoport
Patriots DE Andre Carter's contract info: $500K signing bonus, $1.75M base, $500K in incentives. Pretty hefty but not too risky.
2 minutes ago »
RapSheet Ian R. Rapoport
Shaun Ellis contract info: The ex-Jets DE got $750K signing bonus, $1.5M base, $1.75M roster bonus from Pats
3 minutes ago


Carter is on a one year deal and had not yet been accounted for on Miguel's cap. Cap hit of $2.25M pending what his incentives are and whether LTBE or NLTBE.

 

[Displaced - Fan]

»
RapSheet Ian R. Rapoport
Patriots DE Andre Carter's contract info: $500K signing bonus, $1.75M base, $500K in incentives. Pretty hefty but not too risky.
2 minutes ago »
RapSheet Ian R. Rapoport
Shaun Ellis contract info: The ex-Jets DE got $750K signing bonus, $1.5M base, $1.75M roster bonus from Pats
3 minutes ago


Carter is on a one year deal and had not yet been accounted for on Miguel's cap. Cap hit of $2.25M pending what his incentives are and whether LTBE or NLTBE.

Speaking of Ellis, from what I understand guys on the PUP don't count against the "53" for money. So when he comes off he'll take some of the $11 mil.

 

[MoLewisrocks]

Speaking of Ellis, from what I understand guys on the PUP don't count against the "53" for money. So when he comes off he'll take some of the $11 mil.

According to Miguel's FAQ page players on PUP count against the cap. What they do not necessarily count against is roster limits.

 

[Palm Beach Pats Fan]

I'd guess we'd keep a 5M cushion minimum for in-season injuries.

Awhile back I did some research to address the claims of a Colts fan who said that in part they were limited by being a small market team and paying at the low end of the salary spectrum, even though the range of salaries in the NFL is rather small due to the hard cap.

I thought I'd share those results here, gleaned from the USA Today site which has historical salary figures from 2000-2009 (nothing for the uncapped year).

2009-10 NFL Salaries by Team - USATODAY.com


Not surprisingly, there is a poor correlation of salary spent with success.

2009 Patriots were 25th in payroll. Colts were 19th in payroll. Saints (4th) won.
2008 Patriots were 30th in payroll. Colts were 29th in payroll. Steelers (6th) won.
2007 Patriots were 2nd in payroll. Colts were 12th in payroll. Giants (32nd) won.
2006 Patriots were 12th in payroll. Colts were 1st in payroll & won
2005 Patriots were 7th in payroll. Colts were 23rd in payroll. Steelers (10th) won.
2004 Patriots were 24th in payroll and won. Colts were 8th in payroll.
2003 Patriots (9th in payroll) won. Colts were 23rd in payroll.
2002 Patriots were 31st in payroll. Colts were 15th in payroll. Tampa Bay (16th) won.
2001 Patriots (23rd in payroll) won. Colts were 24th in payroll.
2000 Patriots were 25th in payroll. Colts were 17th in payroll. Ravens won (13th).

So for a ten year period (the total of the USA Today database)
The Patriots were on average #19 in the NFL in payroll
The Colts were on average #17 in the NFL in payroll
The NFL champion was on average #14 in the NFL in payroll

bottom line: I seem some random fluctuations, two fairly frugal teams, not really indicating any inability of Indy to pay salaries necessary to contend.

Look at the top salaried teams though. More often than not, they did not even make the playoffs.

Also, paying high salaries in the NFL doesn't mean you have better players. It means you have made some awful mistakes in giving out some lousy contracts, then often had to scramble to cover up holes left over by overpaying other guys as well, and even pull some cap shenanigans to accomplish it, which hurts the team in the long run.

Consistently well-run teams seem to thrive in the 10-20 zone of salaries paid out.

 

[Displaced - Fan]

According to Miguel's FAQ page players on PUP count against the cap. What they do not necessarily count against is roster limits.

Correct me if I'm worng, but I tought only the top 53 counted twords the cap.

 

[MoLewisrocks]

Correct me if I'm worng, but I tought only the top 53 counted twords the cap.

The cap (once week 1 is here) counts all players on the roster including the 53 man active roster, players on PUP or IR, the members of the practice squad and any dead money attributable to this season from players cut.

 

[patsfaninpa]

Hopefully we don't have a lot of injuries this year. But, given the lockoout and no off-season program. Probably a good year to have some money to spend in-season. I'm thinking Channing Crowder for one. I know he retired. But, please.

 

[D-Money]

There are still some good LBs out there.Tatupu and Rocky McIntosh.Rocky McIntosh could look good in a 4-3 defense.

 

[SirApropos]

There are still some good LBs out there.Tatupu and Rocky McIntosh.Rocky McIntosh could look good in a 4-3 defense.

McIntosh resigned with the Redskins.