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We CAN make the cap room to sign Peppers - Unsubstantianted Claim

Discussion in 'PatsFans.com - Patriots Fan Forum' started by solman, Mar 17, 2009.

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  1. solman

    solman Rotational Player and Threatening Starter's Job

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    We can free up an extra $9M if we restructure/extend Brady, Light and Faulk so that their cap hit in 2009 is $1M each. We could use huge guaranteed options due in 2010 for each to make them whole.

    We also have other opportunities to free up smaller amounts of cap space.

    Once Peppers is on board we can sign a long term deal that frees up more cap space that we can then use to sign our draft picks and make other moves.


    I admit that I don't think this will happen. Too many things have to fall in place for any of the Peppers scenarios to work.


    But it is NOT the case that we can't make this deal happen. Even if making it happen required us to temporarily clear enough cap space for Pepper's franchise tag.
     
  2. NEGoldenAge

    NEGoldenAge Banned

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    I'm not real up to speed on the CBA and contract stuff, but I'm pretty sure that a player's 2010 salary can not excede 130% of 2009's salary.
     
  3. solman

    solman Rotational Player and Threatening Starter's Job

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    Compensation which is treated as a signing bonus explicitly exempted from this limit.

    A guaranteed option bonus is treated as a signing bonus, even if its convertible.

    (There is a provision prohibiting the team from exercising such a conversion if it puts them in violation of the 30% rule. I don't know if this would be determined on a prospective or retrospective basis. But even if it is retrospective it wouldn't prevent the move discussed here, merely complicate it).
     
  4. The_Riddler

    The_Riddler 2nd Team Getting Their First Start

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    What about Jarvis Green, talk about a guy needing a restructure. He's the first guy I look at.
     
  5. solman

    solman Rotational Player and Threatening Starter's Job

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    Absolutely.

    But I don't know enough about that huge bonus he is due to know how big the potential savings are.

    If it is all real compensation that has yet to be paid, we might be able to save $4M on a similar restructuring.
     
  6. WhiZa

    WhiZa Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract

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    anything is possible, it's just about which players you piss off in the process
     
  7. Shockt327

    Shockt327 Rotational Player and Threatening Starter's Job

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    Yup, also, I think people are drastically over-estimating Peppers potential contract.

    People are acting like he'd break the bank and get a ridiculous deal. However, I think he's only going to come with a 7 mil cap hit - especially when you consider him changing positions.

    Hell, Albert Haynesworth did get a ridiculous deal and his cap number is only at $7 mil for 09, $8.8 for 2010, and $10.6 for 2011.

    Calvin Pace's outrageous contract is even lighter, as is Joey Porters.
     
  8. jmt57

    jmt57 Moderator Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    How in the world are you going to get Brady or Light's cap number that low?
     
  9. MoLewisrocks

    MoLewisrocks PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Cannot be done most simply put because of their existing amortized cap which cannot be moved or restructured. Also I believe money that is guaranteed in 2010 but not in the last capped year reverts to the last capped year.

    Honestly people, just stop.
     
  10. solman

    solman Rotational Player and Threatening Starter's Job

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    Peppers is NOT signing a long term deal at $7M/season.

    He's got nearly $17M coming to him for just a single season if he signs the franchise Tender.

    He's going to want compensation in the form of long term guarantees for every penny of that $16.7M he gives back.

    Maybe he gives New England a discount, but I think $7M is insane. His agent should insist on resigning before he agrees to that deal.
     
  11. PatsDparty

    PatsDparty On the Game Day Roster

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    Can someone just please tell me when Peppers has said he wants to be the highest paid defensive player and get a contract like haynesworth. I keep seeing analysts use this as their justification for why he wouldn't fit with the Pats, yet I've never seen him quoted as saying such. I've heard him say that he wants to be in a 3-4 defense to maximize his potential (which doesn't necessarily mean contract). If he was all about the money, I'd have to think he'd take that 16 mm franchise tender, rather than just let it sit there, esp since he's limited his choices to 4 teams (3 of which are in the NFC).
     
  12. solman

    solman Rotational Player and Threatening Starter's Job

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    The total amount of SALARY in 2009 for these three players is over $12M.

    Removing amortized cap hits from 2009 is neither necessary nor possible.

    Money guaranteed after _2012_ reverts to the capped year. 2010 money is not affected.
     
  13. Shockt327

    Shockt327 Rotational Player and Threatening Starter's Job

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    I'm not sure if that's a possibility - at least not to the degree of 4 mil.

    Restructuring contracts is harder this year. It's not like we can pull a Bill Polian, and convert Green's 2.3 mil roster bonus into a prorated signing bonus. From my understanding, the new rules prohibit that. So, that $2.3 has to be paid this year.

    Also, you can't drastically reduce Green's 2009 salary (with the intention of paying him in 2010) either, because the 30% rule prohibits such back loading.

    However, cutting Green outright would save $2,122,280
     
  14. Deus Irae

    Deus Irae PatsFans.com Retired Jersey Club PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Disable Jersey

    I really don't see the problem here. Just cut Brady. Then the Patriots can have the bestest defense in the whole world.
     
  15. Miguel

    Miguel Patriots Salary Cap Guru PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #75 Jersey

    Please illustrate how this is possible by filling in the below amounts

    2009 salary
    2009 prorated signing bonus amortization
    2009 roster bonus.
     
  16. mayoclinic

    mayoclinic PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Maybe it would be insane, but it would be equally insane for Peppers to ask to be traded to a team that will convert him to 3-4 OLB and expect to be paid much more than the top LBs. He's done nothing to justify that, and if he wants to be a LB then he will need to accept being paid as one, not as a DE.

    The Ravens franchised Terrell Suggs for a second time at $10.2M, a 20% increase on his previous salary, which was a compromise between the LB and DE positions. So a long-term deal averaging $10M/year tops seems to me not unreasonable.

    Again, Peppers can either go for top dollar or go for playing 3-4 OLB to a team of his choice. It's extremely unlikely that he will get both. So far, going for top dollar doesn't seem to be what's driving him since he hasn't signed the $16.7M tender from Carolina, and previously turned down a lucrative long term deal from them.

    I'm sure his agent will take the hefty commission on whatever lucrative deal Peppers ends up with rather than resign in protest. :D
     
  17. Pats726

    Pats726 Veteran Starter w/Big Long Term Deal

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    Maybe it IS possible...but so isn't snow in June..although rare....I just don't see all these contracts moving about for a player that will be playing a position he's never played in the pros. BIG gamble on many fronts..and I just do not see it happening..and what does one have gained?? Especially if the locker room is not the best...with players getting a BIG paycheck..there will be a line..
     
  18. solman

    solman Rotational Player and Threatening Starter's Job

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    Salary:

    2009: $1M
    2010: $1.3M
    2011: $1.6M
    2012: $1.9M
    2013: $2.2M
    2014: $2.5M

    2010 guaranteed option bonus: $100M

    Annual cap hit:

    2009: $1M
    2010: $21.3M
    2011: $21.6M
    2012: $21.9M
    2013: $22.2M
    2014: $22.5M

    Plus you have to add back the amortized bonus already associated with those player's current contracts. But I never counted that money in the first place. I am talking entirely about moving the cap hit associated with their salary.
     
  19. Rob0729

    Rob0729 PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    I think the Pats can free up the money to get Peppers if they decide to. It won't be as easy to free up $9 million as the original poster suggests though.
     
  20. solman

    solman Rotational Player and Threatening Starter's Job

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    Miguel, see my example in another post of an extension through 2014 that pays over $110M over six years.

    The total 2009 cap hit would equal $1M plus the existing 2009 cap hit from amortized bonuses that have already been paid.
     
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