Welcome to PatsFans.com

Waterboarding

Discussion in 'Political Discussion' started by Harry Boy, Feb 3, 2013.

  1. Harry Boy

    Harry Boy Look Up, It's Amazing PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2005
    Messages:
    37,490
    Likes Received:
    22
    Ratings:
    +26 / 0 / -4

    My Jersey:

  2. PatriotsReign

    PatriotsReign Rookie

    Joined:
    Jan 15, 2007
    Messages:
    24,998
    Likes Received:
    32
    Ratings:
    +39 / 0 / -5

    My Jersey:

    I don't think anyone really cares how we got that information. As long as Osama is dead, we're ok.
  3. IcyPatriot

    IcyPatriot ~~~Out of Order~~~ PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2004
    Messages:
    36,491
    Likes Received:
    18
    Ratings:
    +23 / 0 / -0

    My Jersey:

    #87 Jersey
    That topic has been discussed at length ... most say it doesn't help and I guess at times it can.
  4. DarrylS

    DarrylS PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2004
    Messages:
    40,315
    Likes Received:
    19
    Ratings:
    +19 / 0 / -0

    My Jersey:

    From the article.. maybe I am reading it wrong.

    It does not specify what tactics were used.. a real stretch by Jim Hoft



    The esteemed Mr. Hoft..

    [​IMG]
  5. PatsWSB47

    PatsWSB47 Rookie

    Joined:
    Mar 13, 2007
    Messages:
    7,582
    Likes Received:
    14
    Ratings:
    +15 / 0 / -0

    My Jersey:

    Serious question. If waterboarding was proved to be effective, who would be okay with it?
  6. Harry Boy

    Harry Boy Look Up, It's Amazing PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2005
    Messages:
    37,490
    Likes Received:
    22
    Ratings:
    +26 / 0 / -4

    My Jersey:

    The wife of the guy in the picutre floating down from the 70th floor of the World Trade Center flapping his arms trying to fly then splattering like a watermelon on The Side Walks Of New York.
  7. DarrylS

    DarrylS PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2004
    Messages:
    40,315
    Likes Received:
    19
    Ratings:
    +19 / 0 / -0

    My Jersey:

    The right is duped again, as the video was edited and Panetta did not even use the word “waterboarding,” and he certainly did not say that information from waterboarding “led to bin Laden.” Half azz Hoft simply made that up out of nothing. Panetta specifically said that most of the intelligence that led to bin Laden was put together without using torture.

    Panetta’s very next sentence, directly following the section that Hoft clipped for his misleading video, was:


    Fooled again, when will they ever learn??? Are they really that stupid???
  8. PatsFanInEaglesLand

    PatsFanInEaglesLand Rookie

    Joined:
    Oct 12, 2004
    Messages:
    3,716
    Likes Received:
    4
    Ratings:
    +4 / 0 / -0

    My Jersey:

    He "thinks" that they could of gotten Bin Laden without it.

    He is saying it did happen and did work. Just that it could of happened with out it, but no one will ever know
    Last edited by a moderator: Feb 5, 2013
  9. Nunchucks

    Nunchucks Rookie

    Joined:
    Sep 10, 2007
    Messages:
    2,719
    Likes Received:
    5
    Ratings:
    +8 / 0 / -0

    My Jersey:

    People will say anything to stop being tortured. So, how do you trust any information you get?

    How do you get people on your side when you cannot hold the moral high ground?
  10. PatriotsReign

    PatriotsReign Rookie

    Joined:
    Jan 15, 2007
    Messages:
    24,998
    Likes Received:
    32
    Ratings:
    +39 / 0 / -5

    My Jersey:

    I don't support waterboarding of humans. But thankfully, terrorists aren't considered human.
  11. Harry Boy

    Harry Boy Look Up, It's Amazing PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2005
    Messages:
    37,490
    Likes Received:
    22
    Ratings:
    +26 / 0 / -4

    My Jersey:

    Liberals would allow 553 humans to die rather than make one savage killer uncomfortable for ten minutes.

    The liberal brain never ceases to amaze me.

    Fragile little women are taken out into the streets of the putrid disgusting Middle East on a regular basis, they are lashed with a whip and then other so called "humans" throw rocks at them until they are DEAD, The Messed Up Liberal Brain Goes Silent.

    Screaming men are taken out into the streets of the same filthy rotten Middle East they are forced to their knees and another "savage human" carves off their gurgling weeping head with a knife, The Messed Up Liberal Brain Goes Silent

    :confused::confused:

    Do Unto Others As They Would Do Unto You
  12. Nunchucks

    Nunchucks Rookie

    Joined:
    Sep 10, 2007
    Messages:
    2,719
    Likes Received:
    5
    Ratings:
    +8 / 0 / -0

    My Jersey:

    Fantasies are fun. Play in your make-believe world, perhaps you can ride unicorns and hug care-bears.
  13. Harry Boy

    Harry Boy Look Up, It's Amazing PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2005
    Messages:
    37,490
    Likes Received:
    22
    Ratings:
    +26 / 0 / -4

    My Jersey:

  14. JackBauer

    JackBauer Rookie

    Joined:
    Mar 3, 2005
    Messages:
    15,156
    Likes Received:
    14
    Ratings:
    +17 / 0 / -0

    My Jersey:

    Waterboarding is a war crime, but not when we do it.
  15. Hamar

    Hamar Rookie

    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2011
    Messages:
    2,098
    Likes Received:
    0
    Ratings:
    +1 / 0 / -0

    My Jersey:

    So is illegally entering another country to assassinate a person. Also, those drones killing civilians is a war crime as well.
  16. JackBauer

    JackBauer Rookie

    Joined:
    Mar 3, 2005
    Messages:
    15,156
    Likes Received:
    14
    Ratings:
    +17 / 0 / -0

    My Jersey:

    True, but at least you can make a moral case as to why the above are appropriate/better than the alternative.
  17. Hamar

    Hamar Rookie

    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2011
    Messages:
    2,098
    Likes Received:
    0
    Ratings:
    +1 / 0 / -0

    My Jersey:

    Right, blowing little children's bodies apart with a drone is much more moral than putting a wet towel on some one's head and trying to get them to tell you something.
  18. JackBauer

    JackBauer Rookie

    Joined:
    Mar 3, 2005
    Messages:
    15,156
    Likes Received:
    14
    Ratings:
    +17 / 0 / -0

    My Jersey:

    Well, sure, if you want to make an argument that's pure sophistry on its face.

    The issue you seem to be missing, whether intentional or not, is that the comparison isn't between waterboarding and drone strikes. It's between drone strikes and the alternative.
  19. Hamar

    Hamar Rookie

    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2011
    Messages:
    2,098
    Likes Received:
    0
    Ratings:
    +1 / 0 / -0

    My Jersey:

    Drone strikes are intentional and they know for a fact that when they hit town or village that there will be innocents killed.
  20. JackBauer

    JackBauer Rookie

    Joined:
    Mar 3, 2005
    Messages:
    15,156
    Likes Received:
    14
    Ratings:
    +17 / 0 / -0

    My Jersey:

    How many innocents died when we invaded and occupied Iraq?
  21. Harry Boy

    Harry Boy Look Up, It's Amazing PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2005
    Messages:
    37,490
    Likes Received:
    22
    Ratings:
    +26 / 0 / -4

    My Jersey:

    What type of crime is throwing rocks at a wimpering little 105 lb women until she she dies (in front of her family)
  22. Hamar

    Hamar Rookie

    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2011
    Messages:
    2,098
    Likes Received:
    0
    Ratings:
    +1 / 0 / -0

    My Jersey:

    Don't know, and that is not the point (plus we were at war with Iraq). The point was about you calling water boarding a war crime as if that really meant anything. America commits war crimes all the time, why is water boarding suddenly different?
  23. JackBauer

    JackBauer Rookie

    Joined:
    Mar 3, 2005
    Messages:
    15,156
    Likes Received:
    14
    Ratings:
    +17 / 0 / -0

    My Jersey:

    It's absolutely the point, if you're trying to argue for/against the merits of drone strikes.

    While I'm loath to support actions taken by the government that constitute war crimes, I can see them being justified when the alternate course of action would be far worse/more destructive. Such a condition does not exist for waterboarding; indeed, it's an entirely unnecessary self-inflicted wound.
  24. Hamar

    Hamar Rookie

    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2011
    Messages:
    2,098
    Likes Received:
    0
    Ratings:
    +1 / 0 / -0

    My Jersey:

    The alternate course of action is far worse? Based on what? They target a village they think may have a person in it that they suspect maybe a terrorist that they think may be a threat to American lives, then they kill 10,20,100 innocent people and hope they get him too?

    But, water boarding did help us illegally kill OBL. So we water board a person and he/she is in discomfort but it may help save America lives, but that is the great evil.
  25. DarrylS

    DarrylS PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2004
    Messages:
    40,315
    Likes Received:
    19
    Ratings:
    +19 / 0 / -0

    My Jersey:

    150,000 women and children, and our religious leaders are noticeably silent..
  26. Hamar

    Hamar Rookie

    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2011
    Messages:
    2,098
    Likes Received:
    0
    Ratings:
    +1 / 0 / -0

    My Jersey:

  27. The Brandon Five

    The Brandon Five Rookie

    Joined:
    Aug 21, 2010
    Messages:
    6,027
    Likes Received:
    4
    Ratings:
    +9 / 0 / -0

    My Jersey:

    Sojourners - Iraq War
  28. The Brandon Five

    The Brandon Five Rookie

    Joined:
    Aug 21, 2010
    Messages:
    6,027
    Likes Received:
    4
    Ratings:
    +9 / 0 / -0

    My Jersey:

    So let me get this straight: detaining suspected terrorists (citizens or not) is a historic atrocity against humanity, but blowing them up along with their family and neighbors is "better than the alternative"? What alternative? Detaining them?
  29. JackBauer

    JackBauer Rookie

    Joined:
    Mar 3, 2005
    Messages:
    15,156
    Likes Received:
    14
    Ratings:
    +17 / 0 / -0

    My Jersey:

    Who said that detaining suspected terrorists is a "historic atrocity against humanity"?

    And for the tenth time, the alternative to drone strikes isn't detention. Please follow along.
  30. wistahpatsfan

    wistahpatsfan Rookie

    Joined:
    Jul 30, 2005
    Messages:
    15,671
    Likes Received:
    11
    Ratings:
    +11 / 0 / -0

    My Jersey:

    Entering Pakistan with troops or drones is illegal. We are not at war with them and havve not identified them as a terror-supporting country. We should but we won't. Instead we give them billions in military aid and support their regime politically while we know they fail to act on their own terrorists. We should pull all aid to them if we know they won't arrest their terrorists for us and extradite them, or better yet, try and convict them themselves. They are either our friends or they are not. We have no business going in there uninvited while we claim that they are a legitimate government worthy of such massive support...

    Oh, and they have nukes.....

Share This Page