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Water on moon scientist accused by US of trying to spy for Israel

Discussion in 'Political Discussion' started by weswelker#83, Oct 20, 2009.

  1. weswelker#83

    weswelker#83 Rookie

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    A scientist credited with helping discover evidence of water on the moon was arrested on charges of attempting to pass along classified information to an FBI agent posing as an Israeli intelligence officer.

    Water on moon scientist accused by US of trying to spy for Israel - World news, News - Belfasttelegraph.co.uk

    Stewart David Nozette Espionage Case



    In other words, H2O was chosen by God to be the Chosen Molecule. Water must keep the Sabbath holy .Naturally, Israel was shocked and dismayed when they heard the news.
  2. Mrs.PatsFanInVa

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    #24 Jersey

    Really, where'd you read that? Coz the article you posted simply said the Israeli's had no comment.


    The complaint does not allege that the government of Israel or anyone acting on its behalf violated US law.

    In Jerusalem, where the story broke late at night, Israeli government officials had no immediate comment.
  3. PatriotsReign

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    "If" Israel did have anything to do with this, that's really sad. What lower form if one of your own allies spies on you?

    Now, what if this man acted on his own? Why would any American SPY on his own country? Maybe he's very sick or deranged...many people are that wacked out.

    I would have rather seen us set up a REAL meeting with a representative from Israel to see if they would have tried to buy the information. Then we'd REALLY know.
  4. Mrs.PatsFanInVa

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    #24 Jersey

    According to the articles there is no "if." Israel had nothing to do with it and no knowledge that it was being done.

    We'd really know what? That the USA was capable of entrapment?
  5. Wolfpack

    Wolfpack Banned

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    Israel is stupid to do this. We're their big brother, and the last thing they should do is piss us off. This is hardly the first such accusation.
    It's probably quite likely that, like most spies, he accepted bribes.
    Last edited: Oct 20, 2009
  6. PatriotsReign

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    "According to the article...." is that good enough for you?

    Also, you can try to set up a meeting with a person who wants to buy information and that's not entrapment (see Acorn). There is more than one way to set up such a meeting without it being entrapment.

    Unfortunately, to trust your allies, you have to test them now & again. I'm sure other countries do it to us as well. Because when you get right down to it, any country that spies on another country can't be an ally. Granted, it all gets down to "If" and I have no opinion on this matter because i don't know the facts.

    But it's pretty difficult to argue against the statement: "Only enemies spy on one another."
  7. Mrs.PatsFanInVa

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    #24 Jersey

    Until there's another article stating something different and supplying it's source of information, yeah, it is.

    It's certainly better than immediately saying "What if," even though everything you've heard so far leads to the contrary - which opening then leads to someone (deliberately or otherwise) misreading what you said and making it something else entirely - as happened right here in the space of half an hour.

    At 9:23 you said ""If" Israel did have anything to do with this, that's really sad. What lower form if one of your own allies spies on you? insuinating that Israel may have had something to do with it - even though all evidence known so far points to the contrary. You sowed the seed in spite of the facts already mentioned - which is that Israel was not involved and was not charged. This is the USA and people are presumed innocent until proven guilty.

    At 10;15 Wolfpack took it one step further and said, "Israel is stupid to do this. We're their big brother, and the last thing they should do is piss us off. This is hardly the first such accusation" conveniently ignoring the fact that not only did Israel not do this but that they weren't accused of doing this, either.

    Except by your "if" insuination, of course.

    Do you even see how sh*t gets started and why people are so quick to accept lies as truth and do you even see your own moral obligation when you're making the choice between careful and careless in your word choices?

    Does it ever dawn on you that it's not "micro-managing" to seek the truth before opening your mouth and implying things which have not yet been implied? Can you see the danger involved?
  8. weswelker#83

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    Israel has a well documented history of spying on the US, and of course undermining US political processes.

    Good example:

    Charles "Chas" Freeman, Obama’s pick to head the National Intelligence Council, has withdrawn from contention for the job. The Daily Beast’s Max Blumenthal reported that the leader of the campaign against Freeman was Steven Rosen, a former director of AIPAC awaiting trial on espionage charges, who has a long history of attacking and undermining anybody he deems hostile to Israel.
    Source:
    Obama Intelligence Nominee Withdraws - Page 1 - The Daily Beast


    Nozette allegedly traveled to another foreign country with two computer thumb drives and apparently did not return with them. Prosecutors also quote an unnamed colleague of Nozette who said the scientist said that if the U.S. government ever tried to put him in jail for an unrelated criminal offense, he would go to Israel or another foreign country and "tell them everything" he knows.
    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/10/19/stewart-nozette-picture-s_n_326447.html


    I don't care if you are of Jewish ,Irish,Italian or Arab descent and you start spying on the US,it is just wrong , our country comes first......USA.It is what it is.

    BBC Article:
    BBC NEWS | Americas | US scientist charged with spying
    Last edited: Oct 20, 2009
  9. PatriotsReign

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    Just an FYI....a comment in a newspaper isn't fact...it's a comment. Fact is backed up by proof.

    And (as someone already pointed out) this isn't the first time in recent history that Israel has been linked to spying on the US.

    Shouldn't all of us be hoping this isn't true? But at the same time, keep in mind America's best interest? After all, we're all US citizens.
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    Wow...I don't know what to say to you. I clearly stated "I have no opinion on this matter because i don't know the facts." I'd say the same thing if the guy were British. "image if that blimey sob actually was spying for England?"

    Imagine....if he actually were spying for Israel? as is the case in this instance.
  11. weswelker#83

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    "The scientist provided letters with answers containing information "classified as both 'top secret' and 'secret' that concerned US satellites, early warning systems, means of defence or retaliation against large-scale attack, communications intelligence information, and major elements of defence strategy", the justice department said.
    In return, Mr Nozette accepted cash totalling $11,000, it added."



    This is just plain WRONG ! :mad:
    Last edited: Oct 20, 2009
  12. Mrs.PatsFanInVa

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    #24 Jersey

    Granted - but the sentence directly preceeding this one (which you did not post) said

    Nozette was a technical adviser for a consultant company that was wholly owned by the Israeli government. Nozette was paid about $225,000 over that period, the court papers say.

    Which leads me to think that, due to the wording "traveled to another foreign country" that leaves out Israel, which was mentioned by name in the first part of the paragraph, as the country where the thumb drives disappeared.

    Nozette was an American citizen spying on his own country for cash. It may be that ethnicity had nothing to do with it.
  13. weswelker#83

    weswelker#83 Rookie

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    "Nozette agrees to provide regular, continuing information; asks for Israeli passport and the "Right of Return" because his parents are Jewish."

    Stewart David Nozette Espionage Case



    He worked for the US , trying to give sensitive informations to another country is wrong. If his parents were french or russians or iranians , i would tell you the same thing. Wrong is Wrong . Traitor.
    Last edited: Oct 20, 2009
  14. Mrs.PatsFanInVa

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    #24 Jersey



    From the same article - it appears he didn't much care where he went.

    Nozette tells colleague that if the US Government tried to put him in jail (based on an unrelated criminal offense), Nozette would move to Israel or foreign country "A" and "tell them everything" he knows.

    Wrong is wrong, I agree. I also agree he was/is a traitor. I wonder, though, if the FBI had pretended to be a country other than Israel, would the outrage be the same or less or worse?

    Seems to me that he was more interested in cold hard cash than he was in actually helping another country.

    "Well I should tell you my first need is that they should figure out how to pay me....they don't expect me to do this for free."--Nozette to UCE

    Nozette indicated to undercover agent that he could be paid in cash up to $10,000. "Cash is fine…[I know] how to handle cash...you buy consumables…cash is good for anything…you can eat it, drink it or screw it."
    Last edited: Oct 20, 2009
  15. maverick4

    maverick4 Banned

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    That "it's stupid" isn't really a convincing reason that Israel did not and has never spied on America. There are multiple people in prison right now, after being convicted of spying for Israel and passing along top secret American information.

    How do you think they got the A-bomb. Woops, I forgot, nobody including them officially admits they have the bomb.

    Also, not surprisingly, there is a ton of outcry even now trying to get these traitors out of prison.
    Last edited: Oct 20, 2009
  16. maverick4

    maverick4 Banned

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    Completely agree that it's wrong.

    Those defending him right now are acting ethno-centrically whether they want to admit it or not.

    Reminds me a lot of the biased-no-matter-what individuals defending Roman Polansky.
  17. Mrs.PatsFanInVa

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    #24 Jersey

    Nobody's "defending him." Why would you even say that, fer cryin out loud?

    Show me one instance in this entire thread where someone defended him.
  18. Wolfpack

    Wolfpack Banned

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    It wasn't meant to be a denial that Israel spies on America and I apologize if it came out that way. Given the fact that articles like this come around every 6 months or so, I have no doubt whatsoever that Israel spies on the United States (even if this specific allegation turns out to be untrue). It is, IMHO, stupid for them to do it but they are doing it anyway.

    I remember a couple years ago a petty office in the US Navy was found guilty of doing just such a thing.
    I think they were given the a-bomb outright; I don't think it was "stolen" or anything like that.
    I don't think it's treason, but it should have severe consequences nonetheless.
    Last edited: Oct 20, 2009

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