Veteran UFA Quarterbacks - who would you prefer?

[CanadianPat'sFan]

I don't know who I would prefer, but I would be very curious to see what the Pats could do with Kyle Boller and David Carr. Are they really busts, or could they be developed into solid players? Carr was beaten up so badly his first 3 years with Houston, it really messed him up. Boller has shown flashes of being good, with long spells of poor accuracy and decision making. Don't know if either is the guy I would pick, but it would be interesting to find out.

I agree but one QB who was great up an comer until he got injured was Chris Simms. Now before everyone jumps on me BB knows this kid...I mean from way back when he coached with the Giants. He was behind Major Applewhite (who I loved...and his final game was outstanding) then became a top college QB. If this kid is healthy I would rather sign him many others but still....crap QB class is good for Cassel's trade value

 

[AzPatsFan]

Hypothetically, let's say that Cassel is traded, Brady isn't quite ready for Week 1, and O'Connell is still deemed too green.

Who among the UFA QBs would you prefer if Brady needs to sit out the first 1 to 3 games?

(I took out Kurt Warner - I think its a given that he stays in AZ or retires)

My initial gut reaction was that Losman knows the AFC East opponents the best - and that our coaches know his weaknesses well and might be able to mask them. But I'm not as up on the rest of the UFA QBs.


UNRESTRICTED FREE AGENTS:

Brian St. Pierre, Cardinals.

J.P. Losman, Bills.

Kyle Boller, Ravens.

Todd Bouman, Ravens.

Rex Grossman, Bears.

Ryan Fitzpatrick, Bengals.

Brooks Bollinger, Cowboys.

Patrick Ramsey, Broncos.

Dan Orlovsky, Lions.

Joey Harrington, Saints.

David Carr, Giants.

Anthony Wright, Giants.

Marques Tuiasosopo, Raiders.

Charlie Batch, Steelers.

Byron Leftwich, Steelers.

Jamie Martin, 49ers.

J.T. O’Sullivan, 49ers.

Charlie Frye, Seahawks.

Jeff Garcia, Buccaneers.

Luke McCown, Buccaneers.

Kerry Collins, Titans.

Chris Simms, Titans.

Source: NFL Players Association.

This post and answer underlines the STUPIDITY with which some of you act when you want to, and are oh so keen to play jr. GM.

Is there a single QB on that list that I want to have QB the Patriots for a single series, never mind a game or five?

NO E'ffn WAY. You don't do that to painstakingly rebuilt, Super Bowl Favorite contender, and maybe ruin a great chance at a Lombardi. If they weren't the Super Bowl favorite and it was just an average rebuilding year, probably they wouldn't, but not now. How often do you have a Super Bowl Favorite?

JP Loser-man?! Wrecks Grossman ?!? Get Real!

PS: They already have the best Number 2 in the league under contract, FOR 2009; and he fits under the CAP, FOR 2009. He spells his name M-A-T-T C-A-S-S-E-L !!!

 

[Real World]

O'Sullivan, Simms, Leftwich, Carr, Losman, and Ramsey.

O'Sullivan, while erratic in SF, did make some plays for that challenged team. Simms has some experience with TB. Leftwich I like, save for his Bledsoe like mobility. Carr has all the tools, and never really recovered from teh shell shocking he took in Houston each year. Losman is as liable to go 5-20, as he is 15-20, but he's got some ability too. Ramsey has some experience, and a decent arm.

 

[VJCPatriot]

UNRESTRICTED FREE AGENTS:

Brian St. Pierre, Cardinals.

J.P. Losman, Bills.

Kyle Boller, Ravens.

Todd Bouman, Ravens.

Rex Grossman, Bears.

Ryan Fitzpatrick, Bengals.

Brooks Bollinger, Cowboys.

Patrick Ramsey, Broncos.

Dan Orlovsky, Lions.

Joey Harrington, Saints.

David Carr, Giants.

Anthony Wright, Giants.

Marques Tuiasosopo, Raiders.

Charlie Batch, Steelers.

Byron Leftwich, Steelers.

Jamie Martin, 49ers.

J.T. O’Sullivan, 49ers.

Charlie Frye, Seahawks.

Jeff Garcia, Buccaneers.

Luke McCown, Buccaneers.

Kerry Collins, Titans.

Chris Simms, Titans.

Source: NFL Players Association.

This list is terrible. The only free agent QBs that look like they'd be an improvement are Warner (who will likely stay in AZ) and Mcnabb (whose future in PHilly is uncertain). I also believe that Collins will stay with the Titans because he's done a hell of a lot better job than Vince Young. This list just emphasizes how valuable Cassel is as a trade commodity. Would you rather have one of these has been or never were FA QBs or Cassel, a young guy with a future?

 

[JoeSixPat]

This post and answer underlines the STUPIDITY with which some of you act when you want to, and are oh so keen to play jr. GM.

Is there a single QB on that list that I want to have QB the Patriots for a single series, never mind a game or five?

NO E'ffn WAY. You don't do that to painstakingly rebuilt, Super Bowl Favorite contender, and maybe ruin a great chance at a Lombardi. If they weren't the Super Bowl favorite and it was just an average rebuilding year, probably they wouldn't, but not now. How often do you have a Super Bowl Favorite?

JP Loser-man?! Wrecks Grossman ?!? Get Real!

PS: They already have the best Number 2 in the league under contract, FOR 2009; and he fits under the CAP, FOR 2009. He spells his name M-A-T-T C-A-S-S-E-L !!!

Hilaarious!

Good thing you don't take yourself too seriously!

You seem very sure of yourself - but then again, most people here were sure that
Cassel wouldn't sign the tender.

Everyone else, wrap it up. You heard it here. The Patriots won't be trading Cassel or bringing in a veteran backup.

We're keen to play jr. GM, but this guy KNOWS exactly what's going to happen.

 

[mgteich]

Carr, Garcia, Batch.

Once we had an agreement in principle with one of the veterans, we could get serious about trading Cassel.

And, no I am NOT saying that the veteran would start. O'Connel might very well start.

 

[BradyBranch39]

Question: What is the date that the 49ers will have to have Alex Smith's contract restructured by? Thank you.
Brett, Moscow, Idaho

Answer: I would imagine the 49ers would want Smith to sign a new deal by the start of free agency, which is less than three weeks away. If Smith is not back, I think the 49ers would want to land a free-agent QB who could compete with Shaun Hill for the starting job. That being said, the more you hear from Jimmy Raye, Scot McCloughan and Mike Singletary, the more it seems that Smith is in their 2009 plans. It's also hard to imagine any other team giving Smith a better shot - and thus more money - than San Francisco. His new contract promises to be full of incentives, and the opportunity for playing time will be key. If he's back and is healthy, he will get to compete for the starting job. Still, it's certainly not a foregone conclusion that Smith will return. He and his agent, Tom Condon, could force the 49ers to release Smith, making him a free agent. If that were to occur, the teams that might show interest are Detroit (no quarterback, Scott Linehan connection) and San Diego (Norv Turner connection, hometown). The one place you will not see Smith: Denver.
- Matt

49ers Blog and Q&A: Q&A: Clock ticking on Alex Smith

 

[CanadianPat'sFan]

Hilaarious!

Good thing you don't take yourself too seriously!

You seem very sure of yourself - but then again, most people here were sure that
Cassel wouldn't sign the tender.

Everyone else, wrap it up. You heard it here. The Patriots won't be trading Cassel or bringing in a veteran backup.

We're keen to play jr. GM, but this guy KNOWS exactly what's going to happen.

Finally!! This guy makes me laugh as well!!

It is funny he mocks all of us Junior GMs when he turns right around and provides his opions (just like we do) but he thinks he is the only one who knows anything. He beleives our team is SB ready with no holes as it is currently. S, LB, OL are not a priority in his mind and is fine with Bruschi and Harrison playing 18 games and lead us to the SB. I just thank god everyday that he sent us all a knowledgeable SENIOR GM to keep us all strait

In a month when we do trade Cassel he will be the first one to start to bash the decision and mock the draft picks we get as well as FA we will sign to make our team younger and better for 2009.

I kinda like the title of Junior GM but this guys sure aint Sr.

 

[DaBruinz]

PS: They already have the best Number 2 in the league under contract, FOR 2009; and he fits under the CAP, FOR 2009. He spells his name M-A-T-T C-A-S-S-E-L !!!

Cassel hasn't officially signed the Franchise tag. And, having him signed for the 14.65 million isn't a good thing in the least. Why? Because that leaves virutally no room to improve this team. And, if you think that this team is perfect the way it is, then you are sadly mistaken.

 

[farn]

They are not quite what you would want, but I think that if healthy, you could probably be Ok with Batch for two games.

But, I still think O'Connell would be the best option after Brady and Cassel. BUt really... how many of us ACTUALLY think Cassel is coming back. I think it's not gonna happen. Sure, he FITS for the time being, money-wise. But, I've got to think the "we look forward to blah blah blah 2009" that BB is stating really means "I can't believe some crazy GM is gonna give me his #1 for a 7th rounder !"

 

[JoeSixPat]

They are not quite what you would want, but I think that if healthy, you could probably be Ok with Batch for two games.

But, I still think O'Connell would be the best option after Brady and Cassel. BUt really... how many of us ACTUALLY think Cassel is coming back. I think it's not gonna happen. Sure, he FITS for the time being, money-wise. But, I've got to think the "we look forward to blah blah blah 2009" that BB is stating really means "I can't believe some crazy GM is gonna give me his #1 for a 7th rounder !"

I think Cassel could wind up staying here next season - if he doesn't find the right team at the right deal. He can block any trade by refusing to negotiate a long term deal with the team.

He may be looking for $25 -30 million guaranteed as part of a long term deal - of course the team would need to trade a pick to the Patriots as well - so that might limit the market somewhat... time will tell. I do think Cassel wants to start somewhere, but his fallback plan is to stay here, collect a cool $15 million this season, and enter the FA market without poor play or injury hurting his market value PLUS the fact that no team would likely need give up a draft pick to get him.

That'd net him much more in guranteed money than just accepting a trade alone.

So while I still don't think that will happen, its not up to the Patriots or Bill Belichick regardess of what our GM friend from Arizona thinks. It's up to Cassel, as the person who can block a trade.

 

[AzPatsFan]

Finally!! This guy makes me laugh as well!!

It is funny he mocks all of us Junior GMs when he turns right around and provides his opions (just like we do) but he thinks he is the only one who knows anything. He beleives our team is SB ready with no holes as it is currently. S, LB, OL are not a priority in his mind and is fine with Bruschi and Harrison playing 18 games and lead us to the SB. I just thank god everyday that he sent us all a knowledgeable SENIOR GM to keep us all strait

In a month when we do trade Cassel he will be the first one to start to bash the decision and mock the draft picks we get as well as FA we will sign to make our team younger and better for 2009.

I kinda like the title of Junior GM but this guys sure aint Sr.

Never said I was; and I used the term we Jr. GMs...

I just see things through a different lens. So far everything I thought has been coming along, while y'all are being proven wrong....

 

[CanadianPat'sFan]

Never said I was; and I used the term we Jr. GMs...

I just see things through a different lens. So far everything I thought has been coming along, while y'all are being proven wrong....

" Originally Posted by AzPatsFan View Post
This post and answer underlines the STUPIDITY with which some of you act when you want to, and are oh so keen to play jr. GM.

Is there a single QB on that list that I want to have QB the Patriots for a single series, never mind a game or five?

NO E'ffn WAY. You don't do that to painstakingly rebuilt, Super Bowl Favorite contender, and maybe ruin a great chance at a Lombardi. If they weren't the Super Bowl favorite and it was just an average rebuilding year, probably they wouldn't, but not now. How often do you have a Super Bowl Favorite?

JP Loser-man?! Wrecks Grossman ?!? Get Real!

PS: They already have the best Number 2 in the league under contract, FOR 2009; and he fits under the CAP, FOR 2009. He spells his name M-A-T-T C-A-S-S-E-L !!!"




Well now lets break this one down!!

The first text in bold shows that you try to include yourself with us as Jr. GM's

The second text shows we were right that Cassel would be franchised

The third bold text shows that you did not include yourself when referencing GM's so it kinda make you point senseless. No we there my friend.

The fourth bold text will not happen, but in a month when Cassel is traded, I hope we can revisit this whole argument. No worries though I like this debate

 

[Patsfanin Philly]

Carr is the perfect example of a guy with great talent and skills messed up by poor coaching. Throwing him into the fire with an expansion team was the worst decision the Texans could have made.

I think the ridiculous work-over Carr did on the Patriots in last years' preseason and his halfway decent showing with Carolina are much closer to the true David Carr than the shellshocked Texans QB, who despite that still has had a better career than 90% of the QBs on the OP's list. And even that might be an understatement; only Kerry Collins has really had a better career that I can see.

In many respects, Carr's career mirrors that of Jim Plunkett. Both came in as the #1 pick to save a franchise and got savaged behind awful offensive lines and were labeled as busts. Only on his third team (Oak) after 7 years in the league did Plunkett have talent around him and shined, winning 8 of 10 playoff games and two Super Bowls. Am I saying that Carr will win 2 SB? No but I wouldn't write him off totally just yet. As a #1, he got paid so maybe he just wants to win.......

 

[JoeSixPat]

"... you did not include yourself when referencing GM's so it kinda make you point senseless. No we there my friend.

The fourth bold text will not happen, but in a month when Cassel is traded, I hope we can revisit this whole argument. No worries though I like this debate

Yeah - I love it when those who are "holier than thou" wind up being wrong. The list of those who righteously mocked those of us who felt that it would be a no-brainer for Cassel to sign the tender are wishing they hadn't been so strident.

There used to be another Arizona Pats fan who liked to call other posters stupid who was finally banned from this website - though the rudeness of calling other posters "STUPID" in this case doesn't come close to those infractions.

The bottom line that our friend from Arizona doesn't seem to comprehend (although I note that I'm only a jr. GM) is that now that Cassel has signed the tender, Bill Belichick isn't the one who can decide whether Cassel gets traded. Cassel can block any trade by refusing to negotiate a long term contract.

So while there's a chance he may be right that Cassel isn't going anywhere, it's not necessarily because Belichick doesn't want to trade him.

It might just be that Cassel doesn't like the team he would be traded to or the long-term deal they would offer - and and might choose to sit tight, collect $15 million on the bench as Brady's backup, risking little injury - nor any stigma for not being deemed the starter ahead of Brady - and maintain a high value for free agency in 2010 - when teams won't need to compensate the Patriots with draft picks either (unless the Pats franchise him again at $17.6 million and risk the same scenario playing out, which probably wouldn't happen).

 

[WhiskeyBreath]

Scratch Luke McCown off the list. He was just re-signed by Tampa.

 

[VJ11]

UNRESTRICTED FREE AGENTS:

Brian St. Pierre, Cardinals.

Chris Simms, Titans.

Source: NFL Players Association.

These are the only two candidates I would consider bringing in, and even Simms has some question marks surrounding his health status I would like to see cleared up with a physical before eventually signing him. The rest on the list are either too old or too young and ambitious. Those guys think they still have a shot at becoming a starter in the right situation. That situation doesn't exist at the Patriots. The old guys still command a bit too much in terms of salary for what they essentially are: backup QBs with the capability to start 2 or 3 games if needed.

 

[JoeSixPat]

These are the only two candidates I would consider bringing in, and even Simms has some question marks surrounding his health status I would like to see cleared up with a physical before eventually signing him. The rest on the list are either too old or too young and ambitious. Those guys think they still have a shot at becoming a starter in the right situation. That situation doesn't exist at the Patriots. The old guys still command a bit too much in terms of salary for what they essentially are: backup QBs with the capability to start 2 or 3 games if needed.

I like your thinking... you maybe offer them a 2 year non-guranteed contract and give them some significant pre-season playing time to show what they can do with Moss and Welker as WRs - potentially developing some trade value for next season... though I adit I don't know much about St. Pierre.

 

[farn]

I think Cassel could wind up staying here next season - if he doesn't find the right team at the right deal. He can block any trade by refusing to negotiate a long term deal with the team.

So while I still don't think that will happen, its not up to the Patriots or Bill Belichick regardess of what our GM friend from Arizona thinks. It's up to Cassel, as the person who can block a trade.

Cassel COULD be the blocker... but do you see that happening ? Sounds uncharacteristic. I think he will be looking for some goodies, but be an enabler rather than a blocker. It's to his advantage to be the good soldier, as more and more teams are trying to avoid cranky players. I see him moving and being a pro during the process.