* Top 64: What Are Your First 4 Picks?? *

[TriplecHamp]

Patrick Peterson
Michael Floyd or Ryan Williams
Jared Crick
If we need to make a trade with another pick to pull all three so be it

 

[BlackFrancis]

1a. Allen Bailey DE Miami - Someone inevitably will say he is a one gap player. I won't dispute that he might excel as a one gap end but watching the way they use him, he really does a little bit of everything. I think his versatility is something Belichick would enjoy playing with.

1b. Anthony Costanzo OT BC - Did well with the last couple BC linemen the Patriots have picked.

2a. Ryan Kerrigan DE Perdue - Not particularly fast and not the world's greatest athlete but he's got the size and one of the best motors in college football.

2b. Noel Divine RB WVU - Highly doubtful he could handle being a full time back but Divine is a highlight reel waiting to happen.

 

[Wilfork#75]

Obviously being so early in the season, there are a number of factors that will affect the Pats 2011 draft. The biggest of which is possibly a new CBA and potential rookie wage scale. For the purpose of this I’m going to assume that a new CBA has been agreed and the rookie wage scale is in place. In this scenario I would be very aggressive in this draft, moving up to take quality over quantity. With the large number of young players added to the roster over the course of the last two years I think complementing that with high end talent rather than young depth would be the best option.

Another interesting scenario is the case of Brandon Meriweather. He is clearly out of favor with the coaches, and if he doesn’t step up his game this season and start playing how he is coached, I could see the Pats moving on after this season. He is off contract after the 2011 season and would probably be in line for a big contract. So I wouldn’t be surprised to see the Pats move Meriweather after the 2010 season to get some value for him, rather than wait another year and have him leave as a FA. As we have seen in the past BB would rather get rid of a player a year too early than a year too late. A young pro bowl safety like Meriweather should get the Patriots at least a 2nd round pick in return. If this were the case, instead of drafting a new FS, I would like to see the Pats draft one of the lock down corners at the top of the draft, and move Devin McCourty to FS. While I think McCourty will be a stud CB, I think he could be an elite FS.

In this scenario my draft would go something like this:

Trade
Logan Mankins- A 2nd and 5th seems like fair value
Meriweather- 2nd
Franchise and Trade Moss- As much as I love Randy I’ve got to go with the long term view here. I think some team would give up a 2nd rounder for him.
Use 3rd and 4th + future pick to get another 2nd
Use two 2nd’s to get another 1st

That leaves three 1st round picks, four 2nd round picks and some mid round picks to use to move up to get targeted players

1a- CB- Patrick Peterson LSU/ CB- Prince Amukamara- Neb
I would take either of these two in a heartbeat. Two of the best corners to enter the draft in a long time. True shutdown corner prospects. Peterson’s versatility and special teams ability has him slightly ahead.

1b- RB- Mark Ingram- Bama
I’m normally against taking a RB in the 1st round but Ingram is a special case. He is the most complete back to enter the draft in years and I think he is the perfect fit for the Patriots. He can run between the tackles, has the speed to bounce outside, he is a great pass catcher and a willing blocker. His talent and versatility would make him a huge weapon in the Pats offence.

1c- WR- Julio Jones- Bama
AJ Green is the best WR in this draft class, but I think Julio Jones is the best fit for the Pats. He is and incredible athlete and perhaps has a higher ceiling than Green because of it. But it is the little things I love about Jones. He is versatile and has experience lining up outside as well as in the slot. He plays in a pro style offence and runs very crisp pro routes. He is also about as good a blocker as you will see in a WR. If he is not catching balls he is blocking down field setting up holes for his teammates. This is perhaps what I like best about Jones. He plays in a team with a lot of weapons and doesn’t complain if he doesn’t get the ball. I could see him becoming Welker’s best friend, setting up screens and blocking downfield. Another thing that can’t be underestimated, is that like Ingram, coming from Alabama you know he is well coached.

2a- DE/OLB- Da’Quan Bowers- Clemson
I love this guy projected to OLB for the Pats in the Willie McGinest elephant role. A monster of a man at 6-4, 275, he is hugely athletic. A Julius Peppers type athlete. He can rush the passer as well as set the edge against the run. I believe he has the athleticism to drop into coverage, and he also has some experience playing in the two point stance at Clemson. He is perhaps the most versatile DL in college football. He currently has a second round grade, but if he has the year I’m expecting he could wind up in the top 10. He is already my favorite player in the draft

2b- OLB- Akeem Ayers- UCLA
Good size at 6-4, 252, Ayers is a very good all around OLB for the 3-4 system. He is a talented pass-rusher, but he is perhaps even better in coverage, which is very rare for a 3-4 OLB. I think he would be a great fit for the Pats because of his versatility, and would add much needed depth to the weak OLB corp.

2c- OG/C- Rodney Hudson- Florida State
Another guy with great versatility, Hudson is one of the most talented interior linemen in this draft class. I think he would be a great replacement for Logan Mankins or be groomed to take over from Dan Coppen. A really solid 2nd round pick.

2d- OT- Nate Soldier- Colorado
Another versatile O-Lineman, Soldier has great size and athleticism and can play LT or RT. Similar to Sebastian Vollmer, Soldier is very raw, but has a ton of upside. Vollmer and Soldier could be bookend tackles for the Pats for the next decade

4- RB- John Clay- Wisconsin
A big, bruising short yardage back to complement Ingram. Could also play some fullback.

As you can see I place a high emphasis on versatility, which is what all of these players would bring. I also haven’t got and DL in this mock. This is for two reasons. Firstly, I don’t see any players of value in the first round that fit the two gap system. While there are some talented 3-4 DE’s, they just aren’t great fits for the Pats. However, one guy I do like in the 2nd round is Derek Wolfe from Cincinnati. The second reason I didn’t select any DL is because I would like to see what some of the young DL already on the roster can do. I have high hopes for guys like Deaderick, Weston, and Love who fit the prototype 2-gap DE. Like in the secondary, I believe the talent is there, it will just take time to develop it. I also believe that with the scarcity of good 2-gap 3-4 DE’s, and as the 3-4 has become more popular in the NFL, driving these players values up, BB will move away from trying to find the next Richard Seymore or Ty Warren in the 1st round, and develop these prototype 2-gap DE’s from later rounds.

 

[patsfaninpa]

We're not going to trade Mankins now. He'll report for the last 6 games. He'll become a UFA at the end of the year and go back to the west coast. We'll get a 3 in 2012 draft as compensation. The Carolina pick is practically like having 3 firsts. Probably top 3-5 in 2nd round.

I'm going against popular opinion and not going to take a 2-gap 3-4 end early. We have Ty Warren coming back and Ron Brace emerging. Couple of vets to rotate in for depth; G.Warren and M. Wright. B.Deaderick could provide depth too. We have a gaping hole at olb. TBC is a situational pass rusher. We need someone to get pressure off of the edge more than a 2-gap de. All of our defensive linemen are dt's when we got to a 4-2-5 package. That's why I'd prefer a guy like Quinn over Heyward or Dareus. And, I'd also like to draft someone early to push Cunningham and rotate with. A guy like A.Ayers or R.Kerrigan. One of those first 3 picks has to be an OL if Mankins walks. I know I haven't projected a rb until our second 2nd rounder pick. D.Williams is a UFA after this season. I'm very interested in adding him if BJGE isn't looking like a full-time starter.


1a - Robert. Quinn - OLB - UNC
1b - ol, olb or rb (L Ziemba)
2a - ol, olb or rb (R. Kerrigan)
2b - ol, olb or rb (N. Devine)
3 - You know damn well we're going to trade this for some teams 2nd rounder in 2012.

Still have 2 fourth rounders. Ours and Denver

 

[Off The Grid]

Patrick Peterson
Michael Floyd or Ryan Williams
Jared Crick


CB Patrick Peterson ~ LSU Tiggers!! ~ 6.1/210

WR Michael Floyd ~ Notre Dame Fighting IRISH!! ~ 6.3/220

DE Jared Crick ~ Nebraska CornHuskers!! ~ 6.6/285

If we need to make a trade with another pick to pull all three so be it

Gotta love your certainty, Bro!!

ANOTHER guy greedy for another CornerBack!! DAAAAAAMN!!

 

[Off The Grid]

1a. Allen Bailey DE Miami 6.4/288 - Someone inevitably will say he is a one gap player. I won't dispute that he might excel as a one gap end but watching the way they use him, he really does a little bit of everything. I think his versatility is something Belichick would enjoy playing with.

1b. Anthony Costanzo OT BC 6.7/310 - Did well with the last couple BC linemen the Patriots have picked.

2a. Ryan Kerrigan OLB Perdue 6.4/264 - Not particularly fast and not the world's greatest athlete but he's got the size and one of the best motors in college football.

2b. Noel Devine RB WVU 5.8/180 - Highly doubtful he could handle being a full time back but Divine is a highlight reel waiting to happen.

Bold picks!!

You'll get some flack for them, I'm sure, but one must respect that you've thought these through...

Kerrigan is interesting. He was brought up in the Flanker ~ OLB to you Earthlings! ~ thread. Above ALL ~ in the ENTIRE Draft ~ I want Robert Quinn...But if we don't get him, Kerrigan could be a nice addition to the crew.

 

[MrNathanDrake]

1a) Patrick Peterson CB - too good to pass up, and we have enough picks later on to find OLB
Robert Quinn OLB/DE
Adrian Clayborn DE
Marcel Dareus DE/DT
AJ Green WR
Stephen Paea DE/DT
Cameron Heyward DE


That's my big board right now. One of those guys should be there by our first pick (assuming they all declare).

1b) Ryan Kerrigan OLB/DE
Mark Ingram RB
Prince Amukamara CB

2a) Running Back or OG

 

[TriplecHamp]

Gotta love your certainty, Bro!!

ANOTHER guy greedy for another CornerBack!! DAAAAAAMN!!

Haha great job,I think the addition of Peterson and Crick would solidify the defense for years to come granted we pick up another pass rusher to give us a nice rotation TBC and Cunningham. Merriweather and Chung are solid, Peterson on one side, Bodden on the other McCourty, Butler, Wilhite, Wheatly, and Arrington is probably the best rotation in the NFL talent wise. Wilfork, Crick and Warren will be the longterm starters with Brace, Warren, and Wright behind them. Id like to add another back on offense but RB is pretty shallow this year IMO so we should probably pick somebody up late to go along with Woodhead, Morris/Taylor and BJGE. Weather we resign Moss or not we need another receiver as of right now and Michael Floyd is a smart big weapon for Brady in the vincent Jackson mold. Upgrade Guard and this team is set

 

[Off The Grid]

This...is just an exquisitely crafted piece of work, my friend.

Obviously being so early in the season, there are a number of factors that will affect the Pats 2011 draft. The biggest of which is possibly a new CBA and potential rookie wage scale. For the purpose of this I’m going to assume that a new CBA has been agreed and the rookie wage scale is in place.

In this scenario I would be very aggressive in this draft, moving up to take quality over quantity. With the large number of young players added to the roster over the course of the last two years I think complementing that with high end talent rather than young depth would be the best option.

Damned strong point!!

Not the way I would play it, but it's an awfully good Argument.

Another interesting scenario is the case of Brandon Meriweather. He is clearly out of favor with the coaches, and if he doesn’t step up his game this season and start playing how he is coached, I could see the Pats moving on after this season. He is off contract after the 2011 season and would probably be in line for a big contract. So I wouldn’t be surprised to see the Pats move Meriweather after the 2010 season to get some value for him, rather than wait another year and have him leave as a FA. As we have seen in the past BB would rather get rid of a player a year too early than a year too late. A young pro bowl safety like Meriweather should get the Patriots at least a 2nd round pick in return.

* If this were the case, instead of drafting a new FS, I would like to see the Pats draft one of the lock down corners at the top of the draft, and move Devin McCourty to FS. While I think McCourty will be a stud CB, I think he could be an elite FS.

Wow.

Truly a GroundBreaking idea, Brother Wilfork!!

And it makes a lot of sense: As talented as Meriweather is, I can easily envision McCourty shortly becoming a dramatic upgrade to him: Excuse my French, but SCREW the Interceptions and HighLight Reels: McCourty has Rapid Closing Speed, Diabolical Quickness, Liquidity of Movement, and tremendous Processing Speed. Above all, he buys into the Team Concept completely, so he'll stick to his assignments...and he's not afraid to HIT. Dare I say? We could have a young Ed Reed, here.

Your notion is nothing short of Brilliant.

In this scenario my draft would go something like this:

Trades

* Logan Mankins- A 2nd and 5th seems like fair value
* Brandon Meriweather- 2nd
* Franchise and Trade Moss- As much as I love Randy I’ve got to go with the long term view here. I think some team would give up a 2nd rounder for him.
* Use 3rd and 4th + future pick to get another 2nd
* Use two 2nd’s to get another 1st

That leaves three 1st round picks, four 2nd round picks and some mid round picks to use to move up to get targeted players...

1a - CB Patrick Peterson - LSU/ CB Prince Amukamara - Nebraska

I would take either of these two in a heartbeat. Two of the best corners to enter the draft in a long time. True shutdown corner prospects. Peterson’s versatility and special teams ability has him slightly ahead.

1b - RB Mark Ingram - Bama

I’m normally against taking a RB in the 1st round but Ingram is a special case. He is the most complete back to enter the draft in years and I think he is the perfect fit for the Patriots. He can run between the tackles, has the speed to bounce outside, he is a great pass catcher and a willing blocker. His talent and versatility would make him a huge weapon in the Pats offence.

1c - WR Julio Jones - Bama

AJ Green is the best WR in this draft class, but I think Julio Jones is the best fit for the Pats. He is and incredible athlete and perhaps has a higher ceiling than Green because of it. But it is the little things I love about Jones. He is versatile and has experience lining up outside as well as in the slot. He plays in a pro style offence and runs very crisp pro routes. He is also about as good a blocker as you will see in a WR. If he is not catching balls he is blocking down field setting up holes for his teammates. This is perhaps what I like best about Jones. He plays in a team with a lot of weapons and doesn’t complain if he doesn’t get the ball. I could see him becoming Welker’s best friend, setting up screens and blocking downfield. Another thing that can’t be underestimated, is that like Ingram, coming from Alabama you know he is well coached.

2a - DE/OLB Da’Quan Bowers - Clemson

I love this guy projected to OLB for the Pats in the Willie McGinest elephant role. A monster of a man at 6-4, 275, he is hugely athletic. A Julius Peppers type athlete. He can rush the passer as well as set the edge against the run. I believe he has the athleticism to drop into coverage, and he also has some experience playing in the two point stance at Clemson. He is perhaps the most versatile DL in college football. He currently has a second round grade, but if he has the year I’m expecting he could wind up in the top 10. He is already my favorite player in the draft

2b - OLB Akeem Ayers - UCLA

Good size at 6-4, 252, Ayers is a very good all around OLB for the 3-4 system. He is a talented pass-rusher, but he is perhaps even better in coverage, which is very rare for a 3-4 OLB. I think he would be a great fit for the Pats because of his versatility, and would add much needed depth to the weak OLB corp.

2c - OG/C Rodney Hudson - Florida State

Another guy with great versatility, Hudson is one of the most talented interior linemen in this draft class. I think he would be a great replacement for Logan Mankins or be groomed to take over from Dan Coppen. A really solid 2nd round pick.

2d - OT Nate Solder - Colorado

Another versatile O-Lineman, Solder has great size and athleticism and can play LT or RT. Similar to Sebastian Vollmer, Solder is very raw, but has a ton of upside. Vollmer and Solder could be bookend tackles for the Pats for the next decade.

4 - RB John Clay - Wisconsin

A big, bruising short yardage back to complement Ingram. Could also play some fullback.

As you can see I place a high emphasis on versatility, which is what all of these players would bring. I also haven’t got any DL in this mock. This is for two reasons. Firstly, I don’t see any players of value in the first round that fit the two gap system. While there are some talented 3-4 DE’s, they just aren’t great fits for the Pats. However, one guy I do like in the 2nd round is Derek Wolfe from Cincinnati. The second reason I didn’t select any DL is because I would like to see what some of the young DL already on the roster can do. I have high hopes for guys like Deaderick, Weston, and Love who fit the prototype 2-gap DE. Like in the secondary, I believe the talent is there, it will just take time to develop it.



* I also believe that with the scarcity of good 2-gap 3-4 DE’s, and as the 3-4 has become more popular in the NFL, driving these players values up, BB will move away from trying to find the next Richard Seymour or Ty Warren in the 1st round, and develop these prototype 2-gap DE’s from later rounds.

Well, for my money: Even while I disagree, philosophically, with targeting WideOuts and Running Backs in the early rounds, I have to LOVE this Body of Work!! :rocker:

 

[Wilfork#75]

Thanks Off The Grid, its good to get feedback on ideas.

My belief is that while we have assets that others desire and we value less (Mankins, an aging Moss and a freelancing Meriweather) we should trade them to add more value to the team, rather than just letting them walk. I still have some hope that Mankins will be traded and I have always believed that if it is going to happen it will happen during the bye week, when teams are most desperate to improve before the deadline. And while I like Mankins as a player I don’t like the way he has handled the situation and I don’t feel he is worth the money he wants. Moss I would love to keep but realistically I think it is best for the long term success of the team to move on. In a year when the Pats can get a top WR in the draft (at a reasonable cost with a rookie wage scale), I would do it. And if the CBA allows it I would franchise and trade Moss to get value form him, because I believe someone will offer at least a 2nd for him, even at his age.

Im also sick of Meriweather’s selfish act and if he doesn’t start to turn it around I think its time to move on. Part of the reason behind my idea of moving McCourty to FS was because he seems to have the perfect skill set to excel there. And everything I have heard about his is how smart a player he is and how well he picks things up. This is why I think he would make a great leader of the secondary at the FS position, which is what Meriweather was suppose to be. The second reason behind this is while we have young, talented CB’s, Im worried about their size. Both McCourty and Butler are relatively short CB’s, matching up with some of the big WR’s in the AFC East (Marshall, Edwards). This is where I think adding a big, athletic, shut down corner like Peterson would be a huge advantage. He has the ability to match up with these bigger wideouts where Butler and McCourty could struggle. A secondary of Peterson and Bodden starting CB’s, Butler in the Nickle, McCourty as FS and Chung at SS could develop into an elite secondary with some experience.

While I would normally agree with you about not taking a running back or wideout in the first round, I see the 2011 draft as a special case. I believe Mark Ingram is the perfect fit for the Pats system because he is such a complete back. He runs hard between the tackles with great instincts and vision, but he also catches the ball well out of the backfield and has enough speed to run outside. There is no other backs I would touch in the 1st round of the draft because they don’t offer the same versatility as Ingram. I also see Julio Jones as a rare opportunity because it is not often the Pats get a shot at a genuine #1 receiver in the draft. There are 4 genuine #1 wideout prospects in this draft so there should be value to get one in the 10-18 range, and I would love any of them. But overall I like Jones the most because of what he brings to the table apart from just catching the ball. He isn’t a ‘Diva’ and I think he would just fit well. It’s also no surprise that I have two Alabama players high on my board. While the Crimson Tide have the most talent in college football they are also the best coached, and I put a lot of stock in that when looking at players. Perhaps that is why I am so high on Brandon Deaderick as a future starter at DE. Saban just teaches his kids the right way and prepares then well for the NFL.

I also have a hard time finding players that fit the system and offer value in the first round. Most projected talent in the first round of this draft just doesn’t seem to fit. There are a lot of talented DL that just don’t fit the 2-gap system. There is also a lot of depth in the secondary, but apart from Peterson and Amukamara, I don’t feel the value would be there because of the recent high picks in previous years. While philosophically I also believe in building through the trenches I just don’t see it as an option here. The DL don’t fit, and while it is a fairly week OL draft, it seems to be quite deep in areas of the Patriots needs. While there don’t seem to be many elite LT prospects, there are quite a few 2nd round RT, as well as mid round center and guard prospects. So what my projections really come down to is value and opportunity cost. If you don’t take Ingram or a stud WR in round 1 that there is a big drop off to later rounds. If you don’t take a DL, LB or OL early, there is less of a drop off and still value in the 2nd round.

My biggest concern for the 2011 draft is the lack of a CBA. I think the uncertainty of whether or not there will be a 2011 season could dramatically affect the amount of underclassmen declaring for the draft. Especially from the larger programs such as Alabama who have National Title aspirations. Why would a player declare early with the possibility of no season in 2011 when they could return to school and win (possibly a third straight) National Title. If this is the case and the draft class is weakened by a lack of underclassmen, than the high picks the Pats have are somewhat negated by the lack of talent. In this scenario I could see BB moving even more picks forward than usual into an especially strong 2012 draft.

But in the end everyone has their own opinions about how their team should draft. I just love to study the draft and discuss it with others that feel the same (which is very difficult here in Australia). That’s the reason I joined this forum, because it’s the best place to intelligently discuss the Pats draft all year round.

 

[doesntmatter1]

I like the play of mccourty alot. alot, but ^wilfork 75 lineup of bodden mccourty merri and peterson sounds amazing. is it me or does mccourty remind you of a faster malcom jenkins.

 

[The Brandon Five]

1b) DT/DE Nick Fairley from Auburn (6'5 #315 4.97) YouTube - Nick Fairley vs Mississippi State

:yeahthat:

Not sure how good the Miss. State O-Line is this year (see here), but Fairley was impressive in that game.

 

[bakes781]

Too early to predict, but the one guy I want in a Pat's uni in 2011 is Julio Jones for sure!

 

[Box_O_Rocks]

Thanks Off The Grid, its good to get feedback on ideas.

Thought provoking arguments, well done. If NE landed Peterson, I'd be more inclined to move him to FS where his ball hawking skill set could have more range to exploit. You can also see the future with a McCourty/Peterson/Bodden secondary where the challenge for the QB is to guess which one is going to play CB on any particular play, a 3-way version of Harrison/Law in 2003, which with Chung's athleticism exceeding Rodney's, has the potential to be a 4-way mind rape, 5-way with Butler at NB. Inspired cruelty W75! :rocker:

My belief is that while we have assets that others desire and we value less (Mankins, an aging Moss and a freelancing Meriweather) we should trade them to add more value to the team, rather than just letting them walk. I still have some hope that Mankins will be traded and I have always believed that if it is going to happen it will happen during the bye week, when teams are most desperate to improve before the deadline. And while I like Mankins as a player I don’t like the way he has handled the situation and I don’t feel he is worth the money he wants.

I think it's too early to be certain about Connolly, he's played well, but how will he look to us later in the season after defensive coaches start identifying his tendencies and coaching their DL on how to attack/set-up his weaknesses? Mankins has been more often exploited since the NYG turned their late-season experience into a new game plan. Mankins is also an ironman for the team. If NE gets a fair trade offer, so be it, but if they can nail down one Guard slot in the face of Neal's seasonal uncertainties, I'm not going to kick.

 

[jsull87]

Thanks Off The Grid, its good to get feedback on ideas.

My biggest concern for the 2011 draft is the lack of a CBA. I think the uncertainty of whether or not there will be a 2011 season could dramatically affect the amount of underclassmen declaring for the draft. Especially from the larger programs such as Alabama who have National Title aspirations. Why would a player declare early with the possibility of no season in 2011 when they could return to school and win (possibly a third straight) National Title. If this is the case and the draft class is weakened by a lack of underclassmen, than the high picks the Pats have are somewhat negated by the lack of talent. In this scenario I could see BB moving even more picks forward than usual into an especially strong 2012 draft.
.

If there is no season i think it will be damn hard for BB to be moving his picks forward because i think all teams will be aware of the differing draft strength's

I just think the pats are in such an interesting situation atm. We have so many draft picks in the high rounds + we have 9 picks in the 1st 2 rounds over the last two years that we want to develop. Add in late rounders Edelman, Hernandez and now the good play of Connoly ( i know it's only 3 games but thats all i have to go on at this stage) We have alot of ammo but not alot of glaring weaknesses other than " our D is not performing" or "we need a pass rush" but i have been reading the board and people havent had much consensus if we want 1st round OLB value or 1st round DE value... then people say... lets go CB again.

Just a very interesting time when the next draft comes round

 

[Off The Grid]

1a) Patrick Peterson CB - too good to pass up, and we have enough picks later on to find OLB
Robert Quinn OLB/DE
Adrian Clayborn DE
Marcel Dareus DE/DT
AJ Green WR
Stephen Paea DE/DT
Cameron Heyward DE


That's my big board right now. One of those guys should be there by our first pick (assuming they all declare).

1b) Ryan Kerrigan OLB/DE
Mark Ingram RB
Prince Amukamara CB

2a) Running Back or OG

Looking good, Bro.

A delectable menu of Talent.

 

[Off The Grid]

We're not going to trade Mankins now. He'll report for the last 6 games. He'll become a UFA at the end of the year and go back to the west coast. We'll get a 3 in 2012 draft as compensation. The Carolina pick is practically like having 3 firsts. Probably top 3-5 in 2nd round.

That seems like a distinct possibility, I'm afraid.

However, if I had to place my best guess, today, it would be the same as my wishes: Mankins comes to his senses and signs.

Of course: That's assuming that Kraft and Belichick still want him.

But with Neal rapidly fading, I sure as hell hope they do.

I'm going against popular opinion and not going to take a 2-gap 3-4 end early. We have Ty Warren coming back and Ron Brace emerging. Couple of vets to rotate in for depth; G.Warren and M. Wright. B.Deaderick could provide depth too.

You know: Even though I am a FANATIC about drafting Front Wall before ANYONE else, I think you make a VERY strong Argument, here. Combining that with Wilford's insightfull comments about what I'll call "3-4 Personnel Inflation", I'm persuaded that it's an approach that makes one hell of a lot of sense, particularly considering the dearth of quality Ends, in the coming year.

We have a gaping hole at olb. TBC is a situational pass rusher. We need someone to get pressure off of the edge more than a 2-gap de. All of our defensive linemen are dt's when we got to a 4-2-5 package. That's why I'd prefer a guy like Quinn over Heyward or Dareus. And, I'd also like to draft someone early to push Cunningham and rotate with. A guy like A.Ayers or R.Kerrigan.

I absolutely couldn't've put it better.

One of those first 3 picks has to be an OL if Mankins walks. I know I haven't projected a rb until our second 2nd rounder pick. D.Williams is a UFA after this season. I'm very interested in adding him if BJGE isn't looking like a full-time starter.

1A - OLB Robert Quinn ~ North Carolina TarHeels!!

1B - OT Lee Ziemba ~ Auburn Tiggers!!

2A - OLB Ryan Kerrigan ~ Purdue BoilerMakers!!

2B - RB Noel DeVine ~ West Virginia Mountaineers!!

3 - You know damn well we're going to trade this for some teams 2nd rounder in 2012.

Still have 2 fourth rounders. Ours and Denver

 

[Off The Grid]

Thought provoking arguments, well done. If NE landed Peterson, I'd be more inclined to move him to FS where his ball hawking skill set could have more range to exploit. You can also see the future with a McCourty/Peterson/Bodden secondary where the challenge for the QB is to guess which one is going to play CB on any particular play, a 3-way version of Harrison/Law in 2003, which with Chung's athleticism exceeding Rodney's, has the potential to be a 4-way mind rape, 5-way with Butler at NB. Inspired cruelty W75! :rocker:

BEAUTIFULLY put!!

I think it's too early to be certain about Connolly, he's played well, but how will he look to us later in the season after defensive coaches start identifying his tendencies and coaching their DL on how to attack/set-up his weaknesses? Mankins has been more often exploited since the NYG turned their late-season experience into a new game plan. Mankins is also an ironman for the team. If NE gets a fair trade offer, so be it, but if they can nail down one Guard slot in the face of Neal's seasonal uncertainties, I'm not going to kick.

Same HERE. I LOVE me some Grizzlies!! :rocker:

 

[Off The Grid]

Thanks Off The Grid, its good to get feedback on ideas.

My belief is that while we have assets that others desire and we value less (Mankins, an aging Moss and a freelancing Meriweather) we should trade them to add more value to the team, rather than just letting them walk.

I absolutely SWEAR by that philosophy. BRAVO.

I still have some hope that Mankins will be traded and I have always believed that if it is going to happen it will happen during the bye week, when teams are most desperate to improve before the deadline. And while I like Mankins as a player I don’t like the way he has handled the situation and I don’t feel he is worth the money he wants.

My first choice would be to keep Mankins, who I consider an absolute BEAST of a Run Blocker. Flanking Center with him and Connolly ~ allowing that the jury's still out on Connolly ~ sounds like an AWESOME way to tear up some Running Lanes, over the next 5 years or so.

But if we determine that there are, in fact, Irreconcilable Differences, I would certainly love to move his @$$ along, in a Sign + Trade.

And a 2nd + a 5th sure as hell seems like a reasonable price tag for a First Class Grizzly like Logan Mankins.

Moss I would love to keep but realistically I think it is best for the long term success of the team to move on. In a year when the Pats can get a top WR in the draft (at a reasonable cost with a rookie wage scale), I would do it. And if the CBA allows it I would franchise and trade Moss to get value form him, because I believe someone will offer at least a 2nd for him, even at his age.

I love Moss, but I am VERY anxious to see the last of him.

The only WideOuts I want to see are Wes Welker and Hines Ward types: Guys who DOMINATE the 20 Yards in two different but beautifully synergistic ways.

And if Moss turns it around and has the year that I think him capable of...I actually think a FIRST Rounder is in play...particularly if, say, Dan Snyder starts having visions of McNabb slinging Randy the ball for the next 2 or 3 years...The Bears are also candidates, if we Franchise Moss.

I'm also sick of Meriweather’s selfish act and if he doesn’t start to turn it around I think its time to move on. Part of the reason behind my idea of moving McCourty to FS was because he seems to have the perfect skill set to excel there. And everything I have heard about his is how smart a player he is and how well he picks things up. This is why I think he would make a great leader of the secondary at the FS position, which is what Meriweather was suppose to be. The second reason behind this is while we have young, talented CB’s, Im worried about their size. Both McCourty and Butler are relatively short CB’s, matching up with some of the big WR’s in the AFC East (Marshall, Edwards). This is where I think adding a big, athletic, shut down corner like Peterson would be a huge advantage. He has the ability to match up with these bigger wideouts where Butler and McCourty could struggle. A secondary of Peterson and Bodden starting CB’s, Butler in the Nickle, McCourty as FS and Chung at SS could develop into an elite secondary with some experience.

I'm increasingly persuaded that this might, indeed, be the way to go. MIND you: I am a FANATIC about building Inside Out: Grizzlies first, THEN Wolves...

But I, too, am high on Deaderick ~ and hardly less so, considering your strong Argument about Saban's exceptional Training. And with Brace clearly ascending, Warren expected to return, and both Pryor and Love on the rise, as well as the benign presence of Wright and Warren II, to say nothing of the possibilities of Weston and Richard...It IS imaginable that we could look at this crew, next March, and say "Eh. Looks like we're GOOD, here."

While I would normally agree with you about not taking a running back or wideout in the first round, I see the 2011 draft as a special case. I believe Mark Ingram is the perfect fit for the Pats system because he is such a complete back. He runs hard between the tackles with great instincts and vision, but he also catches the ball well out of the backfield and has enough speed to run outside. There is no other backs I would touch in the 1st round of the draft because they don’t offer the same versatility as Ingram. I also see Julio Jones as a rare opportunity because it is not often the Pats get a shot at a genuine #1 receiver in the draft. There are 4 genuine #1 wideout prospects in this draft so there should be value to get one in the 10-18 range, and I would love any of them. But overall I like Jones the most because of what he brings to the table apart from just catching the ball. He isn’t a ‘Diva’ and I think he would just fit well. It’s also no surprise that I have two Alabama players high on my board. While the Crimson Tide have the most talent in college football they are also the best coached, and I put a lot of stock in that when looking at players. Perhaps that is why I am so high on Brandon Deaderick as a future starter at DE. Saban just teaches his kids the right way and prepares then well for the NFL.

I must say you've got me VERY high on Jones...I'll have to make time to watch some Tape.

I also have a hard time finding players that fit the system and offer value in the first round. Most projected talent in the first round of this draft just doesn’t seem to fit. There are a lot of talented DL that just don’t fit the 2-gap system. There is also a lot of depth in the secondary, but apart from Peterson and Amukamara, I don’t feel the value would be there because of the recent high picks in previous years. While philosophically I also believe in building through the trenches I just don’t see it as an option here. The DL don’t fit, and while it is a fairly week OL draft, it seems to be quite deep in areas of the Patriots needs. While there don’t seem to be many elite LT prospects, there are quite a few 2nd round RT, as well as mid round center and guard prospects. So what my projections really come down to is value and opportunity cost. If you don’t take Ingram or a stud WR in round 1 that there is a big drop off to later rounds. If you don’t take a DL, LB or OL early, there is less of a drop off and still value in the 2nd round.

This is a beautifully crafted Argument.

And it's intensely persuasive: I always argue Return On Investment in the Draft. And as you say: If you sense a Dramatic Drop Off looming at a position of interest, it behooves you to take a LONG look a that position.

It's a principle that Fantasy FootBall Managers understand perfectly, if they're any good.

It's not so much about BPA, which is a Tactical approach, focusing on one Pick at a time.

It's about ROI, which is a Strategic approach, encompassing the entire Draft as a single playing field, and is, therefore, a much better one.

Well argued, sir.

My biggest concern for the 2011 draft is the lack of a CBA. I think the uncertainty of whether or not there will be a 2011 season could dramatically affect the amount of underclassmen declaring for the draft. Especially from the larger programs such as Alabama who have National Title aspirations. Why would a player declare early with the possibility of no season in 2011 when they could return to school and win (possibly a third straight) National Title. If this is the case and the draft class is weakened by a lack of underclassmen, than the high picks the Pats have are somewhat negated by the lack of talent. In this scenario I could see BB moving even more picks forward than usual into an especially strong 2012 draft.

But in the end everyone has their own opinions about how their team should draft. I just love to study the draft and discuss it with others that feel the same (which is very difficult here in Australia). That’s the reason I joined this forum, because it’s the best place to intelligently discuss the Pats draft all year round.

While it is presumptuous of a fellow "Rookie" to say so, I am QUITE confident in saying that I speak for the LOT of us when I say that we are JACKED ~ Woo!! Pete Carrol!! ~ to have you join our ranks.

WELCOME, Brother Wilfork!! :rocker:

 

[Off The Grid]

Too early to predict, but the one guy I want in a Pat's uni in 2011 is Julio Jones for sure!

I don't do 1st Round Wide Outs...But if I made ONE exception, Brother Julio would SKYROCKET to the front!!

Alice and CHAINS???

I can't BELIEVE anyone's still blasting them in their SIG.

WELL @#$%ING PLAYED, sir.

A+C is IMMORTAL.