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Top 10 All-Time Boston Clutch Sports Performers


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NEM said:
Cy Young............................

"Smokey" Joe Wood also deserves mention, as does 4 time NHL MVP Eddie Shore. He threw alot of clutch punches. (Championships in '29 and '39)
 
It is difficult to compare sports, let alone different times, however all things being equal it is difficult to differentiate between Russell, Orr, Brady and Bird watched all and difficult to discern any difference in their role on the team, league and impact on Boston Sports.

John Havlicek is overlooked a lot and might fight into these top 4, but imo there is very little difference, comparing their respective sport and the different times. Each one captured our imagination at a specific time and they are all the best to me, remember Orr's goal and the way he dominated the game like it was yesterday, remember Russell doing a number on Chamberlain consistently played selfishly and all out every day, Bird and Brady are more recent memories, but all are pretty equal.
 
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DarthPatriot said:
Does Russell win without Bob Cousy? I was wondering In colorado is Kordell considered clutch?
Absotively, posilutely. It's really the other way around. The Celtics were going nowhere until Russell arrived except first round of the playoffs and out. Cousy was great, but if somehow the Celtics didn't get by the St. Louis Hawks without a Cousy, as soon as the Jones boys and Havlicek were all together to join Russell, it was all over for the rest of the league anyway.

For the poll, it's close, but I'd still put Bird #1 if for no other reason than his longevity. Brady can still do more (we hope).
 
PromisedLand said:
;)
Yeah, it really is too bad good video technology is a relatively recent thing. I wish I could see video of a lot of historical things that happened before the 20th century, not just sports related. Can you imagine if there was video in biblical times?

quote]

That's not such a bad thing that there's no video...
I can picture CNN covering certain Biblical events.....
" We're here with the Cain's defense attorney who will give his client's perspective and justification in the murder of Abel."
" Noah, don't you think it's selfish of you to allow all these neighbors of yours to drown while you sit high and dry?"
Sorry for the OT rant..............
 
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PromisedLand said:
You're a good man to admit it. ;)
Yeah, it really is too bad good video technology is a relatively recent thing. I wish I could see video of a lot of historical things that happened before the 20th century, not just sports related. Can you imagine if there was video in biblical times?

I am glad to have helped you understand how great Russell was. I hope more of the younger people take the time to find out what went on before their time.
Did God play for Boston?
It was great that we both agree how good Russell was, I missed where you helped me understand how great he was? A little condescending, maybe.
 
OhExaulted1 said:
"Smokey" Joe Wood also deserves mention, as does 4 time NHL MVP Eddie Shore. He threw alot of clutch punches. (Championships in '29 and '39)

Babe Ruth. I think he still holds the record for consecutive scoreless innings in the World series.
 
scout said:
PromisedLand said:
I don't disagree that Russell was the greatest. Too often we forget great champions because their time has passed. I always thought Havlicek was forgotten way too soon. I do disagree that Bird wasn't the best during his time. Magic was a great guard, maybe the greatest along with Oscar. But he didn't change the guard position. Before Bird no forward ever controlled the game from that position. I never heard of point forward before Bird came along. To say someone is the best based on championships is misleading. Look at the players Magic had playing with him. The year before Magic arrived in LA, they were beaten in the playoffs by Seattle who would win the championship. The year before Bird arrived in Boston they were 29-53 for 5th place in the Atlantic, no playoffs, not even close. The next year with rookie Bird, 61-21 and first in Atlantic Division. That was with no Parrish or McHale. They would be beaten by Philly who would go to the championship game.

Bob Pettit
 
you asked for it

Not to belittle the thread but we’re talking about the most clutch athletes in sports history – forget about Boston.

David Ortiz is a Boston legend.
Adam Vinatieri is a Boston legend.

Russell, Brady, Bird and Orr are sports legends who all coincidently played in Boston, and we’re very lucky for it.

Russell was the MVP on 11 championship teams, he is the most successful athlete in team sports history…period. He was a force on defense, transition, and distribution – he was the engine of THE Dynasty and arguably the most dominant all-around basketball player of all time. He's clearly on the Mount Rushmore of Boston athletes and, like Brady and Bird, he goes beyond mere parochial icon status – they belong to the elite pantheon of sports in general – not some glorified local pedestal that makes us feel good about our own neighborhood, but does a major disservice to them.

Both Russell and Brady made/make the game infinitely easier for those around them. When Russell retired, the Celtics weren’t just done winning championships, they became atrocious. Before Brady took the reins in his second year, the Patriots were also atrocious…despite replacing a highly experienced and prolific QB, under Brady’s young leadership the team immediately congealed into championship form.

Tom’s career is five years young but he already has an incredible portfolio of consistent play in elimination games and pressure situations.

Under pressure, Russell was great at shooting and distributing, but if basketball players had to contend with an NFL pass rush, we’re no longer talking about clutch basketball players. While both Russell and Brady play(ed) fearlessly, QBs come equipped with targets on their backs – with 260 pounders sprinting at their blind side with intent to kill – this is takes the definition of courage to a level totally foreign to the game of basketball.

Brady’s physical skills are less obvious than Russell’s, but no less significant. Just from reading the opinions of his own fans on this message board, he might have the most underrated arm in football history – and that same arm isn’t even his greatest attribute – it’s his eyes and instincts. He sees the field like a hawk and plays the game like Gary Kasparov. His mistakes occur when he “over-anticipates†either his offense or the defense he’s facing.

Russell’s “weaknesses†could only be taken in consideration to other great players. He was an average free thrower, but it wasn’t his job to draw fouls. Brady’s one weakness is a lack of mobility outside the pocket – a place he rarely resides. Relative to their peers, they both stand alone.

Brady and Larry Bird were/are offensive guys, and as such, have had more singular opportunities to choke or shine than Russell.

Russell’s highlight clutch performance might’ve been in game 7 of the ’57 finals when he missed a layup in the 2nd OT before running the length of the court to block Jack Coleman’s shot – Celtics win 125-123. The other one that stands out is the ’67 division finals against the Sixers – the Celtics came back from a 2-game deficit to force a game 7…leading by 2 points with 30 seconds to play, Russell sank a foul shot, blocked a shot by Chet Walker, grabbed a rebound off a Hal Greer miss, and fed the ball to Sam Jones, who made the final basket…there is no better definition of his greatness than that final sequence.

But a clutch basket is arguably more impressive than a clutch block or rebound by a guy who was simply more physically imposing than everyone else on the court. Which isn’t to say that Russell was just a big intimidating brute, because positioning and anticipation were part of the game, but he still had that dominating size.

I’d still take Russell over Bird to start my team, but I’d want Bird in the last minute of a tie game.

The position of QB in the salary cap/FA Era carries a value that is unprecedented in team sports history – 21 other guys depend entirely on the decisions and execution of the QB – if he makes mistakes or less than optimal choices nothing else means a damn. As unbelievably valuable as Russell was to the Celtics, Brady is at least as valuable to the Pats.

Russell played with five Hall of Famers – there’s no doubt he helped make those players great, but you don’t get into the Hall of Fame unless you’re great in your own right, and the Celtics had the only truly great team of their era. Wilt played on incomplete teams but his Warriors were still competitive with the great Celtics teams – it’s ridiculous to suggest that Russell truly “neutralized†Wilt, or that Wilt wasn’t able to “elevate†his team like Russell did. It’s not a knock on Russell, but he obviously had a lot more to work with than Wilt.

Russell was 106-53 in the playoffs and 31-15 in potentially decisive games. Most impressively he led the Celtics to a 10-0 record in game sevens (15-1 in elimination games). Bird wasn’t quite that successful.

TB is 10-1 in “game sevens†– that record eclipses Bart Starr (who played with NINE Hall of Famers). He is 21-3 in games decided by a TD…no other QB in history comes close to that mark. He has directed 4 fourth-quarter comeback drives in championship games, including two walk-off drives. One championship comeback included 10 points in the final 3:30 against the 8th ranked D – he made it look easy. Another came with no timeouts, no 2-minute warning, 80 seconds, against the 6th ranked D -- again, he made it look exceedingly easy. Both are unprecedented feats, not just in Super Bowl history, but also NFL championship history.

Despite directing his team to 3 titles in his first four seasons, Brady is the only surefire HoFer on his teams…no multi-championship winning QB has ever been without a plethora of HoF talent around him. In Marino’s first 6 seasons he played with 12 different Pro Bowlers – though like Brady, none of the players around Marino were locks for Canton – just to refresh your memory, Marino won nothing while Tom is on pace to become the most successful player in football history.

Collegiately, Russell led USF to back to back championships and an absurd 55-game win streak. Brady led UM to a 2-0 record in Bowl games, a 10-2 record in games decided by a TD, and directed 3 fourth-quarter/OT comeback drives in winning the Bowl games.

In the history of sports, only Bill Russell and Jack Nicklaus can claim to have earned their HoF tickets as fast as Brady. Gale Sayers made it to Canton after 5 years…Brady became a lock after four seasons. Had TB retired after the 04 season his legend would’ve grown ten-fold.

THEREFORE...
 
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My “Clutch Hall of Fame†(it’s pretty silly to rank them)…

- Babe Ruth (hit better than .300 in 6 different World Series, no baseball player has ever single-handedly carried his team to titles like Ruth did)
- Larry Bird (how’s this for a swansong: 20 points in the 4th period of game 7 of the 88 conference semis, Celtics win by 2 – they would advance no further, but not a bad way to go out)
- Tom Brady
- Bill Russell
- Michael Jordan
- Jack Nicklaus (18 majors, 48 top-3 finishes. Unlike Tiger, Jack was ALWAYS in contention, was able to win majors when he wasn’t on top of his game, and managed to win several from behind. He missed his share of puts but never because of a bad stroke, and there’s nothing like lipping out a muscle-back one-iron into the teeth of a gale at the 17th at Pebble to win the U.S. Open – greatest cluch shot in sports history)
- Bjorn Borg
- Mariano Rivera
- Bobby Orr (injuries kept him from going down as greatest, but I’d easily take Orr if I had to win one game)
- Steffi Graf (yes, a woman…just in case I haven’t already fired you up)

Honorable Mention: cousy, west.

Note: Individual sports like golf and tennis are easier to isolate in terms of clutch performance, but they also come without any leadership responsibility that team sports demand.

Honorable mention for all-important football coaches: Belichick (in the parity era, his teams play clutch because the players are well prepared and he manages the game as fearlessly as his players play it), Bud Wilkinson (won 3 national championships as a QB, and 3 more as a head coach, including a 47-game win streak and a .826 career win%) and Pop Warner (no matter where he coached he produced national champions).

Honorable mention III: ’04 Red Sox for the ALCS alone.

P.S. Just to prove I have no Boston bias, there’s no way Ted Williams goes down as a clutch athlete – you must be joking…least clutch perhaps…and no, I wasn’t alive when he played so feel free to play that card when you blast me for saying that. As a mere hitter, I don’t hold the fact that he has no rings against him, I do however hold him to the fact that he came up small.
 
scout said:
Did God play for Boston?
It was great that we both agree how good Russell was, I missed where you helped me understand how great he was? A little condescending, maybe.
Sorry, I didn't mean it that way. I might have had you confused with someone else who posted in this thread.
 
dhamz said:
#1 is easily Russell.

You can't get a more clutch spot than a game where the winning team goes on and the losing team goes home.

You take his Game 7s as a pro and then his final 2 years in college and he played in a ton of them. And the one constant was the team that had Bill Russell ALWAYS won.
Absolutely. To quantify it, on a N.E. sports DVD that I have, Bob Ryan said that Russell played in 25 "elimination" games in his playing days combining USF, the Olympics and the Celtics. Lose and you're out. His team won every one of them. I changed my mind, it has to be Bill, but Bird and Brady are definitely in the conversation.
 
NEM said:
CY YOUNG............

Fair. I considered him for my list too but IMO, as remarkable as 500 wins is, I think it's the wrong list...most dominant pitcher, sure....but most clutch? Was Wilt Chamberlain clutch or just great? There's a little of both going on but maybe different lists?, no?
 
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Fanfrom1960 said:
Absolutely. To quantify it, on a N.E. sports DVD that I have, Bob Ryan said that Russell played in 25 "elimination" games in his playing days combining USF, the Olympics and the Celtics. Lose and you're out. His team won every one of them. I changed my mind, it has to be Bill, but Bird and Brady are definitely in the conversation.

Ryan is close...but BR did lose an elimination game in '67 Eastern Division Finals, to eventual champion Sixers: Boston 116 at Philadelphia 140

The loss in '58 came after BR injured his ankle in game 3, but the Celtics also lost the first two games of that series with Bill on the floor.

15-1 in NBA elimination games still ain't too shabby.
 
the taildragger said:
Ryan is close...but BR did lose an elimination game in '67 Eastern Division Finals, to eventual champion Sixers: Boston 116 at Philadelphia 140

The loss in '58 came after BR injured his ankle in game 3, but the Celtics also lost the first two games of that series with Bill on the floor.

15-1 in NBA elimination games still ain't too shabby.

Ryan was right.

It wasn't a win or go home game for both teams. The series was 4-1 Philly. It was in those games where both teams had it all on the line- NCAA Tournaments, Game 7s, and the Olympics that he was unbeaten.
 
dhamz said:
Ryan was right.

It wasn't a win or go home game for both teams. The series was 4-1 Philly. It was in those games where both teams had it all on the line- NCAA Tournaments, Game 7s, and the Olympics that he was unbeaten.

If that's the way Ryan framed it then yeah, he was 10-0 in game 7s when BOTH teams stood to go home...but when your team is down in a 1-3 hole, that is also an elimination game. do you not agree?
 
Bill Russell is not only number one in Boston, he is number one all time in any sport any city. he is the most clutch athlete of all time.

In game 7 elimination game type scenarios meaning your t

eam either wins the series or game or goes home, including college, olympics, and the NBA he played in 21 type games.

His record 21-0. Thank you, come again, he is number 1

Now for the real top 10 list.

1)Russell
2)Bird
3)Havilchek
4)Brady
5)Orr
6) Richard Seymore (the guy always plays like a monster in the SB)
7) Ortiz
8)Pedro way more clutch for Boston than Shilling. (Please see 6 no hit innings vs the Indians in 99)
9) Manny (World Series MVP, most consecutive post season games with a hit)
10)Mchale
 
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Here's a guy who played on 4 Boston Championship Teams

http://www.baseballhalloffame.org/hofers_and_honorees/hofer_bios/hooper_harry.htm

Bio
A steady leadoff hitter and spectacular defensive outfielder, Harry Hooper is the only man to play on four Red Sox World Championship teams. One of baseball's most dignified and intelligent players (and owner of an engineering degree), Hooper remains the Red Sox’ all-time leader in triples (130) and stolen bases (300). From 1910 to 1915 he teamed with Tris Speaker and Duffy Lewis to form one of the finest outfield trios ever assembled.


Quote
"If there was any one characteristic of Harry Hooper's, it was that he was a clutch player. When the chips were down that guy played like wildfire."
— Joe Wood

Did You Know... that although Harry Hooper never hit more than 11 home runs in a single big league season, he was the first to hit two home runs in a single World Series game, October 13, 1915?
 
Peter Pat said:
Bill Russell is not only number one in Boston, he is number one all time in any sport any city. he is the most clutch athlete of all time.

In game 7 elimination game type scenarios meaning your t

eam either wins the series or game or goes home, including college, olympics, and the NBA he played in 21 type games.

His record 21-0. Thank you, come again, he is number 1

Now for the real top 10 list.

1)Russell
2)Bird
3)Havilchek
4)Brady
5)Orr
6) Richard Seymore (the guy always plays like a monster in the SB)
7) Ortiz
8)Pedro way more clutch for Boston than Shilling. (Please see 6 no hit innings vs the Indians in 99)
9) Manny (World Series MVP, most consecutive post season games with a hit)
10)Mchale


Russell was also never a 2 TD underdog in any of his Game 7s;) This is the problem with comparing guys in different sports.

As I've tried to point out, he did in fact lose an elimination game in his pro career, it just wasn't a game 7. Nobody's perfect, but Russell was damn close. Like bob ryan, we're all big fans of Russell, but there's no need to distort the reality to make him seem more "perfect" than he actually was...the guy lost over 50 playoff games, but won over a 100 too...that's amazing stuff.

I would like to see what Russell could do with a linebacker chasing him down. He's in my pantheon though...I just don't understand how a "ranking" is possible unless we're just picking favorites. If I had to rank them I'd definitely put Ruth over Russell, perhaps even based strictly on what he did with the Sox. Although we're rightly including Russell's college and olympic career so I'll include Ruth's Yankee career as well.

I do have a major problem ranking Havlicek above TB on any list...but it's hard to know just how serious this effort was.

thanks for playing.:bricks:
 
Didn't read the posts...so not sure if it's been mentioned...but how bout the 3 Hendersons...
 
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