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Told you so. Obama to target retirement accounts.

Discussion in 'Political Discussion' started by Patradomous, Apr 6, 2013.

  1. Patradomous

    Patradomous Rookie

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    #87 Jersey

    Obama budget to take aim at wealthy IRAs - The Hill's On The Money

    What did I tell you? A dozen times on this forum I said the Bat eared Bolsheviek and his band of commies would be breaking into IRA accounts. And a dozen times I was called a right wing wierd-oh for even suggesting such blasphemy against Jesus Obama.
    Oh and of course the article says its just "the rich." Whatever they deem the rich to be when they know full well that mother lode of the money is amongst the 401ks and IRA's of the middle class. I told you the bolshevieks are just drooling to get into that cache.
  2. PatriotsReign

    PatriotsReign Rookie

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    They won't touch 401k's unless they want to deal with domestic revolution.
  3. Patradomous

    Patradomous Rookie

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    #87 Jersey

    Do you realize how much that verbage comes up in everyday conversation with regular folk around diners and small businesses?

    Never ever in my life have i ever heard it so often until these people got into office.
  4. DarrylS

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    The proposal seems reasonable, however if you are prone to hysteria probably not.
  5. PatriotsReign

    PatriotsReign Rookie

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    Folks...that's the 432nd time Darryl has used the word "Hysteria" on this board! Any bets on when the count gets to 500?

    I'm saying June 19th.
  6. DarrylS

    DarrylS PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    When all else fails, and are proven wrong again.. attack the poster with a hysterical response.

    One might think you would have better things to do with your life.
  7. PatriotsReign

    PatriotsReign Rookie

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    Hysteria count now at 433.....
  8. Mrs.PatsFanInVa

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    ROFLMAO

    Amazing that someone who threatens "domestic revolution" is concerned about someone else using the word "hysteria."
  9. PatriotsReign

    PatriotsReign Rookie

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    I'm not threatening anything MrsP...It's just what I believe will happen if our gov't continues to squeeze our middle class.

    Like the vast majority of Americans, I'm not willing to work additional years just to help my country. And I have not met one person who is willing.
  10. Mrs.PatsFanInVa

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    Whatever.....the plan is to limit the amount one can keep in an IRA to $3,000,000,00.

    Obama

    I have no opinion as to whether this is right or wrong, a good idea or a bad idea - nor do I really care. All I know is that no one I know is going to be in danger of being affected.
  11. Mrs.PatsFanInVa

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    How many of "our middle class" people have over $3,000,000.00 in an IRA, PR?
  12. PatriotsReign

    PatriotsReign Rookie

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    Just as a reminder, it was just last year that our gov't was mulling over the possibility of taxing our 401k's MrsP.

    So it wouldn't be a stretch to consider they might still be considering it.

    Feds eye retirement-fund tax to cut $16 trillion-plus deficit - NYPOST.com

    401(k) tax breaks in lawmakers

    The above is why I stated I and very few Americans are willing to work extra years just to help our gov't. Especially those of us over 50 who have worked 30+ years and have counted on that money.
  13. Mrs.PatsFanInVa

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    sorry..went off topic for a moment.

    My bad.
  14. Mrs.PatsFanInVa

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    But that's not what this thread is about, PR. This thread is about IRAs with over $3,000,000.00 in them.

    Aren't you the one who constantly admonishes everyone to stick strictly to the thread topic?

    So, I'll ask you again....how many "middle class people" do you know that have an IRA worth more than $3,000,000.00?
  15. Real World

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    Uh-oh, I think his use of "misogyny" could be getting a run for its money. :D
  16. PatsFanInVa

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    RW, your initial post strongly implies that "Obama" will try to actually take away what's in your retirement account.

    The actual proposal is to limit the amount one can put in the IRA.

    If, after topping out your $3 million IRA, you still want to save, that just means you need to save another place.

    The rules for IRAs confer certain incentives, like all retirement plans. But the government isn't "taking" money out of your IRA, if it says you just don't get the advantages of saving in an IRA past $3m. There is nothing to stop you from saving the remainder of your money in gold bricks, or investing it in equities, etc.

    So once you have $3 m in an IRA, you'd have to choose another retirement savings vehicle (because if you think about it, senior citizens really can't get by on just 200k/year...)

    You guys just don't live in reality.

    And face it: you don't give two sh1ts about the real issue -- which is that more than half of Americans have no savings, and the ones who have 401(k)s have an average of something like 50K in them. Over age 55, that "explodes" to 150K or so, counting all accounts.

    Little clue, geniuses, in fill-in-the-blank form:

    In 10 years, we will have to raise taxes to avoid poverty among the _____.

    a) old
    b) rich

    PFnV
  17. Patradomous

    Patradomous Rookie

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    #87 Jersey

    Will this effect his legacy cost?

  18. PatsFanInVa

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    Again, Patrodumas, the proposal was to limit the amount you can contribute to an IRA. And that's it.

    If you want to save the money elsewhere, fine. You just can't have the government advantages of it being in an IRA.

    Nobody's taking any of the money saved in an IRA by anybody.

    PFnV
  19. PatriotsReign

    PatriotsReign Rookie

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    "Once again...."....just kiddn!

    None at all MrsP.

    But if you read my quotes, the money/tax revenue just isn't there from people with over $3MM in IRA's. But in my opinion, they'll start with the wealthy and work their way down to the middle class because that's where the money/revenue is.

    By hitting the wealthy first, it makes it easier for our gov't to tell the middle class, "Hey, we already hit up the wealthy...now it's your turn middle class. We are all being asked to sacrifice in these challenging times we face....yada, yada, yada...." and the beat will go on.

    I will betcha what I just wrote will happen soon in come capacity. Maybe not with 401k's....but maybe the mortgage interest write off or they'll tax our company paid health insurance or company paid cell phones.

    I believe our gov't is making a list and checking it twice....for all of us whether we're naughty or nice!
  20. PatriotsReign

    PatriotsReign Rookie

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    We already pay enough taxes if you add up ALL the forms of taxes we pay. Our gov't just needs to take the revenues they get and allocate the money more intelligently.
  21. patsfan13

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    With the IMF & EU endorsing stealing $$$ from people's bank accounts the template is in place, they will start with the 'rich' to get the camel's nose under the tent using envy to demonize the bad guys.

    J Rodgers see the writing on the wall on CNBC a week ago:

    Obama's Planning on Stealing Your 401k Ira Roth Retirement Accounts!!!!!! - YouTube


    http://bullmarketthinking.com/jim-r...or-one-am-worried-and-im-taking-preparations/


    Last edited: Apr 6, 2013
  22. DocHoliday

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    They're not taking the money, just stopping you from piling more than 3m into it.

    The problem is?
  23. RI Patriots fan

    RI Patriots fan Rookie

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    Sure, because when the government sets limits, there is no chance that they change those limits. :rolleyes:


    When Social Security started it only "cost" you 1% and your employer 1%.
    Now it costs both a combined 12.4% of your compenation. Just a small 620% increase.

    When Medicare started it was just .7%. Now its 2.9%....that's a 414% increase.


    http://www.taxpolicycenter.org/taxfacts/content/pdf/ssrate_historical.pdf


    So what are the chances that the "limit" starts at $3 miilion dollars but suddenly lowers to $2 million or $1 million dollars? All we have to do is believe that the Progressives don't want any of that fat stash of cash sitting around.....how could we not trust the Progressives to do the right thing? :rolleyes:

    One more thing.....when you set a limit like $3 million, inflation takes a piece every single year so that in 40 years $3 million dollars could be worth $1 million dollars in today's currency value.
  24. Mrs.PatsFanInVa

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    Why would you expect it to remain at 1% when, right from the get-go, steady increases were written right into the agreement?

    The "cost" of Social Security was never intended to remain at 1935 levels.

    Social Security History

    Link, please.
  25. RI Patriots fan

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    So the original legislation proposed that the levels go up to 6% and today we stand at more than double that......hmmm. How exactly does that contradict my point?

    It may reduce the percentage of increase but its a significant increase none the less.

    The link I gave has the medicare percentages.

    The
  26. Mrs.PatsFanInVa

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    Sorry, my bad. Missed that.

    Interestingly, the cost of both SS and Medicare has barely budged since 1986 - 27 years without an increase.


    That, in itself, tends to contradict your point.
  27. PatsFanInVa

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    Again, the proposal limits the total in an IRA to $3 million.

    You are free to invest your money elsewhere.

    The proposal does not in itself change anybody's tax rates or status. It just denies some tax advantages specific to IRA accounts to those who would like to amass more than $3 million in said accounts.

    It'll probably produce revenue.

    As to your contention that "we're taxed enough" -- and that "we" includes everybody (except perhaps those without much in the first place, what I usually read hereabouts): We're not taxed enough to pay for what we spend. That's the whole complaint in the first place: OMG OMG OMG we have a national debt which we just noticed even though we've had one for 230 years!

    Well, the way you get rid of a debt - or at least change the rate at which it grows - is to bring in more money. The way a government brings in more money is through taxation.

    And save your bumper sticker about how "we don't have a revenue problem, we have a spending problem."

    It's horse crap. We've cut $2 trillion in spending already, before there ever was a sequester, and sequestration is supposed to cut another $1.2 trillion.
    Republicans want more spending cuts, conveniently forgetting about the spending cuts Obama already enacted | New Republic

    But notice how pubbies are still wailing and gnashing their teeth about how "we've got to get spending under control."

    Total bullsh1t. What we've got to do is either (a) stop complaining about being in debt -- you and I will live our our national lives, with the country still in debt -- or (b) if you're so concerned about it, pay the money we've already spent, by raising revenues.

    As to the stupidity of the sequester itself, it's nice that we started the year with a nice growth spurt, because we have punched ourself in the crank with this bullsh1t yet again. This is just a way to engineer another dance with very slow growth or perhaps, in the pubbies' fondest dreams, another dip into recession.

    And unless we do something about it, it will continue for the next 10 years.

    YAY!

    Hint: the suckage of the sequester is not limited to the discontinuation of white house tours for the kiddies.

    PFnV
  28. RI Patriots fan

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    First off, the maximum taxable earnings has increased every year for the last 42 years (except for 2011).

    Second, the fact that the percentage hasn't increased in a while doesn't contradict my point that even after the initial legislation, the percentage did in fact increase over 100% even with yearly increases to the maximum earnings.
  29. DocHoliday

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    Inflation and life expectancy increases are things that need to be accounted for.

    You act like the percents going up for medicare mean the money is going into spending elsewhere. It's an entitlement program.
  30. wistahpatsfan

    wistahpatsfan Rookie

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    "There are many common logical pitfalls that our minds tend to fall into, unless we are consciously aware of these pitfalls and make efforts to avoid them...In fact, if a conclusion is not true one must either employ a false premise or a logical fallacy in order to construct an argument that leads to that conclusion. Remember, a sound argument (one with true premises and valid logic) cannot lead to a false conclusion. So in order to avoid using logical fallacies to construct invalid arguments, we need to understand how to identify fallacious logic.

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    Top 20 Logical Fallacies - The Skeptics' Guide to the Universe

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