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Time to resign Graham?


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I believe the Patriots have already prepared for life without Graham - by investing in Ben Watson, then drafting Dave Thomas and Garrett Mills. I expect the Patriots to make a reasonable offer (see: Deion Branch) and let the chips fall as they may.
 
I think BB values Graham more that his pub would warrent. I think Graham knows he is appreciated by the coaches for his contributions in this system.
 
TP76 said:
IMO they probably let him go if he wishes, as a reward for his years of service.
Somehow, this sentence comes out funny. ;)
 
Kdo5 said:
Yeah yeah yeah. We still have Watson. Watson Watson Watson. I hope you understand that Daniel Graham is the best TE on the Patriots and is a crucial part to this offense. He is one of the best blocking tight ends in football now and he can fly under the radar and make big catches here and there. We need to resign Graham. Jesus, its as if some people here just dont know how big a role Graham plays in this offense. He deserves a good contract and the Patriots should give him one. We should not let him slip away to another team.

The name of Jesus should be used with reverence, not as a curse.

Graham is a good not spectacular all around tight end. If he has a solid year someone will probably pay him more than the Patriots estimate his value to be. IMO, he ranks in the middle of NFL tight ends and should be paid as such.
 
donb said:
The name of Jesus should be used with reverence, not as a curse.

Graham is a good not spectacular all around tight end. If he has a solid year someone will probably pay him more than the Patriots estimate his value to be. IMO, he ranks in the middle of NFL tight ends and should be paid as such.

Mark Bravaro has a different opinion he thinks Graham is the best all around TE in the game and the best since bravaro himself. I think Bravaro is correct in his evaluation of Graham.
 
Mark me down as a Graham supporter who thinks he is more valuable to this team then Watson is or any current receiever short of Troy Brown. I cannot recall a long run that did not go through Grahambo, plus the mere fact that LB's have to remain honest next to Graham in case he goes down field is a huge factor. As other have mentioned, football is changing and the 2 TE set is becoming a very powerful weopon, but this weopon only exists if the TE's are capable of blocking as well as receiving. Watson as infinite potential but his value plummets without Graham lined up next to him to keep the defenses honest. I do not know much about Thomas but this I do know, I would gladly give Graham 3-4 mill a year then any WR with equivalent worth.

You gotta stay in New England Graham, where else could you get Unsportsmanlike Conduct penalties with such style and grace.
 
We can do polls on who is most likely to extended during the bye week.

Sure, we would all like to extend Graham, Samuel, Koppen, and Banta-Cain.

While we're at it, we should extend Poteat, Seau and Chad Scott.

All of these would be easily doable under the cap.

Of these, I think Banta-Cain and Chad Scott are the most likely to be extended.
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Personally, I think it is time to prevent players from being free agents a year earlier. I would offer the following players extensions now: Bruschi, Gabriel, Wright, Hawkins and Wilson, and perhaps even Caldwell.

Gabriel and Wright would be fine extensions.
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bb has done this in the past. I recall when he extended Hochstein and Gorin.

So, I would hope to make some "minor: extensions. However, I think in total it would help the future a lot if were to extend Banta-Cain, Chad Scott, Wright and Gabriel.
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Graham is an utterly superior blocker. As a receiver, he is a beast at YAC, is nothing special at getting open, and has questionable hands. I think his value is comparable to that of a very good but not Pro Bowl interior lineman or right tackle. So it's too-close-to-call for us to predict whether he'll be signed or not.
 
BTW to run a 2 TE offense effectivly we need 4 good TE to account for injuries. IMO Mills will end up as a H back/FB not a TE.
 
Graham is not the best blocking TE in the league. There are TEs who are pure blockers and have no pretense of being offensive weapons who are superior to Graham at blocking. The reason Graham is valued is that the 2 TE offense is predicated on both being threats as pass catchers who can threaten the seam AND as blockers. That is how the mismatches are created. So Graham's value is not his excellence in one area, but his versatility, which should surprise noone since this is a BB hallmark. What supporters of Graham may really be trying to say is NOT that he is the best blocking TE in the NFL, but the best blocking TE who can also pose a threat as a pass catcher. Those are two different things. As such, Graham is a good blocker and IMO an inconsistent receiving threat. He has struggled with durability. Last year due to shoulder problems his blocking was average and his receiving sub-par. Graham had a good game last week against Cinci's porous front 7. IMO D. Thomas will be a more reliable pass catcher and if he can improve his blocking, the way Shockey and other TEs have who entered the league not noted for blocking, he may adequately fill Graham's shoes at comparatively low cost.
 
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PonyExpress said:
Graham is not the best blocking TE in the league. There are TEs who are pure blockers and have no pretense of being offensive weapons who are superior to Graham at blocking. The reason Graham is valued is that the 2 TE offense is predicated on both being threats as pass catchers who can threaten the seam AND as blockers. That is how the mismatches are created. So Graham's value is not his excellence in one area, but his versatility, which should surprise noone since this is a BB hallmark. What supporters of Graham may really be trying to say is NOT that he is the best blocking TE in the NFL, but the best blocking TE who can also pose a threat as a pass catcher. Those are two different things. As such, Graham is a good blocker and IMO an inconsistent receiving threat. He has struggled with durability. Last year due to shoulder problems his blocking was average and his receiving sub-par. Graham had a good game last week against Cinci's porous front 7. IMO D. Thomas will be a more reliable pass catcher and if he can improve his blocking, the way Shockey and other TEs have who entered the league not noted for blocking, he may adequately fill Graham's shoes at comparatively low cost.

Who's the #3 when an injury occurs if Graham leaves.

Again Bravaro thinks Graham is the best blocking TE in the game and the best all around, good enough for me. I agree he does get banged up, due to the role he plays in our scheme. If Watson were forcecd to fill that role he would be more banged up also.
 
If the Patriots just let Graham walk off into the sunset without even making an attempt at resigning him, I think that will be the first time that I'm actually pissed at this front office. He is clearly our best TE IMHO, Watson gets all of the glory beacuse he has the speed. I'll tell you this though, I wouldn't trust him to protect Brady's blind side. Hell, I'd almost trust Graham more than I would Light.
 
flutie2phelan said:
These considerations have the effect of
focusing me on
re-signing Dan Koppen.

Bingo. Not only does Koppen call the OL assignments, but he touches the ball on every snap. I'd rather not see this chemistry disrupted. Resigning him is the higher priority.
 
During the Branch debacle, Graham was quoted in the BGlobe regarding his own contact situation, saying, "I'll give them one shot, and them I'm gone." sniff, sniff, boo hoo. I also question where the offseason trade rumors regarding Graham emerged from. After listening to an interview with the Broncos GM, I was left with the impression that the rumors may have been initiated by Graham and his agent, and not by the Broncos at all. Furthermore, there has been much discussion about how Graham had to be left in to block for Brady over the years because of the O-line troubles, and that was why he didn't catch more passes. Question: If the organization truly believed Graham to be an important and reliable weapon in the passing game, don't you think they would have found a way to integrate him more? I do. Bavaro regularly caught 50+ passes. Graham never has come close to that production. Bavaro was being charitable in his description of Graham, because he has a personal relationship with him ever since he was brought in to tutor him after Graham's slow development as a rookie. In fact Bavaro was mystified by Graham's sub-par performance as late as the 2003 postseason. My source for this was Deossie on air, who said he asked his old Giant buddy about Graham's tendency to hot-potato passes in his breadbasket. Bavaro shrugged his shoulders and said nobody could figure it out, because he "catches everything in practice". Based on my own following of Graham's career, the idea that Graham is the best TE since Bavaro is absurd.
 
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PonyExpress said:
Thomas will be a more reliable pass catcher and if he can improve his blocking, the way Shockey and other TEs have who entered the league not noted for blocking, he may adequately fill Graham's shoes at comparatively low cost.

My thinking as well. Also, given that Graham's, Watson's and even Fauria's blocking skills improved after a year with the Pats, I expect Thomas to improve as well next year.
 
PonyExpress said:
During the Branch debacle, Graham was quoted in the BGlobe regarding his own contact situation, saying, "I'll give them one shot, and them I'm gone." sniff, sniff, boo hoo. I also question where the offseason trade rumors regarding Graham emerged from. After listening to an interview with the Broncos GM, I was left with the impression that the rumors may have been initiated by Graham and his agent, and not by the Broncos at all. Furthermore, there has been much discussion about how Graham had to be left in to block for Brady over the years because of the O-line troubles, and that was why he didn't catch more passes. Question: If the organization truly believed Graham to be an important and reliable weapon in the passing game, don't you think they would have found a way to integrate him more? I do. Bavaro regularly caught 50+ passes. Graham never has come close to that production. Bavaro was being charitable in his description of Graham, because he has a personal relationship with him ever since he was brought in to tutor him after Graham's slow development as a rookie. In fact Bavaro was mystified by Graham's sub-par performance as late as the 2003 postseason. My source for this was Deossie on air, who said he asked his old Giant buddy about Graham's tendency to hot-potato passes in his breadbasket. Bavaro shrugged his shoulders and said nobody could figure it out, because he "catches everything in practice". Based on my own following of Graham's career, the idea that Graham is the best TE since Bavaro is absurd.

Sounds right to me.
Hey, I like the guy, think he's pretty good and would like to see the pats resign him.
that said, I don't think we're in trouble if we lose him.
 
There's no indication that Bavarro sends enough time watching other TEs to be a reliable judge of how Graham ranks vs. other team's players. On the other hand, Bavarro DOES seem to be saying he values Graham over Watson. Also, if he values himself over Tony Gonzalez he probably has nonstandard ranking criteria. That said, I might agree with those criteria ...
 
My guess is that Bravaro can 'see
more watching a TE play a qtr than we would 'see' watching the guy's entire career. Bravaro isn't given to hyperbole either. He could have said he was very good or whatever without saying he was the best.
 
patsfan13 said:
Bravaro isn't given to hyperbole either.
On what do you base this claim?
 
patsfan13 said:
IMO Graham is worth Top 5 money. BB places a high value on Te's and feels they are hard to find and are essential to the type of O he wants to run. Other than DL he has used more 'precious' Rd 1 picks on TE's that tells you a lot.

Graham is the BEST blocking TE in FB period. I think his rep for dropping passes is from his first year or two andis obsolete at this point. Heck Watson has dropped a few this year.

Remember Mark Bravaro said in the article posted here that Graham was the best all around TE in FB. Frankly I'll take his word for it over anyone on this board.

I agree that Graham's blocking is the best in the league. However, his rep for dropping passes is not obsolete. He had dropped three balls in (I believe) the Buffalo. All three were right at him and one was for a TD.

I am always concerned that he will not catch the ball.
 
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