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This is the thread you go to when your FA Binky goes to another team

Discussion in 'PatsFans.com - Patriots Fan Forum' started by patfanken, Mar 14, 2012.

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  1. patfanken

    patfanken Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract

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    #91 Jersey

    Richard Marshall was my Binky to come in an be at true coverage FS for us. I really thought he was a great fit. A former CB he had a great season at the position for AZ last season. Since this was my second priority after a pass rushing interior DLman, I thought he'd be worth around 5MM/yr.

    Well not only was Marshall just signed by another team, its a team within the division (Dolphins)....and for slightly over $5MM/yr on a 3 year deal for the 27 yr old. The last remaining "high end" FS is gone and a gaping hole in the Pats secondary still remains.

    A number of guys the Pats have been talking to, like the SD guy, would be upgrades over what we have, but that's setting the bar at a LOW level. We need to raise the bar. Its doubtful we will find the solution in the draft, at least not one that will have a big impact in 2012.

    Because we have a very young secondary, we need to add a guy who can bring some maturity to to a very young defensive backfield. I don't see that guy out there right now. I am sad, especially since I will have to see Marshall twice a season playing for someone else.

    OK - here's the place to go when your Binky gets picked off by someonne else.
     
  2. The Scrizz

    The Scrizz 2nd Team Getting Their First Start

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    #11 Jersey

    Same binky and can't find a thing wrong with this post.
     
  3. AndyJohnson

    AndyJohnson PatsFans.com Veteran PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Lets not forget that since the cost of FA is tied pretty closely to how they HAVE PLAYED, the key to Free Agency is finding guys who are going to play better in the future than they have in the past. When I see comments such as 'last remianing HIGH END safety' I often think last remaining safety that will be overpaid in this contract. Now granted, the type of player you are talking about has established a level of play, and the type I am talking about hasn't or is in the process of, but a corner coverted to safety getting 5mill a year at 27 is more likely to be overpayment that a 25 year old safety who has had more limited playing time.
     
  4. jmt57

    jmt57 Moderator Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Marshall is a guy I liked because I'm intrigued with the idea of making McCourty more or less a full time safety this year. There are not a lot of prospects for that position in either free agency or the draft; as bass-ackwards as it seems, it may actually be easier to upgrade corner than safety. In addition many of the pass coverage issues last year that were blamed on the play of the corners were more about the lack of support in pass coverage by the team's safeties.

    Are we comfortable with the idea of drafting and planning on starting from day one either Markelle Martin, George Iloka, or Harrison Smith, depending on who is available? Do we want the pats to enter the draft thinking that they have to get Mark Barron?

    However, I never got the feeling that the Pats would make that move; I'm speculating here but they seem to be fine with some combination of McCourty, Dowling, Arrington and Moore at corner; assuming that is the case they would prefer to take the cap space that would have been allocated to Marshall and instead spend it elsewhere.


    Back to the original post, I really wanted (and still want) a WR - but not the big money names like Mike Wallace or Vincent Jackson that get most of the attention on this forum. I did not have one specific 'binky'; if anything I was far more interested in focusing on defense. Regardless, one of three wide receivers that got my attention was Laurent Robinson. I was kind of hoping/expecting he would be available for less money than this, but as we have seen money spent on wide receivers has been relatively high thus far. With him gone maybe a guy like Robert Meachem will fill that void .... err, how about Josh Morgan .... err, okay; Plan B.

    Chaz Schilens?
    Donnie Avery?
    Early Doucet?
    Andre Caldwell?
    Donte' Stallworth?
    Some soon to be cap cut?

    Yes, I realize I'm kind of reaching now (though I would not be averse to Schilens). I will begrudgingly admit Brandon Lloyd is starting to look better to me than he did a week ago.



    Jaguars, receiver Laurent Robinson agree to five-year contract | jacksonville.com



    Laurent Robinson, who caught 11 touchdown passes for the Dallas Cowboys last season, agreed to a five-year deal worth $32.5 million with about $2.5 million more in incentives. His gurantees are in the $14 million range.

    Robinson, entering his sixth season in the league out of Illinois State, caught a career-best 54 passes for 858 yards last season in Dallas.

    The deal is similar to the five-year, $34 million deal that tight end Marcedes Lewis signed last season. That had $17 million in guarantees.

    Robinson caught 54 passes for 858 yards and 11 touchdowns last year with Dallas. That was after he was cut by the Cowboys and re-signed a week later. He also was previously was cut by Atlanta and St. Louis.

    Robinson, 6 feet 2 and 194 pounds, is being counted on to provide a big target for quarterback Blaine Gabbert, who struggled in his rookie season.​
     
    Last edited: Mar 15, 2012
  5. patfanken

    patfanken Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract

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    #91 Jersey

    Good points, Andy, and I understand what your trying to say, but the very fact that he's had only one year of extensive playing time at the position, and, by all accounts, played it well, would lead me to believe that he can eventually elevate his game to an even higher level as he continues get snaps at the position. A player who could bring that to the table for $5MM/yr would be well worth it....and would still be only 30 when his contract is done, the very prime of his career

    Worth it because, as the game evolves, I believe the safety position is going to become more valuable to the defensive back field than the CB. In the past a majority of the passing attack was directed at the WRs....and to a great degree outside the hash marks. In recent years, the number of formations that feature 4 and 5 possible receivers has grown, so and offense can lessen the impact of a shut down CB simply by ignoring him.

    A decade ago if you had a "shut down CB", you could effectively smother a third of your opponents passing game, and redirect more of your resources to disrupt the other 2 thirds. In today's game you can diminish the impact of that CB by just ignoring him. With so many other options, you can still have an effective passing game, essentially sacrificing one of your receivers.

    For example just look at the Pats/Jets. The Jets have the best CB in the game. He can absolutely take away your best outside threat. So what. The Pats put up 30+ points on the Jets in both games last season. They did it by taking the best defensive player the Jets had, and made him irrelevant. You win when the the best player on your opponent's defense only has an impact on about 5 of the 60-70 offensive snaps in a game.

    This is and will be compounded by the growing trend of the Welker like slot receivers, and the Gronk/Hernandez type TE's. These are the players who are changing the focus of the passing game from outside the hash, to INSIDE the hash, thus making the safety even more critical in the new NFL.

    The Safety has many more opportunities to make plays than any CB. Given the choice of having Ed Reed or Darrell Revis, I'd take Reed every time time, simply because I'd have my best DB involved in more plays and the offense can't marginalize him.

    All this made me believe that we need to get the highest quality Safeties that we can. Sure we can draft Smith,Iloki or Martin. (BTW-I think Martin is the better value). Or there are a couple of big CB's, Gilmore and Johnson, who some think would make great safeties on the next lever. But I wonder if its fair to expect any rookie safety to make the kind of impact that Marshall would have.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 15, 2012
  6. patfanken

    patfanken Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract

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    #91 Jersey

    BTW- just a reminder, I didn't mean for this to become a Richard Marshall discussion or even one about safeties in general, but one about YOUR binky who has now gone on to greener pastures with ANOTHER team. :mad:

    (though it is OK to talk about Marshall or safeties if you want.) ;)
     
  7. supafly

    supafly PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #24 Jersey

    I too, was very high on Marshall; mostly for the reasons that you described.

    I thought that a signing like this could add a lot of competition to any one of the secondary spots, not to mention the fact that we wouldn't get stuck with having an Ihedigbo or Brown back there if worst came to worst.

    I also thought that a signing like this could have pretty much solved the secondary issues at FS, with the addition of another draft pick too.

    I thought the money was reasonable for a guy of his caliber and age, apparently Belichick felt differently, and that's what matters most.

    The only other signing I really was interested in was a WR like Wayne or Llyod; someone who would be an upgrade for reasonable money. I don't necessarily agree with the money/yrs given to Wayne, but I can understand that the Colts had to give him some kind of reason to want to stay.

    Any kind of mid range addition to the front 7 was a priority too, as I liked guys like Castillo/Langford/J.Johnson, even Bunkley--guys that wouldn't necessarily break the bank but would be solid additions.

    I can't imagine what posters were thinking by honestly considered the thought that BB would have brought in a guy like M.Williams, Carr, VJax, Colston, or Mike Wallace. None of those guys would have made sense considering how much money they wanted.
     
    Last edited: Mar 15, 2012
  8. supafly

    supafly PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #24 Jersey

    I totally agree with you 100%.

    I think that adding a guy with versatility in the secondary would only make the possibility of using one of the hybrids now (McCourty, Moore, Dowling) at FS even greater.

    Or, they could've used Marshall as a pure FS too. One way or another, they certainly could've mixed and matched, adding even more competition and depth to BOTH positions.

    A high draft pick would have been the icing on the cake for sure.

    Another guy I was kind of high on was Eric Wright as a CB, but Mike Adams would have been a nice fit too at FS.

    In my opinion, Marshall was practically a steal at the price they got him for, and had already proven himself as being a decent player in his NFL tenure.

    Out of all the "missed" FA possibilities, this is the one that would've made the most sense, and been realistic. They gave Marshall the same value per year as the NEP gave Leigh Bodden, and that was what?, 3 years ago.

    Hate to question or complain, but in this case I think everything would've worked out nicely. This is why I am not a GM ;)



    I think this is the winner here, and at this point a guy like Jabar Gaffney would make a lot of sense. He's due 2.65 this upcoming season, and the way the Skins are targeting WR's (E.Royal also still in the mix), they may very well part with him as a flat out cut.

    Gaffney had 70 catches this past yr, catching balls from no one at all, and knows this offense well. He could be an upgrade from Branch, and we could have the following top 4 targets for Brady:

    --Welker

    --Gronkowski

    --Hernandez

    --Gaffney

    (with the potential of a high draft pick, Chad Johnson and a whole off-season and TC, Edelman, and the possibility of Branch coming back too)

    Definitely an improvement.

    Something a lot of posters are overlooking is the idea of Shane Vereen being in the passing game this year, which could add one more dimension to the mix. I don't think this should even be questioned, as it likely is already the plan.




    With the Jags signing Chad Henne today, they may feel that Henne is the better immediate option, at least until Gabbert does some more learning and gets some more experience.

    I think it's actually a good move for the Jags, at least compared to what they had.

    I do think they overpaid in a huge way for Robinson though, almost 7 million per year?

    One more WR signing that is pushing the Welker value up even higher.




    .
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 15, 2012
  9. TriplecHamp

    TriplecHamp Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract

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    #24 Jersey

    Don't even think the pats are interested in my binky:(
     
  10. MP-Logick

    MP-Logick Third String But Playing on Special Teams

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    I think we all liked Richard Marshall, especially at the price the Dolphins paid.

    Too bad.
     
  11. patsfan-1982

    patsfan-1982 In the Starting Line-Up

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    i think McCourty is going to play FS next year and they will add CB dept through the Draft
     
  12. KDPPatsfan85

    KDPPatsfan85 In the Starting Line-Up

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    #51 Jersey

    My CB binky Richard Marshall is off the board and unfortunately went to one of our rivals.

    My OLB is Mario Williams AND there is no way he is signing here.

    My WR binky is Brandon Lloyd and there is still a shot for him.
     
  13. BlueThunder

    BlueThunder PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #24 Jersey

    My binky is signing Peyton Manning to back up Tom :)
     
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