There's no way Lonie Paxton makes this team

[spacecrime]

Izzo plays 20-40 snaps per season at LB. I loved it when he intercepted at the end of the game to preserve the ironic 31-0 shutout of the Bills at the end of the 2003 season.

That was so awesome. I was afraid that the Bills would score at the end and I really really really wanted the symetry of 31-0 bookends for the season.

 

[spacecrime]

Indy Colts 2004!!!!!!!!! What a team.

Hey they had 2 roster spots for kickers!!!!!!!!

Actually, I wouldn't mind having 2 kickers on the roster this year. Grammatical and Gostkowski. I think it provides much more value, at least for this season, than having a - dare I say it? - long snapper.

And no, Pats1, that doesn't mean I want 2 punters

 

[Crazy Patriot Guy]

If a Mills or Hochstein matches Paxton 95% of the time, snap for snap, I'd say thank you for everything (or that one thing) Lonie, best of luck.

If they can't, then I'd keep Paxton.

Simple as that.

I think you are going to find though that they aren't going to match Paxton 95% of the time. Paxton has been about as perfect as you can be in terms of long snapping since day 1. I honestly can't remember a time that a snap wasn't where it was supposed to be. Expecting someone to be just about as good as him is asking a whole lot.

The point was brought up that AV was really particular about his timing and placement and now that he's gone, it isn't as important anymore. I think it's more important than ever to have a great long snapper. We're replacing one of the best kickers ever with a rookie. The last thing we need is high snaps or snaps rolling in the dirt on FG attempts with a rookie out there.

Belichick is too high on the importance of special teams to cut Paxton simply for the roster spot. He will not downgrade that position just to have an extra player. Like you say, if someone proves they can effective at it, then Paxton might be gone. However, I don't expect someone will snap well enough consistently enough to Belichick's liking.

 

[PatsSteve1]

It seems to me that not only does the LS have to get the ball to the holder/punter but block as well.

* This is off the subject of the thread but didn't they just pass a new rule about what the opposing team can do to the LS?

 

[spacecrime]

This is a really frivolous thread. As Tedy just said in an interview on my TV a few minutes ago, all we know in the wake of the draft is the team got younger. Whether any of these players will actually pan out is something we won't know for quite a while.

So we should close down the forum until December until we know how the rookies do? Or wait three years to be sure?

Hey, there ain't going to be anything of significance to talk about until training camp starts.

If this thread bothers you, wait until mid July. Who knows what we'll be talking about by then?

We may be arguing about who will make the 2008 practice squad.

But seriously, I don't think this thread is frivolous. Distribution and use of roster spots is a serious topic, and worthy of discussion. You won't get discussion like this on NFL LIVE!

Plus we have differing positions on whether the last play of the game is more important than the ones in the first half. That's not frivolous.

 

[spacecrime]

Belichick is too high on the importance of special teams to cut Paxton simply for the roster spot.

Not for the roster spot.I over-simplied. For a different player in that 53rd roster spot. What if Willie ANdrews really shines as a punt returner and it comes down to him orLonnie for the last roster spot. EIther way special teams will both be served and weakened. Maybe it WILL be Lonnie who had better value. I just don't think you can automatically say that the long snapper will give better value than every other player who might be the 53rd man. Maybe next Septeber I'll have a name. "I wouldn't want to put xxx on the waiver wire in order to keep Lonnie Paxton." Or maybe "I wouldn't want to put Paxton on the waiver wire in order to keep xxx."

 

[patsox23]

Lonnie Paxton is the best long-snapper in football. It might not seem like a big deal to you, but I'm guessing it does to BB. You're talking about Mills and Thomas - two guys who have NEVER long-snapped in a game before. Grow up.

 

[DaBruinz]

Lonnie Paxton is the best long-snapper in football. It might not seem like a big deal to you, but I'm guessing it does to BB. You're talking about Mills and Thomas - two guys who have NEVER long-snapped in a game before. Grow up.

It was pointed out that Mills snapped for 3 games when Tulsa's primary longsnapper went down. And Mills, supposedly, snapped perfectly for Tulsa after never having done so before.

Having a back-up LS on the roster wouldn't be a bad thing since it would cover the potential of Paxton being injured like he was during the 2003 play-offs.

 

[Bostonian1962]

Reading articles about Mills made me think we'll see a lot of players long snapping in pre-season games. How many guys do we now have that can long snap? Several years of Belioli scouting and drafting has yielded too much talent to waste a roster spot on a guy who plays one position and is in the game for 8 plays a game. It was once worth keeping Paxton because the 54th best player at the end of training camp wasn't as seriously challenging for a roster spot. This year final decisions are going to be something like:

Keep one......Pass, Paxton, Bethel

It's cool that several guys can snap. However, the Pats have the single best long snapper in football. Paxton is the best. He almost never has a bad snap. We shall see what happens.

 

[Pats726]

I think this is kind of a ridiculous thread....Paxton is the best long snapper...he can long snap many yards and has always had fun long snapping the ball over the goal posts..It is automatic... How many place kicks oe punts are there in a game?? 14-15??? Not many, but with possible disasters built into them..why not keep the best???
They even talked about this on PFW yesterday and again, it was met with a lot of funny talk. Just not happening...too importnat a position to mess with.
Is it good that Mills and Thomas can long snap?? Of course..but now?? Paxton is the guy.

 

[tombonneau]

But why take the reduction in the quality of play at that position as well as the experience and comfort levels? What's that accomplishing?

It's accomplishing an extra roster spot some someone like ******* Heath Evans isn't signed off the street to start at running back.

Or to keep Troy Brown on the offensive side of the ball.

 

[zippo59]

I don't know if this has already been said because I don't have time to read this entire thread but Paxton is going to make the team not only because he is one of the best LS in the league but because the alternative would be Mills and Thomas, two TE+, who could both very likely get hurt at the same time and neither could be acrive and then where would we be? Yes it would be nice to not use a roster spot on a guy who does only one thing, but by him doing that one thing he is less likely to get hurt so you end up actually saving roster because you don't have to find a replacement in the likely event both you TE/LS are out for a game. Add to that Pats TE seem to not be able to stay healthy for the whole season, perhaps because of the physicality asked of him by the Pats, and Paxton is looking like a keeper. The last thing we want, especislly with a rookie kicker is to have a carousel of LS. The kicker, LS, and holder need to develop somewhat of a chemistry and that would make it difficult. Paxton and Miller already have a good chemistry, why uspet it?

 

[patchick]

I presume that Paxton makes the roster too -- he's valuable and reliable. But for what it's worth, Mike Bartrum most often cited in discussions of the league's best, with David Binn, Brian Jennings and Jeff Robinson close behind.

 

[Brady-To-Branch]

Belichick loves Paxton because he snaps quickly. I remember him talking about how they time the long snappers from how long it takes them to deliver the ball to the holder/punter from the start of the snap, and Belichick said Paxton is one of the quickest at getting the ball back there accurately.

Also, teams are hesitant to have a regular player long-snap, because if there is an injury they are screwed. That is one reason why so many teams set aside a roster spot specifically for a long-snapper, and why that player usually doesn't play a big role on other units. Granted, Mills has yet to earn any role, but nonetheless the long-snap role is more important than you think.

NE39, you stole my thunder. However, if Thomas AND Mills can both deep snap, it might be worth giving both split DS duties in the 4 exhibition games to see how it works out. It wouldn't hurt. All 53 roster spots are vital and having not one, but two active DS players, who contribute with the regular offense, on the field does have its advantages.

 

[MDPATSFAN]

There are alot of less than spectacularly talented players that have had nice careers by mastering the art of long snapping. Few players have the ability to do it consistently and reliably. These guys don't get the glamor of the skill players, the mere fact that you rarely hear the guys name means he's doing the job. There's way too much risk to be screwing around at this position!

 

[spacecrime]

Few players have the ability to do it consistently and reliably.

Well, I watch a ton of football games every year, and can only remember a half dozen long snaps that went so bad that the punter or holder couldn't recover, so we have at least 32 players who can do it consistently and reliably.

I think most of the long snappers in the league do a good job. We can watch Joe Condo in camp, and count the bad snaps (won't need many fingers for that).

Does anyone know how many teams keep actually keep a roster spot just for the long snapper? How many use a guard, center or tight end?

 

[Feep_FLA]

Lonnie Paxton makes the team easily...... He does one thing better than anyone that really valuable.... LP makes the team without question.... The fact that Mills could fill in in a pinch is just a nice bonus...

 

[pats1]

It's accomplishing an extra roster spot some someone like ******* Heath Evans isn't signed off the street to start at running back.

Or to keep Troy Brown on the offensive side of the ball.

Again - we KNOW that there's a need for a long snapper some 5 or 6 times a game. That need will never change. We DON'T KNOW if there will be a need for that 53rd player to step in to prevent what you just said. And if that need arises during some point in the season, having a mid-round rookie like Mills in there is not much more of a sure bet than having a street free agent in there.

 

[MDPATSFAN]

Well, I watch a ton of <a style='text-decoration: none; border-bottom: 3px double;' href="http://www.qklinkserver.com/lm/rtl3.asp?si=92&k=football%20games&st=1" onmouseover="window.status='Search for: football games'; self.ql_skeyphrase='football%20games'; if(window.event) self.ql_sevent=window.event.srcElement; self.ql_timeout = setTimeout('ql_doMouseOver(1)', 1000); self.ql_isOverLink=true; return true;" onclick="if(self.ql_timeout) clearTimeout(self.ql_timeout); self.ql_isOverTip = false; ql_closeiframe(); self.ql_skeyphrase='football%20games'; window.status='Search for: football games';return true;" onmouseout="window.status=''; if(self.ql_timeout) clearTimeout(self.ql_timeout); self.ql_isOverTip = false; setTimeout('ql_closeiframe()', 1500); ">football games</a> every year, and can only remember a half dozen long snaps that went so bad that the punter or holder couldn't recover, so we have at least 32 players who can do it consistently and reliably.

I think most of the long snappers in the league do a good job. We can watch Joe Condo in camp, and count the bad snaps (won't need many fingers for that).

Does anyone know how many teams keep actually keep a roster spot just for the long snapper? How many use a guard, center or tight end?

There are fewer than you realize since many of these guys have 17 year careers, and are even called out of retirement at times.

A good read about longsnappers here:

http://www.azcentral.com/sports/columns/articles/0824boivin0824.html

 

[pats1]

Well, I watch a ton of football games every year, and can only remember a half dozen long snaps that went so bad that the punter or holder couldn't recover, so we have at least 32 players who can do it consistently and reliably.

I think most of the long snappers in the league do a good job. We can watch Joe Condo in camp, and count the bad snaps (won't need many fingers for that).

Does anyone know how many teams keep actually keep a roster spot just for the long snapper? How many use a guard, center or tight end?

(For a 'pure' long snapper, I have them not making any catches or starts at any position).

The Bills have Mike Schneck as a pure long snapper.

The Dolphins have John Denney as a long snapper/emergency DE.

The Patriots have Lonie Paxton as a pure long snapper.

The Jets have James Dearth as a long snapper/emergency TE who has started 1 game and has 3 career catches.

The Ravens have Matt Katula as a pure long snapper.

The Bengals have Brad St. Louis as a pure long snapper.

The Browns have Ryan Pontbriand as a pure long snapper.

The Steelers have Greg Warren as a pure long snapper.

The Texans have Bryan Pittman as a pure long snapper.

The Colts have Justin Snow as a pure long snapper.

The Jaguars have Joe Zelenka as a pure long snapper.

The Broncos have Mike Leach as a pure long snapper.

The Chiefs have Kendall Gammon as a pure long snapper.

The Raiders have Adam Treu as a long snapper and now-backup C who has started 44 games over his career.

The Chargers have David Binn as a pure long snapper.

The Cowboys have L.P. LaDouceur as a pure long snapper.

The Giants have Ryan Kuehl as a pure long snapper.

The Eagles have Mike Bartrum as a long snapper/emergency TE who has started 0 games but caught 11 balls over his career.

The Redskins have Ethan Albright as a pure long snapper.

The Bears have Patrick Mannelly as a pure long snapper.

The Lions have Don Muhlbach as a pure long snapper.

The Packers have Rob Davis as a long snapper and emergency DT.

The Vikings have Cullen Loeffler as a pure long snapper.

The Falcons have Derek Rackley as a long snapper and emergency DT who has 1 career start and 1 career catch.

The Panthers have Jason Kyle as a long snapper and emergency LB.

The Saints have Kevin Houser as a pure long snapper.

The Bucs have Dave Moore as a long snapper and TE who has 107 career starts and 206 career catches.

The Cardinals have Nathan Hodel as a pure long snapper.

The Rams have Chris Massey a long snapper and emergency FB with 1 career start and 1 career rush (for -1 yds.)

The 49ers have Brian Jennings as a pure long snapper.

The Seahawks have J.P. Darche as a pure long snapper.


So, the final numbers:

23 long snappers who have not recorded a sack, catch, start, or pass-defended.

7 long snappers who are fill-in emergency players with barely any stats.

2 long snappers who have significant starting time in the league.


This isn't college or high school football. Bill the starting TE doesn't punt while Jack the starting C long snaps. These are specialized football players.