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There is no way Hanson makes this team!

Discussion in 'PatsFans.com - Patriots Fan Forum' started by Lloyd_Christmas, Mar 12, 2009.

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  1. Lloyd_Christmas

    Lloyd_Christmas I can delete my own crap! PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Ok, I'm throwing down the annual gauntlet in honor of the original "There is no way David Patten makes this team" thread... for those who remember.

    Unfortunately, I'm targeting the punter and who cares about punters?

    Still, here are my arguments for dumping Hanson:

    With our offense, we don't punt very often. But when we do, it is usually from around midfield or so... where you are trying to pin the opponent inside their 20 yard line.

    Hanson is not good at this (in fact, only 4 punters in the entire league were worse than him at this.


    ********************************************

    Inside the numbers:

    At first glance, you see that 40% of his punts resulted in the opponent left inside their 20 yard line and it appears impressive. Then you realize that 60% of his punts where these sort of punts and he screwed up 10 of them, resulting in TBs (or 33.3% failure rate).

    Most punters aren't lucky enough to be in that position on 60% of their punts. If they were, then the statistics show that almost all of them would have better "inside the 20" numbers than Hanson.

    **********************************************

    Due to our offensive success, I think we should bring in someone else to compete with Hanson other than Malone... maybe a low draft pick.

    Preferably someone with better skill at pinning the opponent down inside their 20 yard line.

    Raw distance is probably of less importance to us... an area where Hanson is only mediocre anyway.
     
    Last edited: Mar 12, 2009
  2. Lloyd_Christmas

    Lloyd_Christmas I can delete my own crap! PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Here is some more NE punting info:

    Facts:

    50 punts: 9 OutBnds, 7 Dwnd, 10 TchBcks, 13 FairCtch, 11 Rtrnd
    Longest punt: 70 yds
    Average punt: 44 yds (Tied for 15th)
    Net Average: 36.8 yds (20th)
    20 punts resulted in oppenent inside their 20 yd line (27th - see info below)
    0 TDs
    0 Blocked punts

    Positives:

    40% of all punts were a FC or Dwnd and an additional 10% (9 punts out of bounds) were probably coffin kicks.

    40% of punts left the opponent inside their own 20 yd line.

    No punts were blocked or returned for TDs.


    Negatives:

    20% of Hanson's punts were TBs (10 TBs on 50 punts). Unacceptable!

    33.3% of his punts that were targeted for inside the 20 yd line resulted in TBs (10 out of 30).
    -- That ranks 27th in the league. Only 4 teams had a worse %. Sea was tied with us.
    -- The best: Colts 8.7%, Bengels: 10.7%, and Bears: 12.5%

    14+ yds/punt average return is bad.

    Net average punt of 36.8 yds ranks 20th in the league.
    -- Note: 60% of Hanson's punts were targeted for inside the 20 yd line which will skew towards shorter punts.
     
    Last edited: Mar 12, 2009
  3. Synovia

    Synovia In the Starting Line-Up

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    Great, but is there any evidence that touchback percentage on punts is a stat that correlates to future performance?


    We already KNOW that field goal accuracy doesnt, and that kickoff distance is more important. Do we know that we're not looking at the same case with punts?



    (also, I think I20 is a bad stat. A punt that goes out at the 15 is only marginally better than a touchback. I10 would be much more usefull, but its not tracked. )
     
  4. Lloyd_Christmas

    Lloyd_Christmas I can delete my own crap! PatsFans.com Supporter

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    I don't have an answer for your first question. I haven't looked at historical data to see if punters are consitent in their performance concerning pinning down opponents vice kicking touch backs. My guess is that some punters are consistently good at it and others are consistently bad or just plain inconsistent in general.

    I would agree that the I20 stat can be misleading. I'd like to see an I20 and an I10 stat together. Still won't paint the full picture, but it would be better than just having one of them.
     
  5. Synovia

    Synovia In the Starting Line-Up

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    My guess would be the same, but who knows

    ( and I think Hanson sucks)
     
  6. Synovia

    Synovia In the Starting Line-Up

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    My biggest issue with the I20 stat is all those punts from the 35-40 yard line that guys shank and end up stopping at the 18. If you only gained 17-22 yards on a punt, it wasn't worth punting.
     
  7. swheeler23

    swheeler23 In the Starting Line-Up

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    Brady will stuggle some when he comes back. Does everyone just expect him to continue like he did in 2007?
     
  8. ScottieC

    ScottieC In the Starting Line-Up

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    I don't see Bill taking a chance - That said, he will bring in a few guys to compete for the job, like last year and in the end Hanson will make the team.
     
  9. DaBruinz

    DaBruinz Pats, B's, Sox PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #50 Jersey

    I'm pretty good at math and 9 of 50 is not 10% but 18%. Also, it should be noted that he had the fewest punts returned in the league for punters with more than 40 punts with 11 or 22% of his punts.

    Punt return yardage is as much about the coverage team play as it is the punter. You heaping ALL the blame on Hanson is BS.



    Where did you get the stats that say that 60% of Hanson's punts were targeted for inside the 20?
     
  10. RoughingthePasser

    RoughingthePasser Rotational Player and Threatening Starter's Job

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    I disagree with the OP's thread.
    There is still a way for Hanson to make the team.
    I liked your observation on his short punting-I haven't seen enough of his punts to make a judgment on accuracy but he can handle distance well.
    I'm sure we'll look at others too.
     
  11. Holy Diver

    Holy Diver Pro Bowl Player

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    Ha....

    I still think David Patten makes the team.
     
  12. bradydaman29

    bradydaman29 Practice Squad Player

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    I've always felt that it's a waste of a roster spot for someone who just kicks!!

    The only time you need a punter that can really boot the ball is when it's 4th down inside your own 35.

    If the ball is past the 35, why not just have the quarterback punt the ball? If you knew this going into training camp, you could have all the quarterbacks practice their punting so they could get some distance, and distance is all you would need since there would be no one back there to field it.

    Inside the 35 is where it would get tricky. It's nice to have a guy who can get a good punt off in that area, but I would much rather groom 3 or 4 special teamers to do the punting chores than use up a critical roster spot for a punter. It doesn't seem like it would be that hard to learn, I wonder why no one has ever tried it. Miami will probably try it this year, but I would like to see BB give it a go.
     
  13. PATSNUTme

    PATSNUTme Paranoid Homer Moderator Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    He read this thread and it hurt his feelings.

    [​IMG]

    He's now checking all posters IP's.

    [​IMG]
     
  14. Patjew

    Patjew PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    No Jersey Selected

    To Catch a Punter?
     
  15. PATSNUTme

    PATSNUTme Paranoid Homer Moderator Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #75 Jersey

    To catch a predator punter.:cool:
     
  16. fgssand

    fgssand PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    He is also the holder on field goals for the Ghost and they work very well together.

    ALready changed long snappers, I hate to mess up Gost anymore with a new holder as well.

    I think Hanson stays..........unless someone can handle the hold equally as well (not as easy as people may think) and really "out punts" him.
     
  17. captain stone

    captain stone Veteran Starter w/Big Long Term Deal

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    No Jersey Selected

    An upgrade at P is not only possible, but preferable. I am sick to death of watching Hanson kick from midfield, straight down the middle of the field...and into the EZ for a touchback. What a waste of field position. He never should've been signed in the first place.

    As for David Patten - if he were signed tomorrow, no way he doesn't make the team.
     
  18. jmt57

    jmt57 Moderator Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    I'm guessing Ernie Adams has already run the numbers and checked in with this guy:
    Rivals High - Arkansas coach punts traditional game plan

    Actually I'm surprised that some college team, or even an NFL team late in the season hasn't used this approach. It's a whole different game plan on both sides of the ball when you are trying to get ten yards in four tries rather than three.
     
  19. Tyler.Durden

    Tyler.Durden Third String But Playing on Special Teams

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    I am of the opinion that wes welker will be our punter on opening day, that dude can do it all.
     
  20. Schmo

    Schmo Third String But Playing on Special Teams

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    I agree, holding for kicks is half of his job. That's why Ken Walter was so good for us... terrible punter, but I remember Vinatieri singing praises about how much he helped him i.e. the "lean" of the ball when he holds it.

    Hansen is more or less consistent and I'm pretty sure BB is satisfied with his performance. The only statistic that matters to me is punt return yardage. A great punter will find a way to avoid returns on almost every punt, that's where the big yardage comes into play.
     
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