The time has come...

[patfanken]

...to bring this "spygate" issue to a deffinitive END.

When I first heard about Shula's whine about the Pat's potential undefeated season needing an asterisk, my first reaction to pass it off as just a "grumpy old man" (sorta like myself) trying to protect the uniqueness of a record he has held so long. However as the news spread to the national media and was being reported on, I changed my mind.

On PTI, both Wilbon and Kornheiser both gave it a "double WOW". Then Kornheiser, who is sort of the "everyman" kind of columnist, stated that he had now changed his mind about the importance of "spygate" as an issue, and because it was coming from such an eminent sourse as Don Shula, it carried much more weight. So if HE is feeling that way, I believe a lot of "middle america" is feeling the SAME way.

Well that did it for me. Rather than whithering on the vine like it should have this story keep on getting legs, and its time for it to STOP. And the only way it will stop is if the real truth comes out. Tom Curran (in a great column, btw) called the infraction tantamount to aggrevated jaywalking, or in other words being caught for a procedural infraction. (which is what it was).

Now it is time for the truth to come out. Tom Brady has stated on several occassion when asked about comments by the "haters", that "in this lockerroom WE KNOW THE TRUTH, and that's enough for us" (Paraphrase).

Well Tom the time has come to share the "truth" with the rest of us. It is time to let the haters know what you know, that makes you so comfortable with this situation.

Roger Goodell has seemed to have proven that he could teach George Bush a few things about F*cking up a good thing with his handling of this whole thing. His overreacting with the Pats punishment, and his allowing rank speculation and inuendo to go unanswered has not only hurt the Patriots, but its hurt the entire league (as Curran so aptly points out).

I think its becoming clearer every day that Goodel must have some unreported beef with the Pats that goes back a long way. He has left them twisting in the wind, despite his initial pronouncement that none of what the Pats recorded led to the Pats gaining an unfair advantage in a game.

Goodell needs to come out with a definitive statement that lets people know what the Pats taped, how the tapes were used by the Pats, and why if the tapes DIDN'T give the Pats a competitive edge, why the punishment was so heavy handed, and why he destroyed them. (though I think I know why he did). If he doesn't the spygate will be followed by Audiogate, capgate, druggate, etc....all of which just hurts the credibility of the league in general.

BTW- in the "oh boy the irony of it all" column. I couln't believe hearing well known Pats hater Mark Schleith (sp) on Mike and Mike telling people that one of the reasons Denver used the chop blocking technique was inorder to tire out DLmen over the course of a game. The irony of it? Well here was a memeber of the Denver Broncos who violated the Cap inorder to win 2 superbowls telling the world he used an illegal technique to get an unfair advantage over the opposition....the day after he questioned the integrity of the Patriots....AGAIN... because of "spygate". That is why his picture is featured next to the definition of HYPOCRACY in the dictionary.

FInally Wretch has put together a must read collection of articles in a post titled "Fed up with the Hypocracy". Read the acticles, desseminated the information, and keep bumping it up. And BTW the Curran article is not to be missed either

 

[Slagathor]

Re: The time has come....

...to bring this "spygate" issue to a deffinitive END.

When I first heard about Shula's whine about the Pat's potential undefeated season needing an asterisk, my first reaction to pass it off as just a "grumpy old man" (sorta like myself) trying to protect the uniqueness of a record he has held so long. However as the news spread to the national media and was being reported on, I changed my mind.

On PTI, both Wilbon and Kornheiser both gave it a "double WOW". Then Kornheiser, who is sort of the "everyman" kind of columnist, stated that he had now changed his mind about the importance of "spygate" as an issue, and because it was coming from such an eminent sourse as Don Shula, it carried much more weight. So if HE is feeling that way, I believe a lot of "middle america" is feeling the SAME way.

Well that did it for me. Rather than whithering on the vine like it should have this story keep on getting legs, and its time for it to STOP. And the only way it will stop is if the real truth comes out. Tom Curran (in a great column, btw) called the infraction tantamount to aggrevated jaywalking, or in other words being caught for a procedural infraction. (which is what it was).

Now it is time for the truth to come out. Tom Brady has stated on several occassion when asked about comments by the "haters", that "in this lockerroom WE KNOW THE TRUTH, and that's enough for us" (Paraphrase).

Well Tom the time has come to share the "truth" with the rest of us. It is time to let the haters know what you know, that makes you so comfortable with this situation.

Roger Goodell has seemed to have proven that he could teach George Bush a few things about F*cking up a good thing with his handling of this whole thing. His overreacting with the Pats punishment, and his allowing rank speculation and inuendo to go unanswered has not only hurt the Patriots, but its hurt the entire league (as Curran so aptly points out).

I think its becoming clearer every day that Goodel must have some unreported beef with the Pats that goes back a long way. He has left them twisting in the wind, despite his initial pronouncement that none of what the Pats recorded led to the Pats gaining an unfair advantage in a game.

Goodell needs to come out with a definitive statement that lets people know what the Pats taped, how the tapes were used by the Pats, and why if the tapes DIDN'T give the Pats a competitive edge, why the punishment was so heavy handed, and why he destroyed them. (though I think I know why he did). If he doesn't the spygate will be followed by Audiogate, capgate, druggate, etc....all of which just hurts the credibility of the league in general.

BTW- in the "oh boy the irony of it all" column. I couln't believe hearing well known Pats hater Mark Schleith (sp) on Mike and Mike telling people that one of the reasons Denver used the chop blocking technique was inorder to tire out DLmen over the course of a game. The irony of it? Well here was a memeber of the Denver Broncos who violated the Cap inorder to win 2 superbowls telling the world he used an illegal technique to get an unfair advantage over the opposition....the day after he questioned the integrity of the Patriots....AGAIN... because of "spygate". That is why his picture is featured next to the definition of HYPOCRACY in the dictionary.

FInally Wretch has put together a must read collection of articles in a post titled. Read the acticles, desseminated the information, and keep bumping it up. And BTW the Curran article is not to be missed either

Let's face it. The Patriots have taken most of the drama out of the NFL season.

I know this is going to sound extremely homerish, but facts are facts.

Other than Indy, does it really matter who else makes the playoffs in either conference?

The season has taken on a very much pre-determined course. The media needs to keep things interesting. The spygate thing will continue to have legs because people will keep propping it up.

Although we rightfully want to put it to rest because it bears no significance to the Pats current perfomance, the MEDIA, not our competitors want the controversey to have legs.

 

[upstater1]

Re: The time has come....

This is not going to come out into the open. I'm telling you. I've already heard enough from Gooddell about his motives. he knows this is a bogus issue. What will hurt the NFL more than the whole Spygate thing is for the commissioner to admit he's a boob, and that's the only way that the truth will come out.

Go back to the Costas interview before the San Diego game.

Costas: "With all the high-tech gadgetry out there, binoculars with digital recording, how do you plan to legislate against people recording signals from elsewhere in the stadium?"

Gooddell: "This wasn't high-tech and it was being done in the open on the sidelines."

The NFL fined the Patriots for doing it out in the supposed open. That's it. This is not about cheating. It's about appearances, and Gooddell in his petulant a-holeness decided to come down hard on the Patriots for violating his memo and for taking liberties with the "appearance of the league."

Now, do you really expect Gooddell to go out there and say, look, I only fined them for violating my memo. The NFL can't police this sort of thing. I made a mountain out of a molehill.

I don't.

 

[PYPER]

Re: The time has come....

"Spygate" is far from over. Think its annoying now, just wait until the two week period before the Super Bowl.

I don't see Belichick or the Patriots addressing it in any way while the season is in progress. It wouldn't surprise me, though, if they did something after the season is over.

I would like them to put together a video segment that shows how they used the footage. I believe they used it to cross reference with the game tape to document, catalog, and file the reactionary adjustments that opposing defensive coaches make when the Patriots show them certain looks or formations on offense.

Ex: What adjustments does the defense do when the offense shifts from a pro set to an empty backfield.

 

[Sundayjack]

Re: The time has come....

Now it is time for the truth to come out. Tom Brady has stated on several occassion when asked about comments by the "haters", that "in this lockerroom WE KNOW THE TRUTH, and that's enough for us" (Paraphrase).

Well Tom the time has come to share the "truth" with the rest of us. It is time to let the haters know what you know, that makes you so comfortable with this situation.

Not the kind of guy to say 'I told you so,' but. . .

I agree, and said much the same as the story lingered after the initial report. The Patriots have lost control of the message to the media and, as a result, have allowed their brand to be devalued. Just very poor public relations work in an organization that has one of the best business and marketing operations in the league. Surprising.

 

[patfanken]

Re: The time has come....

I would like them to put together a video segment that shows how they used the footage. I believe they used it to cross reference with the game tape to document, catalog, and file the reactionary adjustments that opposing defensive coaches make when the Patriots show them certain looks or formations on offense.

Ex: What adjustments does the defense do when the offense shifts from a pro set to an empty backfield.

EXACTLY, Pyper. Now how do you get that message to the media who would MUCH rather hype the "good vs evil" agenda?

 

[Pats726]

Re: The time has come....

Is this not the same Schlereth who kept saying during spygaye that the fact that the Pats KNEW what the plays were that that was totally unfair and TOTALLY wrong?? The same one who kept making that point so much?? The same one who plated for the Broncos who as their coach said ALWAYS had the signals figured out by halftime??? Hmmmmmm TES HYPOCRITE should be his middle name...

 

[bradmahn]

Re: The time has come....

The irony of ironies is that Gregg Easterbrook had a hint of foresight with his over-the-top shenanigans.

 

[aluminum seats]

Re: The time has come....

I disagree with the premise of this thread, that Shula speaking out is some sort of turning point. Regardless of what Kornheiser said (he's a clown) my sense is that it's a tipping point the other way. I posted on another thread that Michael Kay, the yankees broadcaster/new york radio homer, blasted Shula yesterday for this, saying basically he sounds like a bitter old man trying to hold onto his glory. People get sick of the same story, and it will turn, outside of anyone who's set on hating the Pats.

As for the Pats managing the message, this bs was going to run its course regardless of what the Pats did. Anything they said/say would just be oxygen for the fire.

 

[OtisCampbell]

Re: The time has come....

I disagree with the premise of this thread, that Shula speaking out is some sort of turning point. Regardless of what Kornheiser said (he's a clown) my sense is that it's a tipping point the other way. I posted on another thread that Michael Kay, the yankees broadcaster/new york radio homer, blasted Shula yesterday for this, saying basically he sounds like a bitter old man trying to hold onto his glory. People get sick of the same story, and it will turn, outside of anyone who's set on hating the Pats.

As for the Pats managing the message, this bs was going to run its course regardless of what the Pats did. Anything they said/say would just be oxygen for the fire.

Agreed, this was no turning point. 80% of the responses blasted Shula.

Thinking that anything Tony Kornheiser says is meaningful is off the mark. He is a dipsh*t.

 

[Joker]

Re: The time has come....

Tony Kornholio needs someone to step up and douse that dead rat on his head with lighter fluid....what a dyam freak

 

[FrontSeven]

Re: The time has come....

Calling it jaywalking is a good metaphor. I called it a minor misdemeanor. It was all about the location of the camera and nothing more. How insignificant can that be?

The media is hands off on the Jets and Colts little screwups this year. No traction there because one team is pathetic and the other team is led by a Saint and is trying to defeat all evil on the planet.

 

[Sundayjack]

Re: The time has come....

I posted on another thread that Michael Kay, the yankees broadcaster/new york radio homer, blasted Shula yesterday for this, saying basically he sounds like a bitter old man trying to hold onto his glory.

Michael Kay? A poor gauge. As ANY Jets fan, he hates Don Shula with a seething white hot passion, and wishes that his next golf swing would cause his brittle bones to snap like seasoned kindling, and that he would crumple up into a a well-stacked pile for a winter of burning.

 

[aluminum seats]

Re: The time has come....

Michael Kay? A poor gauge. As ANY Jets fan, he hates Don Shula with a seething white hot passion, and wishes that his next golf swing would cause his brittle bones to snap like seasoned kindling, and that he would crumple up into a a well-stacked pile for a winter of burning.

I think Jets fans hate the Pats more than the Dolphins by now. Point is, he and his partner are pretty typical, follow-the-crowd types, and their instinctive reaction to Shula was that he sounded like a nut.

 

[bakes781]

Re: The time has come....

It shouldn't even be called "spygate" it should be called "video-out-in-the-open-gate" lol Don Shula a former HC is a credible source, but Shanahan a current HC isn't?

 

[Sundayjack]

Re: The time has come....

I think Jets fans hate the Pats more than the Dolphins by now. Point is, he and his partner are pretty typical, follow-the-crowd types, and their instinctive reaction to Shula was that he sounded like a nut.

Younger Jets fans, maybe. For grizzled older bastards such as I - Don Shula deserves a nice long soak in a pool of piranha and electric eels.

 

[OtisCampbell]

Re: The time has come....

Younger Jets fans, maybe. For grizzled older bastards such as I - Don Shula deserves a nice long soak in a pool of piranha and electric eels.

I did take a run through Jets Insider yesterday, and I was really surprised at the venom that was being spewed towards Shula and anything Dolphin, even when it involved the Pats.

 

[TruthSeeker]

Re: The time has come....

Ken, it's not happening. No matter what you or anyone else wants, the Patriots don't go around talking (or thinking) about anything that changes their focus from winning the next football game.

I was pretty disappointed about the PTI reaction. What substance or facts did Don Shula have to offer? Absolutely nothing! He had an opinion - and didn't even back it up with any facts or reasoning (such as exactly how this videotaping gave the Patriots a significant edge). For thinking people who value credible opinions, this isn't much of an issue. For those who weigh opinions as important or even more important than facts and carefully considered reasoning, this is indeed an important pronouncement.

Fortunately, it appears that America is speaking and that they don't agree with the PTI take. PTI - which I love and watch most every day - is all about opinions and very little about facts. The story is more about what they think than what happened. That's fine, that's what their show is about. Perhaps they overvalue themselves or what they're doing because of the weight that they are giving Don Shula's opinion.

 

[PromisedLand]

Re: The time has come....

Ken, it's not happening. No matter what you or anyone else wants, the Patriots don't go around talking (or thinking) about anything that changes their focus from winning the next football game.

I was pretty disappointed about the PTI reaction. What substance or facts did Don Shula have to offer? Absolutely nothing! He had an opinion - and didn't even back it up with any facts or reasoning (such as exactly how this videotaping gave the Patriots a significant edge). For thinking people who value credible opinions, this isn't much of an issue. For those who weigh opinions as important or even more important than facts and carefully considered reasoning, this is indeed an important pronouncement.

Fortunately, it appears that America is speaking and that they don't agree with the PTI take. PTI - which I love and watch most every day - is all about opinions and very little about facts. The story is more about what they think than what happened. That's fine, that's what their show is about. Perhaps they overvalue themselves or what they're doing because of the weight that they are giving Don Shula's opinion.

I agree. However, I think that once this season is over, a lot more of the real truth is going to start to come out. People will start talking to the media about what REALLY happens in all NFL stadiums every Sunday.

It's interesting that the media has dubbed the incident "spygate", "cameragate" or various other references to the Watergate Scandal. Because I think that it is the NFL that is engaged in a coverup here, to try to sell their squeaky clean image. After all, isn't that why Goodell was hired and given the mission of rooting out the Pacmans and other undesirables who would taint that image?

Anyone who doesn't think that is Goodell's charter hasn't been paying attention. So when the league's preeminent franchise got caught crossing a line (even if it was just a cross-walk line) he came down hard on them. But neither the NFL owners nor Goodell want the public to know the real extent to which this kind of thing goes on.

But, like Watergate, which didn't really start to unravel until almost a year after the breakin took place, eventually this coverup will unravel too. A Deep Throat type will come forward and start whispering to reporters. A Woodard-Bernstein equivalent will continue to write up the various inconsistencies and irregularities in the official story and will continue to investigate as the details slowly emerge.

What the Patriots did will not only come to be seen as business as usual, but rather tame by comparison. In the final analysis, the real bad guys will turn out to be the league itself, and the Patriots will be seen as just another team playing by the system that the league set up, and the talk of asterisks and tainted Super Bowls will be seen in context.

At least, that's what I hope will happen! Don't get me wrong, I still feel that BB hurt the fans by exposing the team's reputation to this kind of accusations they are now receiving, but I think that when seen in the future with the greater perspective of time and history and additional information that the true nature of this incident as "aggravated jaywalking" will be universally accepted.

 

[BrianPat]

Re: The time has come....

It's over !! Seriously, Shula is wacked. How can this new record be tainted by something that was done in the past ?? No one agrees with him, but that won't stop the networks from trying to hype it to draw attention to their shows, but they'll look like fools