PatsFans.com Menu
PatsFans.com - The Hub For New England Patriots Fans

The Tight End Situation


Even without an arrest i doubt ahern plays here again.
 
You don't have to have a good tightend and a move tightend to be successful these days offensively in the NFL. I don't know where that came from. Baltimore won the superbowl and they don't have that, neither did the Giants when they won the superbowl. That style of offense is a choice based off of personnel and strengths.

BAL won the SB b/c they had an offense with 2 WR that could stretch the field, another WR that could catch between the #s, on the outside, the EZ and in traffic, a TE that was solid and a RB that could make big-time plays in the passing game.

The cold hard truth is that right now (Gronk & AH question marks, receiving RB and at WR), the Pats have nothing proven in all four of those areas.
 
Basically Dave Thomas or Dallas Clark.........I say Burger Boy
 
You don't have to have a good tightend and a move tightend to be successful these days offensively in the NFL. I don't know where that came from. Baltimore won the superbowl and they don't have that, neither did the Giants when they won the superbowl. That style of offense is a choice based off of personnel and strengths.

I get that. Unfortunately, there are no strengths without Gronk and Hernandez, unless Dobson and Boyce were home runs or one of the FAs besides Amendola was merely pretending to be mediocre his whole career before coming to New England.
 
How good does BB look at claiming Ballard from the Giants. Makes you wonder if he saw potential problems with Hernandez. We all looked at the pot smoking incidents in college and probably thought big deal. Maybe there were other indications that the pot was nothing compared to behavioral issues. I mean seriously, signs a huge contract that sets him for life, and he is "somehow" involved in a murder. Wonder if there is a behavioral clause in his contract. Me thinks his days with N.E. are numbered.

Considering Belichick (and company) gave Hernandez a big fat extension after adding Ballard, I suspect that he didn't add Ballard expecting problems with Hernandez.

I don't think they'd have given Hernandez his big contract if they thought he was going to be an off-field issue.
 
Considering Belichick (and company) gave Hernandez a big fat extension after adding Ballard, I suspect that he didn't add Ballard expecting problems with Hernandez.

I don't think they'd have given Hernandez his big contract if they thought he was going to be an off-field issue.

Even more relevant is the fact that they certainly wouldn't have omitted a clause which would have protected themselves in the case where he did get arrested.

The fact that there wasn't a clause written into a major money second term pact tells me that they weren't nearly as worried about something like this happening as some would lead us to believe. Either that or they just flat out dropped the ball, but those mega money second term pacts aren't exactly thrown around at will on this team, as they are normally cautious with their investments.

One thing is for sure, you can bet that they are more careful when throwing around big money to any player with a shroud of question in the future. Luckily we really don't have too many of those options on our team though, with maybe Spikes immediately jumping to the top of that list; and most of us don't expect him to be around next year anyway.
 
Even without an arrest i doubt ahern plays here again.

Really? You don't think he ever plays another down here even if they'd come out today and publically state that he's no longer a focus or suspect in the investigation with absolutely no charges brought about?

I'd seriously doubt that myself. He's an extremely young, talented player who provides versatility, matchup mismatches/nightmares, with a huge dead cap hit who just signed a mega deal not even 1 calendar year ago.

The possibility exists that they'll explore the thought of him staying even if he's immediately suspended indefinitely and charged with obstruction of justice. This time next year he could easily be re-instated with this whole thing behind him should he choose to plea that out or admit to any wrongdoing. Of course the actual severity of the charges will play an enormous part of that decision too, so we have no way of knowing what those will be.

I hear what you're saying, but if the charges stay around the area of what has been expected/reported then I wouldn't say it's exactly a done deal that he'll certainly be gone just yet. If the charges are more serious then I agree with you 100% regardless of the outcome.
 
No we don't, we didn't have one back in 2003 or 2004. Ben Watson doesn't count because he was injured after week 1 in 2004. We have enough talent, brains and ability at WR and RB that all we need is for Jake Ballard to play like we know he can and like the Giants knew he can (that's why they were pissed when we signed him) and then the rest is history.

That is a very optimistic approach to it, and while I admire your optimism with every single issue regarding anything the team does, it may not be as realistic as we'd like it to be either.

Given that "in line" TE Gronk set the record for most receiving yards by a TE I think we can be all right without a "move" TE.

And having 2 guys on the field that are credible receiving threats as well as credible blockers could even be considered an upgrade.

I agree that I definitely think we can be alright. I'm sure they'll adapt and still be a good offense, but we're talking about the ability to take advantage of the mismatches that a guy like AH offered.

Having 2 bigger, talented, blocking TEs is certainly better than having zero talent at the position; but we're also making an assumption that Ballard is going to live up to the massive amount of hype created here, and I hope he does.

Many viewed AH as basically a receiver of sorts who was able to line up at the TE position and take advantage of mismatches--which was likely his biggest positive attribute. Having another player who isn't playing the more traditional style of in-line TE would certainly benefit us on many levels.

You don't have to have a good tightend and a move tightend to be successful these days offensively in the NFL. I don't know where that came from. Baltimore won the superbowl and they don't have that, neither did the Giants when they won the superbowl. That style of offense is a choice based off of personnel and strengths.

Your comparing apples to oranges. Of course we all know that other teams have won the SB without having a viable "move" TE, but I was under the impression that we were discussing our scheme and system here, and the benefits of having someone else step into that role.

The teams that you listed had very capable deeper threats at the WR position, something that we currently have not even come close to proving to have.

My comments do not mean that I think the offense will suddenly suck, because that's not even close to what I'm saying. I'm simply discussing the prospects of someone playing that type of TE role, and whether or not Belichick will look towards continuing that route, or if he'll adjust + on what level.

Sudfeld, however, might the only TE with a decent chance of making the 53 who resembles a Move TE.
Brandon Ford actually resembles Hernandez more than anybody else, but I would be shocked if he made
the 53, or even the PS.

I think you're right that Brandon Ford is a very good candidate for the job. Whether or not his attention/stock potentially shot up or not in Belichick's mind is anyone's guess, but I'd have to assume that the past week's developments probably didn't hurt his chances any. We'll have to wait and see what Belichick is thinking and how he deals with this potential (expected) change.
 
You don't have to have a good tightend and a move tightend to be successful these days offensively in the NFL. I don't know where that came from. Baltimore won the superbowl and they don't have that, neither did the Giants when they won the superbowl. That style of offense is a choice based off of personnel and strengths.

Patriots shown last year that our 2TE formation is our bread and butter. That's why we signed Gronk and Hernandez to those deals. So while other teams might not need an elite TE, we do. 87 & 81 are our focal points on offense. With that I know we signed Amendola to "replace" Welker, but I think BB and Josh McD envisioned AH replacing Welker production in the middle of the field/slot.
 
My opinion..... I think a guy they should try and replace Hernandez with ( if Hernandez is gone) is Mark Harrison the UDFA from Rutgers. Both pretty much the same size. Line him up at TE in training camp and see what he can do.
 
I'd like to see what Harrison can do too, but he has to get healthy first. He's already behind
the magic 8-ball by missing OTAs.
 
Really? You don't think he ever plays another down here even if they'd come out today and publically state that he's no longer a focus or suspect in the investigation with absolutely no charges brought about?

I'd seriously doubt that myself. He's an extremely young, talented player who provides versatility, matchup mismatches/nightmares, with a huge dead cap hit who just signed a mega deal not even 1 calendar year ago.

The possibility exists that they'll explore the thought of him staying even if he's immediately suspended indefinitely and charged with obstruction of justice. This time next year he could easily be re-instated with this whole thing behind him should he choose to plea that out or admit to any wrongdoing. Of course the actual severity of the charges will play an enormous part of that decision too, so we have no way of knowing what those will be.

I hear what you're saying, but if the charges stay around the area of what has been expected/reported then I wouldn't say it's exactly a done deal that he'll certainly be gone just yet. If the charges are more serious then I agree with you 100% regardless of the outcome.
Well if the police solve the case and ahrrn is cleared then sure. But I don't see that happening as in I doubt it. More likely it just goes unsolved. What do they do then? The guy has a cloud over his head.
 
Well if the police solve the case and ahrrn is cleared then sure. But I don't see that happening as in I doubt it. More likely it just goes unsolved. What do they do then? The guy has a cloud over his head.

Ray Lewis did just fine with the cloud over his head.
 
Ray Lewis did just fine with the cloud over his head.

Wasn't he found not guilty? Or cooperate in some way? IH ahern never talks to the police and the cloud over his head is that he either killed someone or knows and refuses to tell what happened, then I don't think Goddell or kraft will be OK with that. Just my guess.
 
Wasn't he found not guilty? Or cooperate in some way? IH ahern never talks to the police and the cloud over his head is that he either killed someone or knows and refuses to tell what happened, then I don't think Goddell or kraft will be OK with that. Just my guess.

I get what you're saying and you may very well be correct. All we can do is guess at this point.

Personally I think if there were no charges filed by the police, Goodell will definitely still have him serve some kind of suspension. The length of that suspension would be anywhere between 4-8 games in my opinion, but others may feel differently.

I don't think there's any way that Goodell can ignore the situation due to the intense attention and possible seriousness--even if he isn't charged with anything, he'd still likely have the lawsuit over his head.
 


Patriots Kraft ‘Involved’ In Decision Making?  Zolak Says That’s Not the Case
MORSE: Final First Round Patriots Mock Draft
Slow Starts: Stark Contrast as Patriots Ponder Which Top QB To Draft
Wednesday Patriots Notebook 4/24: News and Notes
Tuesday Patriots Notebook 4/23: News and Notes
MORSE: Final 7 Round Patriots Mock Draft, Matthew Slater News
Bruschi’s Proudest Moment: Former LB Speaks to MusketFire’s Marshall in Recent Interview
Monday Patriots Notebook 4/22: News and Notes
Patriots News 4-21, Kraft-Belichick, A.J. Brown Trade?
MORSE: Patriots Draft Needs and Draft Related Info
Back
Top