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The Return of Burgess...

Discussion in 'PatsFans.com - Patriots Fan Forum' started by cloud34, Aug 13, 2010.

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  1. cloud34

    cloud34 Rookie

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    ...and how it affects a roster spot. TBC and Cunningham are locks. Burgess is now a lock, the only way he'd be in trouble IMO is if he reported in horrendous shape, but apparently, he already passed the conditionoing test. That leaves Ninkovich, Murrell and Woods. All 3 play ST's. I'm thinking the return of Burgess puts one of them in jeopardy. Who goes?
  2. mgteich

    mgteich PatsFans.com Veteran PatsFans.com Supporter

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    I think that we need to see what we have in Cunningham first before we decide.

    My gut tells me that Ninkovich is likely the one in trouble.

    Woods is reasonable against the run, and is the top special teamer of the bunch. I ahve often posted the I thin Woods is a good enough special teamer to make the squad just as a special teamer.

    Murrell looked pretty good yesterday playing with the 1's and is also a top special teamer.
  3. Marqui

    Marqui Rookie

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    Ninkovich is a JAG. Get rid of him.
  4. ahmed

    ahmed Rookie

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    I guess I am the only one who liked Ninkovich last year? To me, he looked better than Woods.
  5. Urgent

    Urgent Rookie

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    I am very pleased Burgess has returned.

    Hopefully this was a personal issue, not a lack of drive.

    Best option to supplement a thin LB corps after the losses of Thomas and Crable. Better than breaking in another 4-3 DE who would struggle to pick up the scheme -- assuming he still wants to play.

    If Cunningham or Murrell can develop into two-down edge-setters, Burgess can rotate in for passing downs. At the least, a lot more depth than yesterday.
  6. crowell33

    crowell33 Rookie

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    Agreed. 10char.
  7. mgteich

    mgteich PatsFans.com Veteran PatsFans.com Supporter

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    As some have said, he'd rather contemplate retirement than face Belichick's 2 a days.

    Well, it is the preseason now. Burgess has lost his reason for contemplating retirement.

    His could have more reps than any OLB other than Banta-Cain. He could be just an emergency backup. A lot depends on Cunningham. In any case, it is good to have the depth again.

  8. Urgent

    Urgent Rookie

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    On depth:

    Murrell started in preseason game one.
    Woods came in late. We've seen what he can do on defense.
    Murrell came up as a special teams LB.

    I'd put Woods at the low end of the roster.
    Murrell & Ninkovich can replace his ST capabilities.
    Both are better on the field.
  9. Reckedtrek

    Reckedtrek Rookie

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    That sums up my thoughts on this situation. If he's ready to get busy and play ball, I'm all for it. With the injuries the team has already had to deal with, there's no room for dead wood on the roster.
  10. ahmed

    ahmed Rookie

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    Maybe he did not want to go through the grind of training camp?
  11. eagle eye

    eagle eye Rookie

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    Or maybe he thinks that missing it gives him a better chance to stay healthy for the entire season.
    Last edited: Aug 13, 2010
  12. ahmed

    ahmed Rookie

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    Either way, it's not good for the team. Last thing we want is people skipping camp. I will forgive as long as he performs:D
    Last edited: Aug 13, 2010
  13. mgteich

    mgteich PatsFans.com Veteran PatsFans.com Supporter

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    I don't see how the team would be better off with Burgess having gone though practices twice a day for the last couple of weeks. The kids needed the reps. He didn't. Why would it have been better for him to risk injury? I guess it would have been "fairer". The bottom line is that Burgess is fresh, healthy and in shape.

  14. JSn

    JSn Rookie

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    I'd be surprised outta me socks if Belichick didn't see this coming a mile away.
  15. makoute

    makoute Rookie

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    I liked him too, and I agree with you about him looking better than woods.
  16. Deus Irae

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    Because he needed all the reps he could get in order to improve his ability to do things besides run forward?
  17. BradyFTW!

    BradyFTW! PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #12 Jersey

    Not sure how Burgess missing camp is a good thing, but I just know that he's better than whoever else would have had his rotation spot, so camp or not, I'm glad he's here.
  18. QB12

    QB12 Rookie

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    Didn't like Ninkovich's body language at all yesterday. He wasn't playing with any confidence, surprising for someone who was all but handed the opportunity to earn a starting job. I agree he's in trouble.
  19. AndyJohnson

    AndyJohnson PatsFans.com Veteran PatsFans.com Supporter

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    You've decided Murrell is better than _____________ because he got one sack?
    I think we need to see more of him to make that call.
  20. AndyJohnson

    AndyJohnson PatsFans.com Veteran PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Agreed, if players dont need camp, why is there camp?
    Although at his age how mcuh will he improve. You know old dog new tricks.
    The best thing that can happen is that he is reduced to a rotation guy in sub packages playing about half as frequently as last year, which means the other guys are taking playing time away from him, hopefully Cunningham. If Derrick Brugess plays as much this year as last, something went wrong.
  21. AndyJohnson

    AndyJohnson PatsFans.com Veteran PatsFans.com Supporter

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    You are kidding right? You are judging the player by how you perceive his body language????????????????
  22. mgteich

    mgteich PatsFans.com Veteran PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Yes, we all need to see more.

    What is YOUR current assessment. Who is most likely to be cut: Murrell, Ninkovich or Woods? I think that the answer AS OF NOW is Ninkovich.

    Who do YOU think are the better special teamers among the three. I think Woods and Murrell are more valuable on special teams that Ninkovich. What do YOU think?


  23. SanAngeloState

    SanAngeloState Banned

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    I think they get rid of...Burgess. He's a year older and wasn't that good to begin with. They also don't like to reward people who blow off camp.

    Also if he's "contemplating retirement", he's probably already gone mentally.
  24. Feep50

    Feep50 Rookie

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    We don't know why he missed training camp. For all you or me know it was because he a family member with a serious illness. Best to reserve judgement when you don't know all relevant facts concerning an issue.
  25. TheComeback

    TheComeback Rookie

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    He's definitely better than Woods.
  26. TheComeback

    TheComeback Rookie

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    I think Woods' production on special teams can easily be replaced, and Ninkovich is superior enough as a defensive player to warrant keeping him over PW. He looked better last year than Woods ever has, and I like Woods.
  27. Deus Irae

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    Woods is better against the run, and he's a quality special teams player. Ninkovich had 1 sack last year.

    How does that make Ninkovich superior?
  28. WhiZa

    WhiZa Rookie

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    With Warren out for the year and the fact we are playing in a 3-4 this year I think Bugress will be considered a DE. The other OLBs are safe.
  29. Joker

    Joker PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    I can hear it now...Manning buggered by Bugress! Patriots ball!
  30. DocE

    DocE Rookie

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    The OLB spots are really tough for me to judge right now. I don't think there is a lock for the 53 man roster outside of Banta Cain.

    Cunningham- He's a lock to not get cut, but is he a lock to make the 53? With his current injury, the Patriots could put him on IR. The Pats have put young guys on IR with relatively minor injuries in the past. If the Pats don't view Cunningham as ready to contribute as a rooke, they could go that route again. That's really just wild speculation on my part though, as I think Cunningham is the 2nd most likely guy to be on the roster at OLB behind TBC. The big question is whether or not he's active on gamedays.

    Woods- Hasn't shown much as a base defender, but has the best size of any of our OLB candidates as well as the most experience in the defense. How much does that matter if he's not effective on the field? Where he has been effective is on special teams and with most/all of the Patriots veteran special teamers in a battle to make the roster, I have to believe the Pats will keep a minimum of one of their special teams leaders from past season. My own opinion is that Woods offers the best combination of base down talent and special teams ability out of the group that includes Woods, Aiken, Alexander, and Slater.

    Ninkovich- IMHO, he was better at OLB than Woods. That said, he doesn't appear to be the answer as a starter and is not an elite special teams player. His opportunity to make the team is to carve out a role on defense.

    Burgess- I am torn on whether I expect Burgess to make the team or not. The fact that the Patriots are even allowing him to come to camp and never closed the door on him during the past two weeks tells me they want him back. On the other hand, I wouldn't be surprised to see the Patriots cut him or for Burgess to decide after a week or two that he really doesn't want to play football any more. My expectations for Burgess have significantly diminished after he contemplated retirement. Once guys do that, they usually don't play at a high level again unless they are Favre.

    Murrell- No idea what to expect from him. The Jets didn't make a real push to keep him and I don't know enough about his special teams ability to say whether or not he's a standout in that area. Starting ahead of Ninkovich and Woods in the preseason has to mean something, but I am not sure what.

    I wouldn't be surprised to see the Pats keep only 4 OLB's and use Guyton or Spikes outside in certain packages.
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