Welcome to PatsFans.com

The problem isn't that liberals hate America

Discussion in 'Political Discussion' started by Wolfpack, Dec 1, 2009.

  1. Wolfpack

    Wolfpack Banned

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2009
    Messages:
    9,111
    Likes Received:
    0
    Ratings:
    +0 / 0 / -0

    It's like the old saying goes: I am not saying all liberals hate America and hate the military, but if you hate America and hate the militray then you're probably a liberal. IMHO it's not that liberals hate America which is the problem, it's that they just don't think America is anything special or anything which is that big of a deal.

    I love America and I believe in American Exceptionalism. We are the greatest country that has ever existed in the history of mankind. The Good Lord has blessd us with prosperity and a lifestyle better than anything previously experienced. People are literally breaking down walls to try and get in. But you will never see a liberal saying those same things.

    A Politico article highlights the exact problem we see from the left and from their messiah. I couldn't phrase it better myself. They really do see America as just another country, no better (and in many ways much worse) than the others.

    7 stories Barack Obama doesn't want told - John F. Harris - POLITICO.com

    (Obama) sees America as another pleasant country on the U.N. roll call, somewhere between Albania and Zimbabwe

    That line belonged to George H.W. Bush, excoriating Democrat Michael Dukakis in 1988. But it highlights a continuing reality: In presidential politics the safe ground has always been to be an American exceptionalist.
    Last edited: Dec 1, 2009
  2. Patters

    Patters Moderator Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2004
    Messages:
    18,060
    Likes Received:
    188
    Ratings:
    +263 / 10 / -11

    Wolfpack, I think you're applying a conservative standard to judge liberals. From a liberal perspective, conservatives are too willing to put our troops in harms way and they hate the America that is multicultural and diverse. Conservatives love an America that never really existed; while liberals love the America that is.

    I don't like the phrase "American exceptionalism," which I believe Obama has embraced, because it comes too close to nationalism. I am accustomed to this country so for me it is the greatest country in the world -- I love it's diversity, dynamism, creativity, and inventiveness. I am proud at the way we have led the world in terms of immigration, multiculturalism, and human rights. I love the nature of our freedom and the economic opportunity. That said, just like you, there are many things about this country that I would like to see changed, and there are many things in other countries that we can learn from.
    Last edited: Dec 1, 2009
  3. patsfan13

    patsfan13 Hall of Fame Poster PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Jan 4, 2005
    Messages:
    24,845
    Likes Received:
    107
    Ratings:
    +233 / 8 / -13

    From my experience as a vet you are correct. My frineds with children currently in the military feel the same way.
  4. JackBauer

    JackBauer On the Roster

    Joined:
    Mar 3, 2005
    Messages:
    16,092
    Likes Received:
    278
    Ratings:
    +640 / 6 / -18

    Always refreshing to be told by a conservative what we liberals think.

    For what it's worth, I believe Obama also subscribes to American exceptionalism. He's just confident and self-aware enough to show it without being a massive tool, which is difficult for some to grasp, I know. After all, if you get offended if he bows as a matter of custom just as previous presidents have, you probably have much, much larger problems to deal with and in all honesty, should probably seek professional help.
    Last edited: Dec 1, 2009
  5. Harry Boy

    Harry Boy Look Up, It's Amazing PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2005
    Messages:
    40,167
    Likes Received:
    194
    Ratings:
    +662 / 2 / -9

    I Harry Boy from the Rock Bound Coast Of Maine find most Liberals to very Nervous, Unbelieving, Shocked, Bewildered, and many times very Nasty (PC) if you don't agree with them.
    God Bless Their Little Hearts
  6. Mrs.PatsFanInVa

    Mrs.PatsFanInVa PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Sep 7, 2009
    Messages:
    15,888
    Likes Received:
    328
    Ratings:
    +561 / 9 / -5

    #24 Jersey

    The problem with conservatives is that they speak in sweeping generalities and feel smug and self-satisfied when they do so - as if they've identified the problems of the world in one or two faulty and unrealistic sentences.

    The fact is, there are millions of people in the world, some of them are liberal and some of them are conservative and each of them has a particular reason for being so in each particular situation and regarding each particular occurance. Very few of them have the same reason or the same mind-set.

    One of the problems seems to be that the conservatives making the sweeping generalities seem to feel that only their experiences and their thoughts are valid.

    They also tend to leave off the end of certain sentences - such as -

    I love America and I believe in American Exceptionalism. We are the greatest country that has ever existed in the history of mankind. The Good Lord has blessd us with prosperity and a lifestyle better than anything previously experienced. People are literally breaking down walls to try and get in. And goddamn it, we will do our best to assure that 1) they never get in because they don't speak the language and they certainly don't belong here and 2) if they DO get in we will make their life a living hell and deny them the very basics of survival to the best of our ability. And while we're at it, we'll deny our own poor affordable health care, too, because goshdarnit, unless they're an exceptional American like I am, they don't deserve it.
  7. Harry Boy

    Harry Boy Look Up, It's Amazing PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2005
    Messages:
    40,167
    Likes Received:
    194
    Ratings:
    +662 / 2 / -9

    A Presidential Spiritual Advisor Once Said "God Damn America"
  8. JackBauer

    JackBauer On the Roster

    Joined:
    Mar 3, 2005
    Messages:
    16,092
    Likes Received:
    278
    Ratings:
    +640 / 6 / -18

    Here's Marc Ambinder's response to point 5, which was cited by Wolfpack in the OP:

    The POLITICO's Seven Deadly Sins Of Being Obama - The Atlantic Politics Channel
  9. Wolfpack

    Wolfpack Banned

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2009
    Messages:
    9,111
    Likes Received:
    0
    Ratings:
    +0 / 0 / -0

    I also honestly think you need professional help to combat your delusions. Please let me know if you want me to continue.
    I have asked this before and no one has ever answered it. When has any previous President done a full waisted, completely bent over bow (one of which included a bent knee) like Obama?
  10. Wolfpack

    Wolfpack Banned

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2009
    Messages:
    9,111
    Likes Received:
    0
    Ratings:
    +0 / 0 / -0

    Exactly. I am not saying Obama hates America, but he sure spent a lot of time with and he sure greatly admires a lot of others who do.
    Last edited: Dec 1, 2009
  11. reflexblue

    reflexblue PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Aug 11, 2006
    Messages:
    17,348
    Likes Received:
    47
    Ratings:
    +130 / 4 / -0

    #91 Jersey

    Wow that sounds just like moderator 13...:singing: :bricks::singing:
    Last edited: Dec 1, 2009
  12. Harry Boy

    Harry Boy Look Up, It's Amazing PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2005
    Messages:
    40,167
    Likes Received:
    194
    Ratings:
    +662 / 2 / -9

    Obama sat in that church for 20 years and listened to that Racist Bastard Rev Wright screaming his garbage and then claimed he never heard it and his groupies believe him. WRIGHT BAPTIZED THE OBAMA KIDS THEY ALL CALLED HIM UNCLE JEREMIAH .................:rolleyes::rolleyes:
  13. JackBauer

    JackBauer On the Roster

    Joined:
    Mar 3, 2005
    Messages:
    16,092
    Likes Received:
    278
    Ratings:
    +640 / 6 / -18

    I don't think I have anything to learn from someone such as yourself. Which, I suppose, endows me with a robust feeling of confidence and self-gratification.

    The knee! It's bent! The horror!

    Lawyers, Guns and Money: The Dwight D. Eisenhower Bowing Hour!

    Again, I suspect no one cares about this other than you and your knuckledragging ilk, who need to sustain themselves constantly with the latest outrage du jour.
  14. patsfan13

    patsfan13 Hall of Fame Poster PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Jan 4, 2005
    Messages:
    24,845
    Likes Received:
    107
    Ratings:
    +233 / 8 / -13




    You might want to check post 16 on the thread about limbaugh....just exchange words liberal and conservative.
  15. Wolfpack

    Wolfpack Banned

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2009
    Messages:
    9,111
    Likes Received:
    0
    Ratings:
    +0 / 0 / -0

    I don't see anything there that approached Obama's level of obsequiousness.

    Again, I suggest you seek professional help. You're just not perceiving reality as it actually exists. Your ability to delude yourself can potentially be a real problem. It's clear you have little more than the mind and emotional maturity of a child of roughly 8 years old.
  16. JackBauer

    JackBauer On the Roster

    Joined:
    Mar 3, 2005
    Messages:
    16,092
    Likes Received:
    278
    Ratings:
    +640 / 6 / -18

    You're moving the goalposts. First it's that US presidents don't bow to other heads of state. Now it's the entirely subjective concept of "obsequiousness" that we use to measure whether our presidents really love America to a sufficient degree. Because nothing says tough and manly like kissing another dude on the lips, right?

    And please, spare me the lame and cliched "insults." It'd be one thing if you could argue your way out of a paper bag, but you're a guy who feels so insecure that you need to judge customary greetings based on their "obsequiousness" as if anyone but you and your fellow haters gives a crap. You expect America to act like the guy at the gym who grunts loudly and slams weights just so everyone knows just how manly and impressive you are. We had eight years of that style of leadership from the past administration and what did we get? Hate and disdain from the rest of the world (but that's their problem, they just don't understand how great we are!).
  17. Real World

    Real World Moderator Staff Member

    Joined:
    Aug 15, 2006
    Messages:
    27,107
    Likes Received:
    218
    Ratings:
    +515 / 6 / -2

    I don't think Obama hates America. I do think he dislikes some things about it. Obama is an ideologue, and not a pragmatist as some claimed he'd be prior to his being elected. Obama wants to shape the US in his mold. His mold is not that of the mainstream American either. Obama sees the US through the same eyes as those in the UN. He wants us to be more of what they would prefer we are. It's part of the reason why independents are leaving him in droves.
  18. JackBauer

    JackBauer On the Roster

    Joined:
    Mar 3, 2005
    Messages:
    16,092
    Likes Received:
    278
    Ratings:
    +640 / 6 / -18

    LOL.

    All through the eyes of the beholder, I guess. Obama is hardly an ideologue, and I'd say he's been very pragmatic. Perhaps you can give examples of where you disagree. Also, perhaps you can be specific about when he purportedly dislikes? I suppose, using this logic, I can claim that Dick Cheney hates America.

    You say Obama wants to shape the US in "his" mold. What, exactly, do you mean by that? You do realize that your views are way "outside the mainstream," and the fact that Obama has different beliefs and values than you does not mean that his views are similarly radical.

    So you know how those in the UN view the US? How do you think they would prefer us to be?
    Last edited: Dec 1, 2009
  19. DarrylS

    DarrylS PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2004
    Messages:
    41,762
    Likes Received:
    178
    Ratings:
    +360 / 11 / -27

    You all might want to read Charles Johnson's view of why he left conservatism..

    http://littlegreenfootballs.com/article/35243_Why_I_Parted_Ways_With_The_Right

    Interestingly how this specific thread is framed with the first paragraph..

    This is a bunch of knee jerk crap, pure and simple... the right always seems to think in black or white, they forget their is a huge plain of middle ground in any issue... most liberals I know do not hate the military, they hate the military industrial complex and our need to continually be in a war ( if you cannot connect the dots here go back to kindygarten)....

    No liberal I know hates America, most liberals know recognize how every day their families are getting gang raped by big pharma, the banking industry, wall street, the food suppliers, the petro chemical people etc..

    A bastion of the right, Stormfront, is getting stronger, and they brag about increased membership daily...

    No liberal I know hates the constitution, if you read the threads here most from the right want to subvert it situationally.. instead of applying what has worked for the past 225+ years....

    I would suggest that conservatives whine more than liberals, and tend to make blank assinine statements that have no value except to inflame.. and in general lead half lives, sometimes in prolonged divorce proceedings and sometimes in mommy's basement...
    Last edited: Dec 1, 2009
  20. PatriotsReign

    PatriotsReign On the Roster

    Joined:
    Jan 15, 2007
    Messages:
    26,632
    Likes Received:
    142
    Ratings:
    +377 / 3 / -15


    That last question is irrelevant. What American...or even POTUS, would or should care about what other nations (or the UN) WANT us to be? Do you really believe that's important to anyone?

Share This Page

unset ($sidebar_block_show); ?>