The Plan at S/CB Harrison/Wilson

[Brownfan80]

I have been thinking this over since hearing that not only Rodney is back, but already in full pads without a red jersey.. This development makes the picture a little clearer as to why Wilson has been playing at CB so far.

I think that we may see a lineup of

Wilson (CB) - Sanders/Hawkins (FS) - Harrison (SS) - Hobbs/Samuel (CB)

It becomes apparent that the coaching staff has known for some time that Rodney was nearing full health, and obviously they gameplanned that way as far as the Cornerback/Safety positions go.

With Harrison on the way back, why not go ahead and get Wilson some time at CB and let Sanders and Hawkins get reps back in the deep area. At very least this helps get whichever players that end up backups game ready, and it has the potential to bolster both the CB and S positions for depth.

It will be very interesting to see exactly how the depth chart sorts out as Harrison gets worked back in. Not only to see who lines up next to him when he gets back into the starting spot, but also to see if Wilson is moved back to FS or left to bolster the CB position.

Either way, the secondary situation certainly has to look better than it did an hour ago, with Harrison and Gay both back into the mix.

 

[pats1]

I have been thinking this over since hearing that not only Rodney is back, but already in full pads without a red jersey.. This development makes the picture a little clearer as to why Wilson has been playing at CB so far.

I think that we may see a lineup of

Wilson (CB) - Sanders/Hawkins (FS) - Harrison (SS) - Hobbs/Samuel (CB)

It becomes apparent that the coaching staff has known for some time that Rodney was nearing full health, and obviously they gameplanned that way as far as the Cornerback/Safety positions go.

With Harrison on the way back, why not go ahead and get Wilson some time at CB and let Sanders and Hawkins get reps back in the deep area. At very least this helps get whichever players that end up backups game ready, and it has the potential to bolster both the CB and S positions for depth.

It will be very interesting to see exactly how the depth chart sorts out as Harrison gets worked back in. Not only to see who lines up next to him when he gets back into the starting spot, but also to see if Wilson is moved back to FS or left to bolster the CB position.

Either way, the secondary situation certainly has to look better than it did an hour ago, with Harrison and Gay both back into the mix.

Agreed.

And to think Gay, Tebucky, Warfield, Chad Scott, and Guss Scott aren't even listed on that chart of yours...

:drools:

 

[Brownfan80]

Agreed.

And to think Gay, Warfield, Chad Scott, and Guss Scott aren't even listed on that chart of yours...

:drools:

I am not sure which guys will even make the roster at this point. I've heard conflicting reports all training camp long about Chad Scott, Gus Scott and Warfield. Depending on who you listen to those guys are either headed for the door or headed for starting spots. It will be interesting to see how they all work in, and which guys don't make the grade. Gay coming back adds another body, but who knows what player we're getting there.. He was still in the developmental stage when he started missing time and really hasn't seen consistent playing time in a year and a half. Gay is a HUGE question mark.

 

[JackBauer]

I think it's unlikely that Wilson will start at CB or even play that much at the position. Like I said in the other thread, I think it's merely a contingency plan if there's a rash of injuries at CB.

 

[Brownfan80]

I think it's unlikely that Wilson will start at CB or even play that much at the position. Like I said in the other thread, I think it's merely a contingency plan if there's a rash of injuries at the position again.

I think that it remains to be seen what the real plan is, but he has spent more time there than Vrabel did at ILB during 'contingency drills'. Wilson, from what I understand, has spent at least half this camp at CB. That's a LOT of reps for a guy to spend at a contingency position. If it is the plan to put him back at FS, it'll be interesting to me to see how he does at EITHER CB or S, being that he didn't get a full camp so far at either position. If he moves back to S pronto, I guess that'll answer that question, but if he stays at CB for too much more of camp, then I find it doubtful that he'll be playing S this season barring injury.

As BB indicated, they've already installed much of their defense and now they're starting to get into gameplanning and such for each opponent. I doubt that Wilson would have gotten so little time at S during the installation if that was to be his home during the 2006 campaign. I just get this feeling that Wilson is a CB this season until somebody at S gets hurt.

I could be completely off, but the signs all point to it, from my view.

 

[JackBauer]

I think that it remains to be seen what the real plan is, but he has spent more time there than Vrabel did at ILB during 'contingency drills'. Wilson, from what I understand, has spent at least half this camp at CB. That's a LOT of reps for a guy to spend at a contingency position. If it is the plan to put him back at FS, it'll be interesting to me to see how he does at EITHER CB or S, being that he didn't get a full camp so far at either position. If he moves back to S pronto, I guess that'll answer that question, but if he stays at CB for too much more of camp, then I find it doubtful that he'll be playing S this season barring injury.

As BB indicated, they've already installed much of their defense and now they're starting to get into gameplanning and such for each opponent. I doubt that Wilson would have gotten so little time at S during the installation if that was to be his home during the 2006 campaign. I just get this feeling that Wilson is a CB this season until somebody at S gets hurt.

I could be completely off, but the signs all point to it, from my view.

Wilson was moved back to S about a week ago, IIRC.

I think the Starks experience last year is probably ingrained in BB's memory. I wouldn't be surprised to see Wilson at CB in SOME formations, but, like I said, I doubt he starts or even plays a majority of the time at the position. Who is going to play FS if not Wilson? Aren't Sanders and Hawkins natural SS's (probably Sanders moreso than Hawkins)?

 

[Brownfan80]

Wilson was moved back to S about a week ago, IIRC.

I think the Starks experience last year is probably ingrained in BB's memory. I wouldn't be surprised to see Wilson at CB in SOME formations, but, like I said, I doubt he starts or even plays a majority of the time at the position. Who is going to play FS if not Wilson? Aren't Sanders and Hawkins natural SS's (probably Sanders moreso than Hawkins)?

I hadn't heard that he'd been moved back at all. My apologies if that's the case.

Hawkins is a natural CB, so FS would probably work for him just fine. Sanders is indeed a natural SS.

 

[patsfan13]

The coaching staff seems to be trying to develop the type of flexibility and different looks in the secondary that we have seen in the front 7 over the years. Just another way to try to confuse the O and make the QB reads harder. Look at the # of guys we have who can play either CB or S.

What a nightmare for opposing O coodinators.

 

[Brownfan80]

The coaching staff seems to be trying to develop the type of flexibility and different looks in the secondary that we have seen in the front 7 over the years. Just another way to try to confuse the O and make the QB reads harder. Look at the # of guys we have who can play either CB or S.

What a nightmare for opposing O coodinators.

We'll see if it becomes a nightmare for OCs.. Thus far in this new secondary's lifespan it's only been a nightmare for me! (for most of last season, that is, lol).

I still think our size is a concern. OCs will target our short little midgets right away when they have a Big WR or Big TE. If there's a Big WR/Big TE combo I'll have the shakes!

 

[AzPatsFan]

I still think our size is a concern. OCs will target our short little midgets right away when they have a Big WR or Big TE. If there's a Big WR/Big TE combo I'll have the shakes!

What short midgets? Or are you talking about the "SB contender" Clots?

Jason David 5'8'' 172# a starter (more like 5'7")
Tim Jennings 5'8" 185# a high draft pick rookie - projected starter
Bob Sanders 5'8" 202# Scouting reports actually had him at under 5'6" A midget SS! Starter
Mike Doss 5'10" 207# starting FS. Only guy near avg size, but still smallish...

In fairness they also have a Marlin Jackson at 6'0" 196#
and
Von Hutchins 5'9" 181# high use reserve.

Compared this "crew" the Patriots secondary are GIGANTIC! Three safeties at 220#, and only one serious CB "midget" @ 5'9" 190#.



I complained that I had no shoes, Until I met a man who had no feet!

 

[Brownfan80]

What short midgets? Or are you talking about the "SB contender" Clots?

Jason David 5'8'' 172# a starter (more like 5'7")
Tim Jennings 5'8" 185# a high draft pick rookie - projected starter
Bob Sanders 5'8" 202# Scouting reports actually had him at under 5'6" A midget SS! Starter
Mike Doss 5'10" 207# starting FS. Only guy near avg size, but still smallish...

In fairness they also have a Marlin Jackson at 6'0" 196#
and
Von Hutchins 5'9" 181# high use reserve.

Compared this "crew" the Patriots secondary are GIGANTIC! Three safeties at 220#, and only one serious CB "midget" @ 5'9" 190#.



I complained that I had no shoes, Until I met a man who had no feet!

I guess you're right about their size when comparing them with other teams, but after watching this group get out jumped and run over for most of last season, I just know we're one Harrison injury away from depending on Tebucky vs the upper echelon TEs of the league. I'm just going off of how they played last season, not strictly their size. Bob Sanders plays bigger than anyone in our secondary did last season, even if he's an inch shorter.

 

[Welker83]

Perhaps with the new influx of Safety/CB's players BB is trying to bridge the gap by turning Wilson into one. Should be easy as he played CB in college...

"keeping up w/ the Jones's"?

Buffalo- Whitner
Miami- Jason allen
NE- Eugene wilson

possible...

 

[CrazyDave]

Mmmm... Kool Aid!

 

[pats1]

Breer, in his practice notes today, said Wilson worked at safety some for the first time in camp, but also worked at CB with the 1st team secondary when Rodney was out there (Wilson/Hobbs/Sanders/Harrison).

 

[Brownfan80]

Breer, in his practice notes today, said Wilson worked at safety some for the first time in camp, but also worked at CB with the 1st team secondary when Rodney was out there (Wilson/Hobbs/Sanders/Harrison).

Interesting. I guess time will tell, but at very least it's clear that Wilson at CB is not just a fleeting precaution by the coachingstaff..

 

[WV-Colt]

What short midgets? Or are you talking about the "SB contender" Clots?

Jason David 5'8'' 172# a starter (more like 5'7")
Tim Jennings 5'8" 185# a high draft pick rookie - projected starter
Bob Sanders 5'8" 202# Scouting reports actually had him at under 5'6" A midget SS! Starter
Mike Doss 5'10" 207# starting FS. Only guy near avg size, but still smallish...

In fairness they also have a Marlin Jackson at 6'0" 196#
and
Von Hutchins 5'9" 181# high use reserve.

Compared this "crew" the Patriots secondary are GIGANTIC! Three safeties at 220#, and only one serious CB "midget" @ 5'9" 190#.



I complained that I had no shoes, Until I met a man who had no feet!

there extremely small, no doubt. but you're incorrect on some of this. jennings will not be a starter. sanders is not even close to 5'6." he IS 5'8" tho.

granted the db's aren't exactly big, but harper will be one of the top 3 (probably start) and he's 5-10. jackson will have the other starters spot by mid-season at the latest (6'0").

 

[patsfan55]

one thing nobodys mentioned is what does this mean about assante samuel

maybe all this means that they dont feel comfortable with assante as a starter, i personally have always felt like hed be a better nickleback than anything

lets also not forget that assante is a fa after the year

 

[Box_O_Rocks]

Grrr, there must have been a software upgrade snuck in, going advanced from quick reply just lost me all my notes!

Wilson took S reps in the spring when the system is taught and is taking CB reps in TC when skill sets are developed.

In September, BB will be able to put his four (five & six) best DBs on the field for the given situation.
- 1st & 10 on the offense's 20: 3 CB/1 SS look with Geno at FS.
- 2nd & 8 from the 22: 4 CB look with Hawkins at SS.
- 3rd and 1 from the 29: Heavy look with Sanders and Harrison at S/Geno at CB.
Situational football, the Belichick mantra. You have to wonder if we might have seen more of this the past two years without the injuries...

Another factor to consider: Defensive Coordinator. We now have an old defensive fox raised in the BB defensive family. This is an "experienced" second generation BB working for the real deal, unlike last year with the rookie DC. Ochmed reported his observation that the defense has been very aggressive in camp, setting the tone for the season we hope. That's confidence in themselves and what they're learning to do, and a chunk of that is coming from the teacher.

The only caution flag I have to wave is the communications between the DBs and their ability to get inside each other's skull. Still, it seems there has been a lot of mix and match in camp thus far, and I believe Isaac reported on their on-field chatter - in Pees we trust.

 

[AzPatsFan]

Everyone is knocking EM for being vanilla but how many DBs were newcomers to the Patriots. Scott, Starks, Hobbs, Sanders, Freeman, Hawkins, Ventrone & Stone. That 8/10ths of the players. And if you add Guss Scott who has only a handful of plays between season ending injuries its 9 of 10.

You can't be much more than pure Vanilla.

Compare that to this season.

Newcomers, realistically,are Eric Warfield and Willie Andrews. And Andrews is a RS not really a DB. Hasn't Warfield, an 8 year veteran starter, complained about picking up the complicated Patriot's system as well? So 9 of the 10 are seeing the system for a year or more. They know the Coaches and what the Coaches want. They should be comprehending the system by now.

Its a different world entirely. (that's another reason why I'm taking a case of Guiness from baby Stratagor... burp!)

 

[captain stone]

If...IF there are no more injuries/setbacks, this is one scenario I would like to see attempted:

Safeties SS FS
Rodney Chad Scott
Sanders Warfield
Tebucky Guss Scott

Corners
Wilson Samuel
Hawkins Hobbs
Gay Andrews
Poteat

Given their age and size, I feel that FS, not CB, bests suits CScott and Warfield. Let the "competition" for starting FS begin.
If those 2 can make the transition to safety, then I would transition Wilson and Hawkins to CB. This should take better advantage of their youth and speed.
Now if CScott and/or Warfield prove that they/he can still cut the mustard at CB, then we have a very nice "problem".

No more injuries...ommm...ommm...