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The Patriots Might Be Better Off Without Wes Welker

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  1. PatsFans.com Article

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    The Patriots Might Be Better Off Without Wes Welker
    By: Russ Goldman

    Check out my thoughts on Wes Welker and the New England Patriots. ...

  2. Jimke

    Jimke Rookie

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    Welker's value to this team is that he can get separation to catch a pass.
    Until other wide receivers can prove they can do this, the Patriots better
    hold on to Welker.
  3. kennyb

    kennyb Rookie

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    blasphemy, but I concur. They need variety in the offense instead of just the 5 yard dump off to welker or those 10 WR screens a game.
  4. PATS68

    PATS68 Rookie

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    Welker puts up great regular season numbers which are great, but 8 yard out cuts are not going to get the job done in the playoffs. What I saw out of others teams this year in the playoffs was explosion plays or chunk plays.

    Falcons, 49ers, and Ravens all have big fast wr's and the ball was pushed down the field with 20+ gains. Pats have no one besides Gronk who can get down field and present a big target.
  5. tonyto3690

    tonyto3690 Banned

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    The way the title is wrong, but I can't disagree with what the article actually says.


    -Third highest scoring offense of all time
    -GOAT QB who can make Reche Caldwell look okay and Gaffney look great
    -Defense that got beat up by the big play all year
    -Defense that continued to not able to get a stop when really needed (Niners, Ravens, Ravens, Seahawks)
    -Defense that lacked any consistent pass rush without Chandler at 100%


    We are a better team with Welker.
    But I'd argue that we can be even better than that with getting a middle tier outside WR who is a lesser receiver than Welker and spending the rest of that money on a corner.

    I mean it's really not even a decision. It's either sign Welker or go into the season with Kyle Arrington as our #1 corner.
  6. ctpatsfan77

    ctpatsfan77 PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    There's this thing called a draft. . . .
  7. AndyJohnson

    AndyJohnson PatsFans.com Veteran PatsFans.com Supporter

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    We are not even close to that limited. And Arrington isn't under contract either.
  8. Ivan

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    Patsfans.com would be better without that "article." I am still waiting for it to demonstrate how losing a guy who is on a HOF track makes them better. Hopefully the follow up, PATS DEFENSE BETTER WITHOUT WILFORK, will be better.
  9. supafly

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    Calm down, Ivan. It's just an article looking at the possibilities of using the resources that would normally be allocated to Welker on improving other parts of the team.

    As much as I agree with you, we'd better start preparing ourselves for the distinct possibility that Belichick feels differently, because that's the way this story is currently playing out.
  10. naF staP

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    "The Patriots Might Be Better Off Without Wes Welker"

    [​IMG]
  11. Brady_to_Moss

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    in no way shape or form are the pats better without welker unless they get someone like a harvin or another big time WR...he walks and the pats offensive production will drop and with the major questions in the secondary and tough schedule next year...it may not be pretty
  12. Snake Eyes

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    ...which fell apart in the playoffs:rolleyes:
  13. JarOfMayo51

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    The offense wouldn't be better off, but the team as a whole could be if they were able to then focus the cap room they would save on Welker into the defensive side of the ball.

    The Patriots have been a top offense for the last decade, so its not going to change because of 1 player. Production would go down from Welker's position, but the offense as a whole could still perform at a high level if they found a replacement for him and made up for his production with a few receivers, like Edelman and Hernandez.

    I wouldn't pay him more than $8 million a year, even though he deserves more than that. Paying Calvin Johnson money on a WR better get you a Calvin Johnson and that isn't what Welker is. Hes the best slot receiver in the game and fits well into this offense, but if you plugged someone else in there, they could get 80-90 receptions in his place. Yes, that is a dropoff in production, but the drop off doesn't go from 110+ catches to 0 catches...

    The defense needs a "shut down" corner badly. When Talib went out with that injury, Boldin had a field day against the D, making plays all over the field and outjumping and outfighting DBs for the ball. Guys like Talib can reduce the number of times that happens and really free up the defense from a scheme perspective.


    It kills me to say it and it will kill me to see it happen, but because of what Welker will demand in FA makes him a player that they can no longer afford to keep on the roster. Just remember what happened to the Colts with Marvin Harrison, he was around Welker's age when he wanted his final big payday, and he ended up costing them big time on their salary cap as he aged to 34 or 35 years old and retired... They were hurting bad from that contract, because his production fell off as he aged and didn't match what he was making per year.
  14. Brady_to_Moss

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    Fell apart in 1 game of the playoffs...you make it sound like they were demolished the first game. Defense sure didn't help in the ravens game
  15. Snake Eyes

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    It's happened quite a bit in recent years. A Welker-centric offense = playoff fail:mad:
  16. Brady_to_Moss

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    Right...all because of welker they have failed in the playoffs..no one else :rolleyes::bricks:
  17. supafly

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    You may be correct. I don't necessarily agree with that thought, but there's enough of a possibility that it could be considered depending upon your point of view.

    I much rather would have seen the team build off of what we already had though, than start over and rearrange the nametags in hope of somehow being better that way.

    Let's say that you are right about the Welker-centric offensive failures vs better playoff competition. Wouldn't it be better to add the faster or more physical threat to the WR corps so that you could have both?

    I don't think it has anything to do with Belichick wanting more of a downfield threat, or he'd simply go out and keep trying to get one via cheaper methods. I think it just comes down to Bill Belichick's personal assessment of what he feels Welker's worth is moving forward, and he doesn't agree with giving him what he's looking for.
  18. Snake Eyes

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    I never said that, but when your regular season record setting offense puts up numbers in the teens then you have a problem.
  19. Snake Eyes

    Snake Eyes Rookie

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    It would be better to have both but it comes at a cost, Welker wants to be paid and we dont exactly have a ton of cap space, so would those resources be most effective if spent on Welker or applied somewhere else?
  20. Deus Irae

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    This argument has been dealt with in what seems like about a million threads now. This offense, the "Welker-centric" offense, as you put it, has lost only one game when the the key players were healthy. All the other losses happened when Brady/Welker/Gronk were out or injured. It's gotten to within about 3 minutes of winning two Super Bowls, despite the injuries, and it's done so with very little help from the defense.

    To say that the "Welker-centric" offense has failed in the playoffs is misleading at best.
  21. Kevin

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    Thread over.
  22. AndyJohnson

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    Your 3 sentence post is more insightful and informative than that entire article.
  23. MoLewisrocks

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    They are if he catches them or if Gronk is active and healthy or Ahern doesn't have the dropsies not to mention brain farts. The Falcon's and 49'ers lost too. Even with those big fast WR's and the ball being pushed down the field. Maybe THEY need a quick and shifty midget slot receiver... And if you believe that a big, fast WR is what we need, the player that player should replace is probably Lloyd. Trouble is at least we know he knows the system.
  24. MoLewisrocks

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    Marvin Harrison's situation has no comparative value. He was 32 when he signed the deal. Wes is 31 until this May. Harrison was several months older. The first three season he was a pro bowler/all pro. It was a typical Polian smoke and mirrors 7 year extension that allowed him to pay what at the time was top of the market to Harrison by using roster bonuses that could be converted to keep his cap hits down in the first 4 years while pushing dead money onto the backend caps.. At 35 he fell off the cliff, missing all but 5 games. The following season he had the worst season in his career. the following spring they cut him. Wouldn't have been an issue except Polian set his and Mannings deals up with a series of roster bonuses to be restructured. Otherwise his dead cap would have been $2M... As it was by then his salary was due to be $9M and his cap hit was $13.4M - the highest for any WR in the league in 2009.

    Had they signed Welker to a 5 year $40M deal back in 2011 after he proved to them he could come back from an ACL just like his QB did, they'd be half way through that deal by now. As it is if they sign him for 3 more years he may fall off the cliff at 35 but it won't matter because he'll be off the roster at 34. And Harrison was an a first team all pro in 2006 at 34. And Indy won the Superbowl after our offense and defense both choaked away the AFCC... Of course the offense had a legit excuse, Reche Caldwell as it's #1 WR.
  25. MoLewisrocks

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    Happened before he got here, too. And you could say the same about Gronknandez I guess...
  26. Deus Irae

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    If the Patriots cut Brady, they'd free up $8.2 million in cap space. Just think of the defensive players they could bring in with that! Brady hasn't won anything in almost a decade anyway.....
  27. Deus Irae

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    Re-signing those tight ends was a huge mistake. How many Super Bowls have they won?
  28. Nunchucks

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    I think it is hard to deny that the Patriots offense has failed big time when up against good defenses. Is that because of the reliance of Welker or is it because Gronk has been hurt? I do not know, but I do know that when teams make an effort, they can limit Welker, especially in the redzone and the Patriots do not have an answer.
  29. tonyto3690

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    Did you actually read the article? It's saying what I've been saying for months now. Our top 3 of all time offense that missed significant time from both Gronkowski and Hernandez does not need a big investment. Even without Welker it'll take a hit, but still be a top 5 offense. Brady has made far worse look passable in the past and we have Hernandez/Gronkowski locked in as our franchise players. It's time to act like they are.

    If Wilfork was asking for 30 million a season, yes, we would be better off without Wilfork. Player talent and building in a team isn't built in a vacuum/Madden. You have to take things in context.

    It was a minor exaggeration, but the point was that we simply do not have the resources to pay everyone.

    I'd be extremely surprised if a day one starter CB fell to us this year.
  30. tonyto3690

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    Expecting the Patriots offense to score 30 points a game in the playoffs to win a SB is a bad idea.

    In my opinion the issue is that we simply don't have the running game/defense that can carry the team when Brady can't.

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