The Official post-Colts game secondary/pass defense/Talib thread...

[kkpat]

The best Safety play: When McCourty covered all the distance when Talib got beaten and knocked the ball out of Receiver's hands.

One of the reasons why our CB sucked was because the Safety coverage was so erratic. The coaching staff, CBs could never trust them on Pass coverage. Last year was more brutal.

With McCourty and Wilson in the back, this secondary will trust the safeties to be in a position to help them if they screw up. That makes the coaching staff and CBs to be more aggressive.

Overall, this game will help our secondary get better by the time playoffs occur.

JETSies are dreaming how bad our D is and how Sanchez can beat us. Wait until they find out, our secondary can step up.

 

[wistahpatsfan]

99% of all interceptions are on bad throws. Even though it was clear that Wayne and Luck weren't on the same page for that throw, Dennard was clearly in a position to make a play. That means he was with the receiver and looking back for the ball.

I think the biggest difference in this game was the pressure. Once Jones when down they started bringing rushers from the middle and the corner. The results were obviously great. Now the question is if this is a regular part of their package or a one time strategy for a rookie quarterback.

Pressure on Luck was the key to the improved play of the secondary, and it seemed like it was really cranked-up on purpose by BB as he wanted to rattle the rookie and see what happened. Any secondary will benefit from a pass rush that causes the QB to throw sooner and less accurately. The routes get shortened and the balls get overthrown, right?

Put this game tape alongside the Buffalo game tape. The defensive style looks like two different teams. Fitzy had all day to throw. Luck was getting wrecked. Big difference at the end of the plays.

 

[jmt57]

Personally I'm tempted to ask this Colts fan if he is enjoyed those 8 first downs, and consider them to be a moral victory.

2012 NFL Week Eleven Preview: Indianapolis Colts At New England Patriots - Stampede Blue

The Colts definitely hold an advantage on Third/Fourth Down, as the Patriots are the 3rd worst Defense in the league. I can't wait to see some of the camera shots of frustrated Patriot fans when the Colts convert another third down. Should be great.​

For the record, the Colts were 8-14 on 3rd down; the Pats were 8-12.

 

[JackBauer]

Shockingly, McCourty will remain at S for the remainder of the season.

McCourty to stay at safety for rest of season - Extra Points - Boston.com

 

[BradyManny]

The best Safety play: When McCourty covered all the distance when Talib got beaten and knocked the ball out of Receiver's hands.

This.

What we need is a safety who has range - and we've needed it for a while. It was supposed to be Brandon Meriweather, but his head got in the way. It was supposed to be Chung, but injuries and lack of speed have gotten in the way.

McCourty has the range we need back there. He's been our best safety back there all year, I really have no doubt about that.

McCourty to stay at safety for rest of season - Extra Points - Boston.com

And apparently he's there to stay. Good. Between McCourty - Gregory - Chung - Wilson at safety and Talib - Dennard - Arrington - Cole at corner, our pass defense issues are not going to be because of the secondary. They'll be because of our lack of any interior pass rush and our linebackers being brutal in coverage.

But at least one problem is solved.

The other two, there is some hope (maybe using Chung in the middle of the field more; maybe by the grace of the football gods Myron Pyror comes out of nowhere to provide some interior rush).

 

[Deus Irae]

Shockingly, McCourty will remain at S for the remainder of the season.

McCourty to stay at safety for rest of season - Extra Points - Boston.com

I don't like his size for the position, and I'm afraid that he's got the Eugene Wilson "I'll be great until I get hurt a couple of times" psyche, but I think he has the skill set to be a quality deep safety in the Patriots system.

 

[Kontradiction]

Shockingly, McCourty will remain at S for the remainder of the season.

McCourty to stay at safety for rest of season - Extra Points - Boston.com

He's going to be a liability against the run as compared to Chung, so the front seven will have to be on their game. But, against the pass, he's already starting to look much better. His range is better and he's timing the passes at a much better rate than Chung has. But, then again, Chung blows. So I guess it's not hard to look better against the pass than he does.

 

[JMC00]

17 Blitzes (most all year)
11 Defended Passes (most all year)

First two defensive drives- 164 yards allowed
The six drives following-145 yards allowed

 

[Cassanova792]

17 Blitzes (most all year)
11 Defended Passes (most all year)

First two defensive drives- 164 yards allowed
The six drives following-145 yards allowed

I think Patricia finally found the "Blitz" section in his playbook. Playing an aggressive scheme obviously plays dividends! Keep the pressure coming boys!

 

[JackBauer]

I don't like his size for the position, and I'm afraid that he's got the Eugene Wilson "I'll be great until I get hurt a couple of times" psyche, but I think he has the skill set to be a quality deep safety in the Patriots system.

Yup, I agree. I wonder if they won't pair Chung or Wilson with him in the base to try and save him some punishment. McCourty/Gregory as a tandem are a bit diminutive for my taste.

 

[JackBauer]

He's going to be a liability against the run as compared to Chung, so the front seven will have to be on their game. But, against the pass, he's already starting to look much better. His range is better and he's timing the passes at a much better rate than Chung has. But, then again, Chung blows. So I guess it's not hard to look better against the pass than he does.

I don't know why Chung isn't auditioned as a "big nickel" type of player where he could be used as a bit of a LB/S hybrid, especially considering how unimpressive our backers have been in coverage. Seems like he's too slow to cover as a fulltime S and too small to play LB so to be of any use from here on out they'll have to find a niche role for him.

 

[Kontradiction]

I don't know why Chung isn't auditioned as a "big nickel" type of player where he could be used as a bit of a LB/S hybrid, especially considering how unimpressive our backers have been in coverage. Seems like he's too slow to cover as a fulltime S and too small to play LB so to be of any use from here on out they'll have to find a niche role for him.

I think that would be the ideal role for him as well.

 

[manxman2601]

Yup, I agree. I wonder if they won't pair Chung or Wilson with him in the base to try and save him some punishment. McCourty/Gregory as a tandem are a bit diminutive for my taste.

Or.......


DJ swearinger aka JungleBoi - YouTube

 

[mayoclinic]

Yup, I agree. I wonder if they won't pair Chung or Wilson with him in the base to try and save him some punishment. McCourty/Gregory as a tandem are a bit diminutive for my taste.

Or.......

DJ swearinger aka JungleBoi - YouTube

???

McCourty is 5'10" 195#. He can probably add 5# without difficulty. Gregory is 5'11" 195#. Wilson is 6' 210#.

For comparison:

Pittsburgh: Troy Polamalu 5'10" 207#, Ryan Clark 5'11" 205#
Baltimore: Ed Reed 5'11" 205#
Seattle: Earl Thomas: 5'10# 205#
San Francisco: Dashon Goldson 6'2" 200#, Donte Whitner 5'10# 208#

DJ Swearinger is listed as 5'11" 210#, smalelr than Tavon Wilson. I like Swearinger as a player, but I'm not convinced that Wilson won't mature into a starting safety opposite McCourty, with Gregory as a backup. McCourty may be a tad on the light side, but he's not tremendously undersized compared to a number of successful NFL safeties. Brandon Meriweather played FS for us at 5'11" 197#, and durability was never a major issue for him - discipline yes, but durability, no.

 

[JackBauer]

I'm not convinced that Wilson won't mature into a starting safety opposite McCourty

That would be tremendously helpful, as it would obviate S as a high-priority need in the draft and allow the team to focus on other areas of weakness (DT/DE, OG, coverage LB).

 

[manxman2601]

???

McCourty is 5'10" 195#. He can probably add 5# without difficulty. Gregory is 5'11" 195#. Wilson is 6' 210#.

For comparison:

Pittsburgh: Troy Polamalu 5'10" 207#, Ryan Clark 5'11" 205#
Baltimore: Ed Reed 5'11" 205#
Seattle: Earl Thomas: 5'10# 205#
San Francisco: Dashon Goldson 6'2" 200#, Donte Whitner 5'10# 208#

DJ Swearinger is listed as 5'11" 210#, smalelr than Tavon Wilson. I like Swearinger as a player, but I'm not convinced that Wilson won't mature into a starting safety opposite McCourty, with Gregory as a backup. McCourty may be a tad on the light side, but he's not tremendously undersized compared to a number of successful NFL safeties. Brandon Meriweather played FS for us at 5'11" 197#, and durability was never a major issue for him - discipline yes, but durability, no.

Just went for a hard hitting vid is all.

That would be tremendously helpful, as it would obviate S as a high-priority need in the draft and allow the team to focus on other areas of weakness (DT/DE, OG, coverage LB).

They drafted him in the 2nd round and are giving him extensive playing time. They won't be giving up on him going in to only his second year. If Talib re-signs this off-season, Dennard continues on his current trajectory and McCourty sticks at safety, it's unlikely they'll be drafting a safety high.

 

[mayoclinic]

That would be tremendously helpful, as it would obviate S as a high-priority need in the draft and allow the team to focus on other areas of weakness (DT/DE, OG, coverage LB).

Through 10 games Wilson has had 31 tackles, 6 PD and 4 INTs. He's had his problems as the deep coverage guy, but with McCourty playing FS and using Wilson more in a complementary role he should be better. He's showed a nice nose for the ball, is strong in run support and tackling, and is good covering TEs. Eugene Wilson at 61 tackles, 5 PD and 4 INTs in 16 games as a rookie, so Wilson hasn't had an entirely unproductive rookie campaign, and should get better.

 

[JackBauer]

Through 10 games Wilson has had 31 tackles, 6 PD and 4 INTs. He's had his problems as the deep coverage guy, but with McCourty playing FS and using Wilson more in a complementary role he should be better. He's showed a nice nose for the ball, is strong in run support and tackling, and is good covering TEs. Eugene Wilson at 61 tackles, 5 PD and 4 INTs in 16 games as a rookie, so Wilson hasn't had an entirely unproductive rookie campaign, and should get better.

I didn't mean to come off as not being bullish on Wilson, if that was the impression I gave.

And who knows, maybe even Ebner can come on next year some some seasoning in the offseason. They may need to find him some shoulder pads that fit, though.

 

[Deus Irae]

That would be tremendously helpful, as it would obviate S as a high-priority need in the draft and allow the team to focus on other areas of weakness (DT/DE, OG, coverage LB).

I think this team is looking to have 3 "starting" safeties. Unless they are very active with free agent/trade safeties, I expect them to take a safety high up in next year's draft.

Of course, BB and I have often gone wildly different ways on draft day.

 

[mgteich]

I would note that our corners signed for 2013 are Dennard and Dowling.

Some of us think that an off-season priority might include CB. Also, our signed WR's for 2013 are Lloyd and Salas. Some think that WR might be an offseason priority.

That would be tremendously helpful, as it would obviate S as a high-priority need in the draft and allow the team to focus on other areas of weakness (DT/DE, OG, coverage LB).