The Official post-Colts game secondary/pass defense/Talib thread...

Discussion in ' - Patriots Fan Forum' started by Ice_Ice_Brady, Nov 18, 2012.

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  1. Ice_Ice_Brady

    Ice_Ice_Brady In the Starting Line-Up

    Well, what did everyone think? By the eye test, I thought the secondary played its best game in a long, long time. Not perfect, but a definite improvement. Although we tend to remember the SB champ defenses as Tedy Bruschi ripping the ball from an opponent, let's remember that most of the turnovers they got were just from "bad decisions" or from "errant throws." In fact, fanbases used to rue the Patriots as lucky. Today's game reminded me of those years, as Luck clearly was throwing the ball a lot to his second and third options... it sure seemed like Belichick took away what Luck wanted to do (at least after the first two marches down the field), but unlike recent games, the Colts weren't able to take that back in the second half.

    Talib's interception did not exactly showcase his ball defense skills, but what a great way to start... whatever it takes to build confidence and defensive unity/rapport, I'll take it.

    I'm curious to hear everyone's thoughts. I am by no means an expert on the pass defense, but it sure looked better than usual.
  2. Nitro

    Nitro Third String But Playing on Special Teams

    #87 Jersey

    I'm used to arrington not even being shown on the tv screen as the WR he was covering gets a catch, so anything that get's arrington on the sideline more i'm thankful for. That said Talib will be fine in a few weeks, a month of no football and he walks on and performs 176% better then any other CB we have. Thank you TB, enjoy the 4th rd pick.
  3. Fixit

    Fixit Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract

    Talib officially became the best CB on the team at the kickoff. Even on the touchdown that he gave up, he had really tight coverage, and it took a perfect throw and catch combo to make it happen. The PI that he got called for looked to be a result of him getting tired, as I'm sure he's not completely in game shape yet. His pick six was a thing of beauty.

    I don't think it's a coincidence that the defense attacked as much as they did in Talib's first game.

    Oh, and the secondary was consistently in much better position than they've been in a long time.

    But I have no idea why Arrington's even on the team, let alone a starter. He can't cover for squat, and he seems to be hardwired for PI. The one he got called for today was atrocious.
    Last edited: Nov 18, 2012
  4. Boston Boxer

    Boston Boxer U.S. Air Force Retired Supporter

    #91 Jersey

    I like Talib and Dennard at CB...i think we have a major problem at safety. It is either the players or the scheme, but something is not right and we continue to get beat deep and there is no safety in sight.

    also, great adjustment at half time for the Pats. The defense is much better when they are agressive.
  5. Brady_to_Moss

    Brady_to_Moss Butler Island is here Supporter

    #95 Jersey

    talib sucked today besides that 1 play. But it was his first day so i will give him a pass
  6. Fixit

    Fixit Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract

    McCourty had a nice play after Talib was beaten and knocked the ball out. Would've been a big gain.
  7. Marqui

    Marqui In the Starting Line-Up

    He got beat a few times but he didn't "suck" overall.

    Arrington "sucked".
  8. mgteich

    mgteich Veteran Supporter

    We'll see the reps later tonight from Reiss, but I think that Belichick has a higher view of Arrington than we do. In any case, we are much, much better at corner with the additional of Talib. Now, we need to extend his contract (along with that of Cole).

    I have no problems at safety with McCourty, Gregory and Wilson (with Chung as a backup).
  9. hodgey

    hodgey Third String But Playing on Special Teams

    DMC has awesome closing speed which he showed on the breakup on the throw inside the 5 yard line. I think it was the 2nd quarter. If he acquires better play recognition he could be a stud at FS.
  10. Fixit

    Fixit Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract

    "Sucked" doesn't quite cover it.
  11. CheeseMonkeys

    CheeseMonkeys 2nd Team Getting Their First Start

    #11 Jersey

    Very fitting considering Arrington can't cover it either.
  12. PATSNUTme

    PATSNUTme Paranoid Homer Moderator Staff Member Supporter

    #75 Jersey

    I thought he defense played better today including the first half. some of those throws by Luck were right on the money and could not be stopped. he was very sharp in the 1st half.

    If they play like that against Sanchez, he will not make the throws that Luck did. And no, I'm not smoking crack or drinking the Kool Aid.
  13. jnug

    jnug On the Game Day Roster

    Luck made a perfect throw to get that ball in to begin with. What you need to consider is that a coverage like that is a partnership....the dance partners are the CB and the Safety. To often this season, the CB has undercut the play to soon and has not pushed the receiver into a position where the Safety even had an angle he could take to the receiver. The CB and Safety forced Luck to throw a perfect ball and the Safety was still in position to make a play on what was a perfect ball.

    I have not seen many plays by a Pats CB this season where the CB has been as good a partner to the Safety as Talib was today and that after only four days of practice and four weeks of inactivity. Talib did not come close to playing so badly that he could be described as having sucked. Had that been Arrington he probably would have held the guy half way downfield as he was going past him. Had it been McC at CB, he probably would have run over the receiver at some point for a PI call.

    Talib was the best CB on the field for the Pats the minute he stepped on the field even with only four days of practice and four weeks of rust. As was hoped even with all that going against him, he had enough of an impact to change the level of play in the secondary. I expect him to play better and I expect the entire secondary to look better as well.
  14. NewFeep

    NewFeep On the Game Day Roster

    Luck made a lot of awefully good passes and no defense can stop that. He also made several good throws while in the "grasp" of a defender. He's a strong kid and is gonna be really good for a long, long time.

    Talib looked pretty good to me after not playing for what? 5 weeks? The pick 6 was on a badly overthrown ball. But I've seen Talib do that many times with TB.

    I thought Dennard looked pretty good too. He's gonna be a good player for us.

    Arrington I will defer to prior comments........ Just looks befuddled out there!

    Anytime you hang more than 40 on a team your tough to beat so the defense just has to be OK, not lights out, but I still reallt WANT a lights out D!!!!
    Last edited: Nov 18, 2012
  15. Avenger

    Avenger Rotational Player and Threatening Starter's Job

    #11 Jersey

    Luck was forcing balls into tight coverage, when it works its a great throw, when it doesn't it's a pick. Luck was fortunate to walk out of there with only 3 interceptions, he easily could have had double that. I called it after the 1st INT, turned to my dad and said that if Luck kept it up he'd be punished for it again.
  16. skspikex2

    skspikex2 Third String But Playing on Special Teams

    #22 Jersey

    Dennard/ Talib combo seem to work with McCourty over top. Dennard improves from last week, and Talib will get better after shedding some rust from one month away.

    Great improvement from last week. Need to work on that first quarter fiasco though.
  17. mayoclinic

    mayoclinic Supporter Supporter

    The secondary is a work in progress and it still has a ways to go, but so far in this game it followed the general approach that I have felt has been needed:

    1. Move McCourty to FS and keep him there. There was noticeably better safety coverage at times, particularly on the 1st half drive that ended in a FG when he knocked away a deep sideline pass that would have set the Colts up for a likely touchdown. Chung seems to have been a healthy scratch, and the coaching staff appears to have given up on him playing a significant coverage role.

    2. Use Talib and Dennard outside and play more press-man, with less of the soft zone that we have all come to hate. The Pats started with Arrington outside, and he got shredded. Hopefully that will be the last we will see of that. Both Talib and Dennard had their bumps, but both produced, which is more than can be said for Arrington. The coverage was generally much tighter than we've seen in a while, and Luck and to force a bunch of throws into tight windows. That usually results in interceptions, and I wasn't surprised to see him throw 3 picks. It could have been more - Gregory dropped a freebie, Dennard almost got a tipped ball, and Wilfork tipped a ball that was just out of his reach. A few others could have been intercepted if Luck hadn't nailed throws into very tight windows. That's a dangerous game, and if our coverage forces QBs to play that game all season, I'll be pretty happy with our pass defense.

    3. Once the coverage tightens up, get more aggressive up front. There was much better pressure and aggressiveness on defense, including some attacking from the secondary. I recall both Dennard and Arrington being used on blitzes.

    There's a long way to go, but after the first 2 drives by Indy the Pats outscored the Colts 38-3 over the next 31:57 to take a 45-17 lead early in the 4th quarter. During that period the defense produced 3 turnovers including 2 pick six's and held them to 202 total yards on 7 drives. Overall, I'm pretty happy with the direction showed by the defense in this game.
  18. ausbacker

    ausbacker Brady > Manning. Supporter

    #87 Jersey

    Outside of the pick 6 I thought Talib was average.
    Last edited: Nov 18, 2012
  19. Deus Irae

    Deus Irae Retired Jersey Club Supporter

    Disable Jersey

    I think they are 3/4 of the way to filling out the starting secondary (Dennard, Talib, McCourty), but I think the S2 and CB3 positions are going to be weaknesses all year long.
  20. jnug

    jnug On the Game Day Roster

    Talib was "average"

    As in much better than the CB play we have grown to expect from the Pats secondary and that after only four days of practice and four weeks of inactivity.
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