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The NBA Draft is Rigged

Discussion in 'Boston Celtics Fan Forum' started by maverick4, May 22, 2007.

  1. maverick4

    maverick4 Banned

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    If there were any doubts, they have been erased now. Consider the top 6 picks, in order:

    1 Portland (didn't tank)
    2 Seattle (didn't tank)
    3 Atlanta (didn't tank)
    4 Memphis (tanked, got worst pick possible)
    5 Celtics (tanked, got worst pick possible)
    6 Bucks (tanked, got worst pick possible)

    This was Stern sending a message to all the teams that tanked. The 3 worst teams each got their worst pick possible (what are the odds?). Atlanta had to be in the top 3, or else had to trade their pick to Phoenix. The top two picks went to teams with the two lowest attendances and were about to move cities; the draft now saves these 2 franchises and revives a fanbase. Seriously look at the percentages, there is no way this all was possible without some fixing, it's ridiculous and disgusting at the same time.

    Do people know that the ping pong balls are not selected in public? It is done in secret.
    Can some stat guy come up with the odds of all this happening? Something like 1 in a million...
    Last edited: May 22, 2007
  2. BradyManny

    BradyManny Rookie

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    Interesting...I'm not sure if I believe it, but worth thinking about...it's just so hard to imagine the Grizzlies, C's and Bucks all happening to miss the top 3, I'd love to see the mathematical odds on that...

    Still, I don't know if I'm a conspiracy theorist, of course, there's always the '85 lottery....
    Last edited: May 22, 2007
  3. BelichickFan

    BelichickFan B.O. = Fugazi PatsFans.com Supporter

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    I don't buy your premise but if it's true I'm fine with it. The best picks are supposed to go to the worst teams not the ones that tank or have guys like Pierce out but returning the next season.
  4. DarrylS

    DarrylS PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    I do not like the idea that the balls are not chosen in public, could be a real whoop de do review.. Tommy Heinson could put in the correct # of balls and it might make interesting television.
  5. ctpatsfan77

    ctpatsfan77 PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Not too far off the ballpark--if you're talking about this exact result.

    Odds of Portland getting #1: 53/1000
    Odds of Seattle then getting #2: 88/947
    Odds of Atlanta then getting #3: 8/859
    Net result: 46 in a million

    If all you're talking about is the top three teams getting shut out, it's at least 6%. So--unlikely, yes. Fixed, probably not.

    Also, the way the ping pong balls are drawn, it's pretty darn hard to "game" the system (I won't get into the details here, but it's not nearly as simple as drawing a ping pong ball that says "Portland").
    Last edited: May 22, 2007
  6. MoLewisrocks

    MoLewisrocks PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    There is already a poor celtics thread on the main board - and I understand why, it is news albeit bad news for a Boston team. The lottery system is a joke, just like the league that employs it. But it ain't football - so could you crossover fans limit the handwringing to one thread on the football board?.
  7. BradyManny

    BradyManny Rookie

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    Pierce was legitimately injured, and in fact, played hurt when he did play.

    And trust me, the Celtics were no better than the second worst team in the league last season, they earned one of those top two picks. Long before they could even begin thinking about tanking they lost 18 straight games when Oden, Durant, and the draft were just a blip on the radar screen.
  8. patsfan55

    patsfan55 Rookie

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    i think mike gorman said one out of five thousand and somethin
  9. BelichickFan

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    That's fine, I'm just saying don't start whining about "the most deserving teams not getting the top picks" when we all know that with a healthy Pierce heading into next season the Celtics aren't close to the 2nd worst in the league.
  10. BelichickFan

    BelichickFan B.O. = Fugazi PatsFans.com Supporter

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    BTW, don't say the draft is rigged when the two premium guys end up in Oregon. It's not suicide for the league but it ain't good when most of the country will rarely see them play.
  11. maverick4

    maverick4 Banned

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    that reasoning about exposure doesn't make sense. portland and seattle both used to have big fan bases and were on tv a lot. tv shows teams that are good, period. san antonio, and sacramento before that, are/were on tv a lot now, because they are good. this draft helped the two lowest fan attendance franchises immensely.
  12. BelichickFan

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    It's still not good for the league - most of their games are at 10pm eastern. Rejuvinating a team like the Celtics would help the league a lot more.
  13. spacecrime

    spacecrime Rookie

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    The premise of this thread dsoesn't make sense, just a bunch of boo-hoo crybaby whining.

    We didn't win, it must be rigged or else we would win.

    Get over it.
  14. Patriot Missile

    Patriot Missile Rookie

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    One word sums it up. Dissapointing. It's always a toss up in these lousy lotteries. It's just not catching a break kind of sucks. We lost the Tim Duncan sweepstakes 10 years ago this week and now this. Anyway it's not all the lotteries fault,they've had some pretty bad management going on as well.
  15. The Gr8est

    The Gr8est Rookie

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    Tanking? Do you mean losing deliberately in order to gain another benefit?

    Do you think a team should be able to benefit from deliberately losing, like for example, if the Pats were to deliberatly lose to Miami in order to get a home game vs Jacksonville?

    Is that tanking or working within the system?

    I am not a huge fan of the NBA, but this latest lottery, with the secret drawings and rather unlikely result, makes me feel better about the chances of boxing being free of corruption when compared to the NBA.

    God help us if the NFL ever gets the idea that a lottery system would be a good idea.
  16. patsfan55

    patsfan55 Rookie

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    ainge today said hes never been a huge fan of the lottery system, and went on to say "but what else is there"

    ummm...how bout the format of all the other leagues
  17. primetime

    primetime Rookie

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    That's not true. The league's biggest market is LA, and they'll see these guys play plenty. Besides, tonight saved the Portland and the Seattle franchises; both teams were in danger of moving, but having a legitimate superstar will allow both to become potentially profitable (Cavaliers in aftermath of Lebron), and both teams have been successful both on the court and in the bank.

    The lottery system really bothers me. In the NFL, there's no lottery, but there's not enough games where tanking becomes an issue. In baseball, the draft is practically meaningless anyways (the Devil Rays have had the 1st pick since the founding of their franchise and yet are still horrendous). In the NHL, there's a lottery, but it only effects one team (the team that is drawn can move up to 1, but only if they were picking before 5... the 6th team, if chosen, would move up to 2, the 7th to 3, etc.)

    Stern was sending a message to the teams that tanked and trying to keep the Blazers and Sonics in their respective cities. The chance for Memphis and Boston to be outside of the top 3 was 0.18%... ridiculous odds.
    Last edited: May 23, 2007
  18. RPCity

    RPCity Rookie

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    This thread is filled with misinformation.

    First....a draft style like that of the NFL encourages tanking. Thats why the NBA encorporated the lottery system to begin with. Otherwise you have instances like the NFL saw in the year of Reggie Bush with teams trying to lose down to the wire to get that #1 overall. You don't think that would have been much more common this year if it were just by the numbers? You don't have a problem with it that's fine....but tell that to a Season Ticket Holder who paid a few grand to watch Paul Pierce and Michael Redd play, only to get stuck watching Gerald Green battle Mo Williams.

    Second.....stop saying Portland got the #1 to help keep them in the city. I don't know where you're getting that from, but that's the biggest piece of misinformation in this thread. Portland is not now and never was a major threat to leave. Seattle is a different story.
  19. dhamz

    dhamz Rookie

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    It is not done in secret. It is done off camera in front of representatives of all the lottery teams.

    It is not done on TV because they think it is more dramatic TV opening envelopes starting with the last pick moving up to the first pick rather than a 30 second ceremony where a couple ping pong balls come out.

    I'm amazed that nearly 20 years after the incompetent Dave Gavitt used the whole "league is out to get the Celtics" defense for his failure to do his job that Celtics fans still believe it is true.
  20. maverick4

    maverick4 Banned

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    So one fifth of 1%. That is not even counting the chance for Milwaukee to get its worst possible pick, and for Seattle/Portland to get the top two spots, plus the small chance that Atlanta would actually get to keep its draft pick by being in the top 3.

    Yes, I am bitter and disappointed, but I also think this draft was really convenient for the NBA (help out the lowest two fan attendances, and punish the 3 teams that supposedly tanked).
  21. QuiGon

    QuiGon Banned

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    Where's your source or your calculations for that statistic..? Because I gotta say I ran the ESPN lottery simulator a whole bunch of times and I would see both Boston and Memphis outside the top 3 about 1 in every 6 or 7 tries... certainly nowhere near 1 in every 555 tries...
  22. QuiGon

    QuiGon Banned

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    It is done with 2 media witnesses and a hired accounting firm to oversee the selection and the results.
    Like so much of what you say, you demonstrate you don't have the first clue WTF you are talking about.

    First of all, you obviously have no clue how the NBA draft lottery works.

    Second of all, what you say makes no sense. If the NBA was going to rig the lottery, the last thing they are going to do is banish 2 future superstars to Portland and Seattle way out in the obscure Pacific NW. I mean, at least the Patrick Ewing to NY conspiracy theorists make sense. If the NBA wanted to rig the lottery then at least one of the 2 future stars would have ended up in a big, east coast market (Philly, Boston, Atlanta, NY) and the other would have gone to Chicago or LA.
    Last edited: May 23, 2007
  23. QuiGon

    QuiGon Banned

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    Tanking is defined as deliberately losing a game to gain a future benefit. But resting starters and playing reserves is not necessarily tanking. There's a difference between those two concepts.
  24. sieglo

    sieglo Rookie

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    The NBA is screwed anyway. Too many teams.... Who cares any more.

    Can't wait to see what Fitzy has to say about this one.
  25. maverick4

    maverick4 Banned

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    That is way too simplistic reasoning. The NBA is facing a talent dilution problem, and a bigger concern than feeding big markets is to keep small markets alive. I would say the only way Portland and Seattle could have saved their franchises and not move was to get the two most exciting rookies.
  26. PatsMyBoyz!

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    LMAO Fitzy should put out a good one,no doubt about it.

    The NBA is dead to me as well,except as a NE fan it would be great to see the Celts get competitive again. Actually it would just be nice to see the Eastern Conference be competitive again.
  27. QuiGon

    QuiGon Banned

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    EDIT: Last time you accused me "simplistic reasoning" was when you said the US orchestrated the kidmapping of 14 British sailors by Iran. You used those exact same words, you were wrong then and you're wrong now.
    What makes you think the NBA wouldn't want one of those 2 teams moving..? The NBA wants a franchise in Las Vegas and Stern would be plenty happy to see one of those flagging franchises uprooting to sin City.

    What you say doesn't make sense at all. The last thing the NBA wanted was to banish both future stars to the obscure Pacific Northwest.

    Plus I've seen a lot of probability and calculations here that are simply wrong. No offense, but a lot of people here - yourself included - simply don't understand how the NBA conducts the draft lottery.
    Last edited: May 23, 2007
  28. BelichickFan

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  29. BelichickFan

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    Of course the NBA would have preferred them in Boston and Philly. Duh. As Steven A. Smith said last night "it's a disaster for the NBA".
  30. BelichickFan

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    And even if the Patriots' tanked, it's different to "tank" for the perceived benefit of a better matchup through a lower seed vs. the definite advantage of moving up in the draft or improving your odds.

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