The last second timeout before a FG try at the end of the game -For it or Against it?

[aluminum seats]

Re: The last second timeout before a FG try at the end of the game -For it or Against

I go with whatever makes for a more exciting game, and I honestly think that last second BS makes it less exciting--feels lame & gimmicky, like wrestling. Not sure how it could be changed, though--teams are allowed to use timeouts. What if a team realized it had too many men on the field or something at the last second? So it's tricky to change, but I do hate the rule.

 

[Pat the Pats Fan]

Re: The last second timeout before a FG try at the end of the game -For it or Against

it will be interesting to see which kicker gets TO'ed and misses, only to get a second chance and make it for the win.

 

[Grizzafted]

Re: The last second timeout before a FG try at the end of the game -For it or Against

It's weak. Sucks. Takes the fun out of a last minute field goal.

 

[PatsFaninAZ]

Re: The last second timeout before a FG try at the end of the game -For it or Against

I don't care for it.

I just don't see how you can change the rule. Le'ts go with the proposal -- no time out with 15 seconds left on play clock. Imagine this -- team is losing by 3 with 10 seconds left. Ball on 8 yard line -- 4th and 4. They go for the tie instead of the win. They line up to kick the field goal, and defense realizes it has 12 men on the field and goes to call time out. Not granted. Now it's first and goal. Or, defense figures out a fake may be on, and tries to call a time out to get someone to cover the sidelines. Not granted. Fake. Touchdown.

Bottom line is that there are totally legitimate reasons to call time outs on defense in the end of a game, even where your opponent lines up for a FG and you think they are going to kick it. They are the reasons we have time outs, and coaches who get to that point in the game deserve to use them to avoid situations like the 12 men penalty described above, or any other variations you think of.

So while I disagree with the gamesmanship time out to make the kicker kick twice, I just don't know how you make up a rule that stops this and only this without also stopping something that's a completely legit use of a time out.

 

[solman]

Re: The last second timeout before a FG try at the end of the game -For it or Against

Game deciding plays are occurring on national TV. The AFTER the play, viewers are informed that what they just saw didn't count because the play never happened.

Last minute time outs are fine, but the NFL can NOT allow them to result in these fake plays. They must take action and they know it.

 

[SVN]

Re: The last second timeout before a FG try at the end of the game -For it or Against

only shanahan or BB couldve thought of exposing the rule . i love that fact.

 

[QuiGon]

Re: The last second timeout before a FG try at the end of the game -For it or Against

Wade Phillips complained about this very thing to league offices about this today but I don't think there will ever be a change in calling timeouts at the last millisecond - Are you for it or against it?

There used to be a called timeout for icing the kicker prior to setting the ball down but after seeing the magnificent way Shanahan STOLE that game from Oakland in week 1,it appears all coaches are going to try it and take a chance that he makes it the first time and in the playoffs for a last second FG you can bet your home it will happen.

It did not work in the Dallas/Buffalo game but it will probably be effective more times than not.

It worked that first time when Denver used it against Oakland, but I have seen it 3 times since then (2 NFL, 1 NCAA) and it didn't work in any of those instances.

I can't wait until the first time someone does it and it backfires.

 

[QuiGon]

Re: The last second timeout before a FG try at the end of the game -For it or Against

it makes it gimmicky, if they have 3 timeouts at the end of the game, they could make him kick it 4 times... are you kidding me?

Well, after the first time out, a second/third time out would be a delay-of-game penalty. So while I guess under the current rules they could do that, it would cost 5/10 yards in penalties.

 

[QuiGon]

Re: The last second timeout before a FG try at the end of the game -For it or Against

just cause something is strategic doesn't make it good.. it would be strategic if you could have your players switch their numbers around during a game.. is it good for the game? (brady drops back.. he takes off.. oh wait.. thats not brady.. its randy moss with the number 12.. how did we not realise that.. TD)

No, that would not be strategic, that would be a rules violation. By definition, "stretegic" implies working within the framework of the rules.

Right now calling the timeout before FGs is strategic, but I think it hasn't shown to be an unfair advantage.

 

[QuiGon]

Re: The last second timeout before a FG try at the end of the game -For it or Against

Better yet, the rule could read "during special teams plays, timeouts by the defending team can not be called with under 15 seconds on the play clock".

That's a ridiculously heavy handed "solution" that opens up a truckload of other problems... what if a team brings out their FG unit (which is special team), let's the play clock run to under 15 seconds, then shifts into what could be a fake-FG...? What if there is honest mistake and the defensive captain notices 12 men on the field..?

 

[richpats]

Re: The last second timeout before a FG try at the end of the game -For it or Against

All this crap will end when a coach calls for a timeout while the kicker misses the first try, then comes back and knocks it through. The Pats were burned on this in Atlanta a couple years ago b/c the officials mistakenly treated Vrabel's classic "fake timeout" motion as if a real timeout was called.

The whole "strategy" for calling the TO is oddly dependent on the opposing kicker MAKING the kick, where making a 2nd kick would be less likely, given the odds.

On the other hand if a kicker misses one, he is more likely to make the next one (unless he is really, really bad or the kick is simply too far).

 

[gomezcat]

Re: The last second timeout before a FG try at the end of the game -For it or Against

Eventually a coach is going to get burnt on it when a kicker misses the timeout kick and then hits the second one, and then I think this "gamesmanship" will be done with.

Good point and not one I had thought of.

 

[QuiGon]

Re: The last second timeout before a FG try at the end of the game -For it or Against

the point is it will become a gimick, and every single end of game kick will have to be done twice.. how stupid is that?

Not as stupid as telling a team when they can and can't use their timeouts.

from the sound of things, it seems like they definatly will change it, they just need to work out how..

Oh yeah..? From the sound of what things..? The whining by the usual idiots on ESPN...? Because I haven't heard one single word from an actual league official (or owner) about whether or not the rule should be outlawed. And it's going to take 24 of 32 owners to change the rule.

 

[QuiGon]

Re: The last second timeout before a FG try at the end of the game -For it or Against

On the other hand if a kicker misses one, he is more likely to make the next one (unless he is really, really bad or the kick is simply too far).

Just think of how badly it backfired against Oakland in the Snow Bowl. Now they didn't do the last-second timeout maneuver, but they did call a timeout to try and "ice" Vinatieri. Of course, all that did was give the Pats more time to clear a space for the kick.

How'd that work out for them..?

 

[BradyManny]

Re: The last second timeout before a FG try at the end of the game -For it or Against

It is stupid. The rule should be a three to five second delay between the time the coach calls time out and the official blows the whistle, on a kicking attempt.

I agree. Imagine how PO'd we'd be if it happened to us and we missed the second attempt.

It cheapens it all a little. They play these games for an audience, they can't play in a vaccuum, so I think this is one instance where they have to acknowledge that and realize that the drama is cheapened by having two kicks. It's lame.

 

[Lampshade]

Re: The last second timeout before a FG try at the end of the game -For it or Against

It's daft. If a player does it then fine, but timeouts should be called on the field.

 

[godef]

Re: The last second timeout before a FG try at the end of the game -For it or Against

I hate it, but I'm not sure how to make a rule to prevent it without causing restrictions on calling timeouts at other points, like at the last second when you realize you don't have enough or too many players on the field, etc.

 

[richpats]

Re: The last second timeout before a FG try at the end of the game -For it or Against

Wade Phillips was pissed about it - boy I hope we don't have to attempt a game-winning FG this week.

 

[Oswlek]

Re: The last second timeout before a FG try at the end of the game -For it or Against

What I find interesting is that the comp committee is supposed to look into this in the offseason, but when NE was doing the "calling a TO after using one so it doesn't matter" they took it away after just two weeks.

Why is one so much worse than the other so they can wait all season to meet? Sorry to be a conspiracy theorist, but I would bet $100 on it that if NE was the team that benefited from this proceedure, it would already be outlawed.

 

[Denzera]

Re: The last second timeout before a FG try at the end of the game -For it or Against

I just don't see how you can change the rule. Le'ts go with the proposal -- no time out with 15 seconds left on play clock. Imagine this -- team is losing by 3 with 10 seconds left. Ball on 8 yard line -- 4th and 4. They go for the tie instead of the win. They line up to kick the field goal, and defense realizes it has 12 men on the field and goes to call time out. Not granted. Now it's first and goal. Or, defense figures out a fake may be on, and tries to call a time out to get someone to cover the sidelines. Not granted. Fake. Touchdown.

<snip>

So while I disagree with the gamesmanship time out to make the kicker kick twice, I just don't know how you make up a rule that stops this and only this without also stopping something that's a completely legit use of a time out.

OK, so here's a better proposal: with 15 seconds or less on the game clock, only players on the field may call a timeout, not a coach on the sidelines.

The offense will see that a defensive player is calling TO and not run the play, thus eliminating the risk of injury. There's also the sportsmanship issue - defensive players on the field will be less likely to try and hose the guys lining up across from them with truly weak-sauce stuff. On the other hand, if they need to call TO legitimately (or even to ice the kicker), they still can. It's just that the coach, 75 feet away, can't do it from the sidelines at the last possible second.

Sound like a better proposal?