The future of our D

[VJCPatriot]

Add 1 monster pass rusher to this defense and it will look remarkably improved. Pressure tends to do that. I also think they still have problems at coverage LB. But I'm hoping one of Guyton or Mayo will mature into that role. Harrison and Bru obviously need to be replaced eventually, but the D shouldn't be looking this bad. In the end you can't argue with results. The Pats have been blown out twice thus far, and the D has looked putride both times.

 

[Double G]

"OK, well I agree, mostly. I am also a bit tired of the 'best line in football' nonsense. Clearly, they are far from it. However, I don't think some of these players are completely ineffective. I feel that maybe the type of players the Pats use and have used in the past may no longer be ideal for the NFL. The NFL has become more of an athletic, passing game. The Pats value, big, sturdy players (for the most part). They value smarts over speed. Well, it's great that they have big lineman and smart, big linebackers, but clearly they are lacking in speed and it gets tiring seeing no pass rush and then no DB/LB anywhere near the receivers when they catch the ball.

In the past, the Pats have always been great at stopping the run. Teams just don't seem to make running the ball a big priority against the Pats. And why would they? You can just pass all over them.

I've said it before, but I think the offense helped hide some of the defensive problems last year. Maybe I'm completely wrong, but I think it could be a combo of factors, like I said, they have BIG players, which may not be translating to today's game as well as it used to.

And I also believe Seymour is just a bit overrated.

I agree with your thoughts on the preseason. I was also worried when I saw them getting run over time and time again.

I'm not really sure what to think of AD. He was good in the Super Bowl coming off the edge and I really expected a good year. I hope he can turn it on. He isn't that great in coverage.

My favorite part of your post is the 'old, slow and terrible' part! LOL. Yes, they are a bit slow at times. In the past they've been able to hide some of their slowness. Maybe teams are just finally figuring out this defense. I don't know, but I'm just as frustrated as the next fan.

GO PATS!!"

Thanks for sharing your thoughts on this one; yourself, myself, PatsFaninAZ and numerous other people I've spoken with all agree about this.

Then there's Deus Irae, too busy busting my balls over spelling mistakes to acknowledge that this defense sucks. When Brady went down, the only shot we had was for the defense to step up and they have not, end of story. If they were losing 13-10, 10-3, etc, etc, you could blame Cassel, but they are getting blown off the field.

Keep spouting useless stats to make your case; fine, they're not old, slow and overated, the rest of the powerhouses in the league like the Doofins are better than they are.

 

[BionicPatriot]

The D isn't old as dinosaurs. But there's no doubt Vrabel has slowed down, and ADT I don't get him. Dude constantly gets killed in coverage this season and he applies NO pressure. That's whats killing this team. People thinking the secondary is the issue is the problem, they just have no clue. If I told you we had Champ Bailey, people would **** themselves. But look how useless a great CB is when he has no pass rush in front of him. Look how average CBs can get it done with great pressure (see 04 Pats, 07 Giants)

I feel like I go around saying the same damn thing over and over again, but it's that simple. The day this team ever finds a good pass rush again is when they'll start winning super bowls again. It's so goddamn frustrating watching QBs just sit there and pick us apart. Remember when they ran for their lives? Remember when the Colts were a push over to the Pats because McGoo and company just harrassed the **** out of Manning?

The one thing no one talks about over the last 2 terrible postseason games is how Manning and Eli never went down as they were driving. I realize Manning got out of a near sack, but the Colts game? They didn't hit Manning nearly as much as the giants hit Brady. I just miss the days when this D was feared, when QBs ran like chickens with their heads cut off. Call me crazy all you want, but it makes you wonder why BB can't figure this out? Why doesn't he go after a pass rusher? This D would be so much better, agh just frustrating.

 

[bob85ne]

The D isn't old as dinosaurs. But there's no doubt Vrabel has slowed down, and ADT I don't get him. Dude constantly gets killed in coverage this season and he applies NO pressure. That's whats killing this team. People thinking the secondary is the issue is the problem, they just have no clue. If I told you we had Champ Bailey, people would **** themselves. But look how useless a great CB is when he has no pass rush in front of him. Look how average CBs can get it done with great pressure (see 04 Pats, 07 Giants)

I feel like I go around saying the same damn thing over and over again, but it's that simple. The day this team ever finds a good pass rush again is when they'll start winning super bowls again. It's so goddamn frustrating watching QBs just sit there and pick us apart. Remember when they ran for their lives? Remember when the Colts were a push over to the Pats because McGoo and company just harrassed the **** out of Manning?

The one thing no one talks about over the last 2 terrible postseason games is how Manning and Eli never went down as they were driving. I realize Manning got out of a near sack, but the Colts game? They didn't hit Manning nearly as much as the giants hit Brady. I just miss the days when this D was feared, when QBs ran like chickens with their heads cut off. Call me crazy all you want, but it makes you wonder why BB can't figure this out? Why doesn't he go after a pass rusher? This D would be so much better, agh just frustrating.

I've been thinking the same thing. Watching the Arizona v Dallas game and seeing how the Cards just harassed the s*** out of Romo and were winning then went soft and let the Cowboys back in. It was like a blast from the past of how the Pats used to terrorise the QB.

 

[PatriotNMP43]

The D isn't old as dinosaurs. But there's no doubt Vrabel has slowed down, and ADT I don't get him. Dude constantly gets killed in coverage this season and he applies NO pressure. That's whats killing this team. People thinking the secondary is the issue is the problem, they just have no clue. If I told you we had Champ Bailey, people would **** themselves. But look how useless a great CB is when he has no pass rush in front of him. Look how average CBs can get it done with great pressure (see 04 Pats, 07 Giants)

I feel like I go around saying the same damn thing over and over again, but it's that simple. The day this team ever finds a good pass rush again is when they'll start winning super bowls again. It's so goddamn frustrating watching QBs just sit there and pick us apart. Remember when they ran for their lives? Remember when the Colts were a push over to the Pats because McGoo and company just harrassed the **** out of Manning?

The one thing no one talks about over the last 2 terrible postseason games is how Manning and Eli never went down as they were driving. I realize Manning got out of a near sack, but the Colts game? They didn't hit Manning nearly as much as the giants hit Brady. I just miss the days when this D was feared, when QBs ran like chickens with their heads cut off. Call me crazy all you want, but it makes you wonder why BB can't figure this out? Why doesn't he go after a pass rusher? This D would be so much better, agh just frustrating.

Completely agree, Thank you for an objective, honest opinion on the current D, it's real simple, harrass the QB into making mistakes or let him sit back in the pocket all day untouched and let him tear you apart. I would rather see a sack/fumble and have 30 yards to go on offense than an INT off a long bomb and have 80 yards to go. Don't give opposing QB's time to go deep. Period.

 

[Leave No Doubt]

I feel like I go around saying the same damn thing over and over again, but it's that simple. The day this team ever finds a good pass rush again is when they'll start winning super bowls again. It's so goddamn frustrating watching QBs just sit there and pick us apart. Remember when they ran for their lives?
The one thing no one talks about over the last 2 terrible postseason games is how Manning and Eli never went down as they were driving. I realize Manning got out of a near sack, but the Colts game? They didn't hit Manning nearly as much as the giants hit Brady. I just miss the days when this D was feared, when QBs ran like chickens with their heads cut off.

Well said and I miss it too. Big Willie Mac The Pats D dominated in those days; when they took the field their goal was to hit,INT,tackle,and/or get the ball. If they're smart about it and avoid a lot of penalties,hard hitting teams win. If we develop that kind of D again Matt Cassel's offense is or will become good enough.

 

[Deus Irae]

Well said and I miss it too. Big Willie Mac The Pats D dominated in those days; when they took the field their goal was to hit,INT,tackle,and/or get the ball. If they're smart about it and avoid a lot of penalties,hard hitting teams win. If we develop that kind of D again Matt Cassel's offense is or will become good enough.

In 2001, the Patriots were 15th in the league with 40 sacks
In 2002, the Patriots were 21st in the league with 34 sacks
In 2003, the Patriots were 6th in the league with 41 sacks
In 2004, the Patriots were 5th in the league with 45 sacks
In 2005, the Patriots were 23rd in the league with 33 sacks
In 2006, the Patriots were 5th in the league with 44 sacks
In 2007, the Patriots were 2nd in the league with 47 sacks

In 2001, the Patriots were 6th in the league with 22 picks
In 2002, the Patriots were 14th in the league with 18 picks
In 2003, the Patriots were 1st in the league with 29 picks
In 2004, the Patriots were 7th in the league with 20 picks
In 2005, the Patriots were 29th in the league with 10 picks
In 2006, the Patriots were 4th in the league with 22 picks
In 2007, the Patriots were 9th in the league with 19 picks

People here like to hearken back to the Golden Age, but they forget that we are still in that Golden Age. Right now, we're seeing the defense struggle mightily, but it's not as if this has been part of some trend.

 

[Brady to Brown]

The D isn't old as dinosaurs. But there's no doubt Vrabel has slowed down, and ADT I don't get him. Dude constantly gets killed in coverage this season and he applies NO pressure. That's whats killing this team. People thinking the secondary is the issue is the problem, they just have no clue. If I told you we had Champ Bailey, people would **** themselves. But look how useless a great CB is when he has no pass rush in front of him. Look how average CBs can get it done with great pressure (see 04 Pats, 07 Giants)

I feel like I go around saying the same damn thing over and over again, but it's that simple. The day this team ever finds a good pass rush again is when they'll start winning super bowls again. It's so goddamn frustrating watching QBs just sit there and pick us apart. Remember when they ran for their lives? Remember when the Colts were a push over to the Pats because McGoo and company just harrassed the **** out of Manning?

The one thing no one talks about over the last 2 terrible postseason games is how Manning and Eli never went down as they were driving. I realize Manning got out of a near sack, but the Colts game? They didn't hit Manning nearly as much as the giants hit Brady. I just miss the days when this D was feared, when QBs ran like chickens with their heads cut off. Call me crazy all you want, but it makes you wonder why BB can't figure this out? Why doesn't he go after a pass rusher? This D would be so much better, agh just frustrating.

Great post.

But the Patriots don't want to play this kind of defense.

So say some experts on this board

 

[Brady to Brown]

Why was this thread removed from the main board?

 

[Leave No Doubt]

In 2001, the Patriots were 15th in the league with 40 sacks
In 2002, the Patriots were 21st in the league with 34 sacks
In 2003, the Patriots were 6th in the league with 41 sacks
In 2004, the Patriots were 5th in the league with 45 sacks
In 2005, the Patriots were 23rd in the league with 33 sacks
In 2006, the Patriots were 5th in the league with 44 sacks
In 2007, the Patriots were 2nd in the league with 47 sacks

In 2001, the Patriots were 6th in the league with 22 picks
In 2002, the Patriots were 14th in the league with 18 picks
In 2003, the Patriots were 1st in the league with 29 picks
In 2004, the Patriots were 7th in the league with 20 picks
In 2005, the Patriots were 29th in the league with 10 picks
In 2006, the Patriots were 4th in the league with 22 picks
In 2007, the Patriots were 9th in the league with 19 picks

People here like to hearken back to the Golden Age, but they forget that we are still in that Golden Age. Right now, we're seeing the defense struggle mightily, but it's not as if this has been part of some trend.

LOL whoa.

1. I've never said our "old" D was the best in the league,actually I have no idea where they stood in relation to other teams (stats much appreciated,thanks)
2.I'm starting to think nobody reads posts because if they did, they'd know I'm one of the Positive People on this forum who fully believes this 08 team WILL gel sometime in or about November. However that doesn't preclude me from remembering how much fun it was to watch smashmouth D,maybe that's because personally I LOVE watching defense. Geesh