The Chargers: bold innovators in incompetence

[Hammer of Thor]

Priceless, this coming from the guy who held out through two preseason games. Maybe Bosa hurt his toe maybe that's why he doesn't want to play?

Tomlinson puts more pressure on Bosa

Stay classy, "LT".

 

[Rob0729]

I have a feeling that this could turn out to be a lose/lose. Bosa may very well sit out the year (although I wouldn't bet on it). He would immediately go down as one of the worst bust picks in NFL history if not the worst (a third overall pick who never even practiced never mind played a down). A third overall pick is supposed to be somewhere near a perenial Pro Bowler to a Hall of Famer.

There is no way Bosae would be drafted as high next year. He will lose a salary this year. His contract next year will be smaller, maybe much smaller if he falls. And he will have to wait another year for his post rookie deal deal.

The Chargers are killing themselves also because I can't see future draft prospects or free agents wanting to deal with them.

 

[Brady_to_Moss]

I have a feeling that this could turn out to be a lose/lose. Bosa may very well sit out the year (although I wouldn't bet on it). He would immediately go down as one of the worst bust picks in NFL history if not the worst (a third overall pick who never even practiced never mind played a down). A third overall pick is supposed to be somewhere near a perenial Pro Bowler to a Hall of Famer.

There is no way Bosae would be drafted as high next year. He will lose a salary this year. His contract next year will be smaller, maybe much smaller if he falls. And he will have to wait another year for his post rookie deal deal.

The Chargers are killing themselves also because I can't see future draft prospects or free agents wanting to deal with them.

Without question it's a lose-lose now unless something happens in the next week or two otherwise he will be redrafted

 

[fourhour]

Priceless, this coming from the guy who held out through two preseason games. Maybe Bosa hurt his toe maybe that's why he doesn't want to play?

Tomlinson puts more pressure on Bosa

Winner, winner. Chicken dinner! From the comments:
"LT is your typical Charger ‘great’. Meaningless stats piled up on a meaningless team."

 

[rookBoston]

Rivers is a very good player in his own right too. Brees became far better after he left.

Or, maybe, Brees became better due to the fact that he left

 

[Froob]

Or, maybe, Brees became better due to the fact that he left

Probably, Rivers wasted his team's best years under Norv Turner who was coaching at last 2-3 years before he should have been canned.

 

[BradyFTW!]

I have a feeling that this could turn out to be a lose/lose. Bosa may very well sit out the year (although I wouldn't bet on it). He would immediately go down as one of the worst bust picks in NFL history if not the worst (a third overall pick who never even practiced never mind played a down). A third overall pick is supposed to be somewhere near a perenial Pro Bowler to a Hall of Famer.

I get where you're coming from, but I think that's overstating what's expected out of a #3 pick a bit. Jerod Mayo made 2 career Pro Bowls--by no means a perennial pro bowler--but if we'd drafted him 7 spots higher I wouldn't have complained. If your #3 pick makes multiple pro bowls I think you're generally satisfied with what you got. Top-3 picks can an

There is no way Bosae would be drafted as high next year. He will lose a salary this year. His contract next year will be smaller, maybe much smaller if he falls. And he will have to wait another year for his post rookie deal deal.

It depends. He won't be a top 3 pick next year, but he'll still probably be a top 10 guy with the added benefit of not being drafted by the Chargers. If he's convinced that the organization is a toxic cesspool that will hurt him long-term--and I don't think he'd be wrong in that assessment--there's a case to be made that he'd be better off coming back next year and getting drafted by a more competent organization. It's not a slam dunk at all, and he's definitely incurring real losses by sitting out a year, but I think there's plenty of plausible scenarios where this ends up being a win for him if he holds out. Even argument that he's missing out on a year of his career doesn't totally make sense to me, since most careers are ended due to injury relating to one huge hit or an accumulation of hits, so most players' careers are on a "you've been hit X" times type of timer, rather than "you're X years old". By taking a year off, he's not losing anything on the former timer.

It's also important to note that Bosa comes from some family money, so he isn't under the immediate pressure to sign a contract to be able to support his entire family like a lot of guys are. Kinda like Chris Borland, I think that frees him up to make some long-term choices for himself that don't necessarily revolve totally around money, which is a pretty stark departure from what we usually see out of young guys who don't have a big signing bonus to their name yet.

 

[The Boston Patriot]

I don't care about the Chargers, or for that matter, any other owner or team. My support will always go to the player. That said, the Chargers are a particularly stupid and evil organization it seems when it comes to drafting/signing/retaining players.

 

[RobertWeathers]

Probably, Rivers wasted his team's best years under Norv Turner who was coaching at last 2-3 years before he should have been canned.

The Chargers' problems in the 2000s were the Jets and Patriots. The talent was certainly there but the toughness was not.

With that said, Rivers playing on a partially torn ACL was impressive.

 

[Kontradiction]

The Chargers' problems in the 2000s were the Jets and Patriots. The talent was certainly there but the toughness was not.

With that said, Rivers playing on a partially torn ACL was impressive.

Even better was Tomlinson sitting on the bench and sulking while Rivers was playing with said torn ACL. Too bad, for us, that Super Bowl XLII was about to transpire.

 

[Froob]

The Chargers' problems in the 2000s were the Jets and Patriots. The talent was certainly there but the toughness was not.

With that said, Rivers playing on a partially torn ACL was impressive.

That play in 2010 when Rivers threw that pass laterally and no Charger bothered to touch it before Ninko picked up the fumble summed up Norv and BB's careers perfectly.

 

[Rob0729]

I get where you're coming from, but I think that's overstating what's expected out of a #3 pick a bit. Jerod Mayo made 2 career Pro Bowls--by no means a perennial pro bowler--but if we'd drafted him 7 spots higher I wouldn't have complained. If your #3 pick makes multiple pro bowls I think you're generally satisfied with what you got. Top-3 picks can an

To tell you the truth, if Mayo was the 3rd overall pick he would have been a slight disappointment. He was an excellent pick where they took him, but there is a worlds of difference between the #3 pick and #10 pick. Most drafts only have 3-5 true blue chip draft picks. After that, there are about a dozen or so players who are lumped together in terms of talent.

But Bosa was the first non-QB taken in the draft and no one really thinks the two players taken ahead of him were the two best players in the draft. So at least in theory, Bosa is right when he said he was the best player in the 2016 draft. So considering the Chargers had the shot at the best player in the draft whether it was Bosa or someone else because the first two picks were used on QBs, it makes it even more of a bust if they lose him.

It depends. He won't be a top 3 pick next year, but he'll still probably be a top 10 guy with the added benefit of not being drafted by the Chargers. If he's convinced that the organization is a toxic cesspool that will hurt him long-term--and I don't think he'd be wrong in that assessment--there's a case to be made that he'd be better off coming back next year and getting drafted by a more competent organization. It's not a slam dunk at all, and he's definitely incurring real losses by sitting out a year, but I think there's plenty of plausible scenarios where this ends up being a win for him if he holds out. Even argument that he's missing out on a year of his career doesn't totally make sense to me, since most careers are ended due to injury relating to one huge hit or an accumulation of hits, so most players' careers are on a "you've been hit X" times type of timer, rather than "you're X years old". By taking a year off, he's not losing anything on the former timer.

It's also important to note that Bosa comes from some family money, so he isn't under the immediate pressure to sign a contract to be able to support his entire family like a lot of guys are. Kinda like Chris Borland, I think that frees him up to make some long-term choices for himself that don't necessarily revolve totally around money, which is a pretty stark departure from what we usually see out of young guys who don't have a big signing bonus to their name yet.

There is no guarantees he will be a top ten guy. I am betting he would drop pretty far in the first round.

And even if his family has money, doesn't change the fact that he could lose millions and a year of his football career.

 

[BradyFTW!]

To tell you the truth, if Mayo was the 3rd overall pick he would have been a slight disappointment. He was an excellent pick where they took him, but there is a worlds of difference between the #3 pick and #10 pick. Most drafts only have 3-5 true blue chip draft picks. After that, there are about a dozen or so players who are lumped together in terms of talent.

If you look at the 2005-2015 drafts, Mayo's had a better career than 5 of the 10 #3 overall picks. Could be 6 if Bortles doesn't keep on an upward trajectory, I marked him as undecided. From 2005-2015, the following guys were drafted at #3 overall:

Worse than Mayo: Braylon Edwards, Vince Young, Tyson Jackson, Trent Richardson, Dion Jordan,

Better than Mayo: Joe Thomas, Matt Ryan, Gerald McCoy, Marcell Dareus,

TBD: Blake Bortles​

#3 picks may be blue-chip prospects, but that doesn't make them great pros. The bust rate is much higher than you seem to be suggesting. Upon inspection, Mayo would've been perfectly in line with what you should reasonably expect out of the #3 pick.

But Bosa was the first non-QB taken in the draft and no one really thinks the two players taken ahead of him were the two best players in the draft. So at least in theory, Bosa is right when he said he was the best player in the 2016 draft. So considering the Chargers had the shot at the best player in the draft whether it was Bosa or someone else because the first two picks were used on QBs, it makes it even more of a bust if they lose him.


There is no guarantees he will be a top ten guy. I am betting he would drop pretty far in the first round.

And even if his family has money, doesn't change the fact that he could lose millions and a year of his football career.

If he plays an extra year because he wasn't stuck on the Chargers with their still-incompetent-even-after-firing-Chao medical staff, then no, it won't be a fact that he lost a year of his football career. He could easily gain years if he ends up on a team that knows how to develop talent.

As for the bet that he'll fall out of the top 10, I'd be happy to place some kind of wager on that in the likely event that he doesn't sign with the Chargers.

 

[BradyFTW!]

NFL GMs Laughing at Chargers for Ruining Bosa's Rookie Season

(yes, I'm still shamelessly ripping content from r/nfl)

Here's the money quote:

In speaking to people around the NFL, I've rarely seen such a unanimity on two fronts: 1) Bosa's rookie year is over, and 2) the Chargers are screwing this up.

I cannot stress this enough. Every team I speak to thinks the Chargers are ruining Bosa. They are laughing at the Chargers. Laughing at them.

"This is very Chargers," said one general manager.

And if, like me, you can't get enough of this: The Chargers were petty before they tried to stiff Bosa

 

[Rob0729]

If you look at the 2005-2015 drafts, Mayo's had a better career than 5 of the 10 #3 overall picks. Could be 6 if Bortles doesn't keep on an upward trajectory, I marked him as undecided. From 2005-2015, the following guys were drafted at #3 overall:

Worse than Mayo: Braylon Edwards, Vince Young, Tyson Jackson, Trent Richardson, Dion Jordan,

Better than Mayo: Joe Thomas, Matt Ryan, Gerald McCoy, Marcell Dareus,

TBD: Blake Bortles​

#3 picks may be blue-chip prospects, but that doesn't make them great pros. The bust rate is much higher than you seem to be suggesting. Upon inspection, Mayo would've been perfectly in line with what you should reasonably expect out of the #3 pick.

Just because it was a bad draft wouldn't have made Mayo a great #3 overall pick. He would have been a mediocre one.

There are no guarantees on a draft prospect whether he is the first pick in the draft or the last pick in the draft. But if you pick a player in the top 3 and he is anything less than a franchise player, he is a disappointment at best. The #1o pick doesn't have such high expectations.

If he plays an extra year because he wasn't stuck on the Chargers with their still-incompetent-even-after-firing-Chao medical staff, then no, it won't be a fact that he lost a year of his football career. He could easily gain years if he ends up on a team that knows how to develop talent.

As for the bet that he'll fall out of the top 10, I'd be happy to place some kind of wager on that in the likely event that he doesn't sign with the Chargers.

With football, there is no guarantees how long of a career he will have. He could have a very short one because of injuries. But if he has a long career, the odds are he will play one less year because he will be a year older in his first year.

And I am not betting anything about where he will be drafted since we have no idea about a number of factors. Will the 2017 draft have an unusual amount of blue chippers. How will Bosa continue to condition with his year off and no team program to keep him in game shape? What players will be near the top of the draft and what are the team needs for the teams drafting near the top of the draft?

There is really no precedence for this. I know when people thought Michael Crabtree was threatening to hold out and re-enter the draft the next year that most people felt he could fall out of the first round all together. When Curtis Enis almost did the same, people felt he would slide the next year. But as far as I can tell, no one has ever fallen through and actually sit out.

I still think the whole, out of sight, out of mind thing will hurt Bosa. Other players, even if they are lesser players may move ahead of him because people will be scouting them all year while Bosa trains out of sight of the NFL scouts.

 

[mikey m]

To tell you the truth, if Mayo was the 3rd overall pick he would have been a slight disappointment. He was an excellent pick where they took him, but there is a worlds of difference between the #3 pick and #10 pick. Most drafts only have 3-5 true blue chip draft picks. After that, there are about a dozen or so players who are lumped together in terms of talent.

But Bosa was the first non-QB taken in the draft and no one really thinks the two players taken ahead of him were the two best players in the draft. So at least in theory, Bosa is right when he said he was the best player in the 2016 draft. So considering the Chargers had the shot at the best player in the draft whether it was Bosa or someone else because the first two picks were used on QBs, it makes it even more of a bust if they lose him.





There is no guarantees he will be a top ten guy. I am betting he would drop pretty far in the first round.

And even if his family has money, doesn't change the fact that he could lose millions and a year of his football career.

You seem to be a lot more certain of the draft than I believe most are. Personally, I'm in the "the draft is a crap shoot category". Maybe there are only 3-5 players per draft class that will become Elite players at there position. But I'd bet that over the years, those players are as likely/more likely to be drafted outside the top 5 (or even 10) than inside of it. Next time we get a top 5 pick (yearsss from now of course) I'll just be hoping we get a pro bowl caliber player, not thinking "this guy better be a HoFer". 2 years ago when I actually got really into the draft and the players coming out, I thought there were 2 sure-fire players in the draft with almost no bust potential: Odell Beckham, and Aaron Donald. They went 12 and 13 respectively. Just my thoughts and ya I guess it doesn't have much to do with your points of what Bosa is losing if he enters again next year and goes much later.

 

[Rob0729]

You seem to be a lot more certain of the draft than I believe most are. Personally, I'm in the "the draft is a crap shoot category". Maybe there are only 3-5 players per draft class that will become Elite players at there position. But I'd bet that over the years, those players are as likely/more likely to be drafted outside the top 5 (or even 10) than inside of it. Next time we get a top 5 pick (yearsss from now of course) I'll just be hoping we get a pro bowl caliber player, not thinking "this guy better be a HoFer". 2 years ago when I actually got really into the draft and the players coming out, I thought there were 2 sure-fire players in the draft with almost no bust potential: Odell Beckham, and Aaron Donald. They went 12 and 13 respectively. Just my thoughts and ya I guess it doesn't have much to do with your points of what Bosa is losing if he enters again next year and goes much later.

I am not certain about anything. I am talking about expectations not what will happen. The draft is a crap shoot. But if you have a top 3 pick, anything less than a drafting a franchise player is a disappointment. More than a few top 3 picks fall in the disappointment to bust category,but that is the expectation of the player you are drafting if you are picking the third pick in the draft.