The 2008 Uncle Heatster Horizontal Sort

[DaBruinz]

From what I understand, the Patriots work from a board that usually has about 150 players on it. I think that is what dryheat44 is trying to speculate on.

As far as you guys arguing about what is on the Pat's draft board, I think everyone would be surprised at the board if they had a chance to see it.

Does anyone else remember a post draft interview within the last couple years, (it may have been with Jon Kraft) one of the questions was about player ranking.
The answer was something like--- "It is always interesting to see where the kids get selected, there were kids taken in the first round this year that we had graded as Priority Free Agents" !!!!

The Patriots board is surely at least 256 players, if not closer to 300. But I agree with you, that is what Heatster was trying to do.

I don't remember J. Kraft saying that. It might have been Pioli since I don't believe Kraft gets involved in things like the draft.

 

[VJCPatriot]

Just because he applies the same general theory an article published 3 years ago talked about, doesn't mean he got it right, or that his draft board matches the Patriots draft board. It's an educated guess at best. I'm not the only one here who has expressed differences of opinion on this particular draft board. For example, I don't believe that 5 or 6 receivers should be rated that highly, compared to other positions. And especially considering that we have Moss, Welker, and Gaffney in the fold. It was an interesting exercise to read for sure, but there are certainly areas of ranking that I find questionable.

Heatster didn't offer a MOCK in this thread. He offered his ratings on players and where he felt they'd offer the best value for the Patriots. Nothing more, nothing less..

Also, none of what you said changes the fact that it was Heatster's PERSONAL draft board and its done, actually very similarly to the way the Patriots do theirs. How do I know this? Because of the article that came out 3 years ago on this very topic where Belichick explained how the Patriots set up their draft boards. And there have been plenty of people who have chimed in in this regard.

 

[patsfanofNC12]

Dorsey went to LSU not Georgia Tech

 

[dryheat44]

Dorsey went to LSU not Georgia Tech

Thanks. I recognized a few Brain Farts after the edit window had passed. Peyton Hillis is from Arkansas, not Texas, and the Middle Linebacker from Michigan St. is Kaleb Thornhill, not Jason.

 

[SunnyDenmark]

Nice work DryHeat. I had forgotten how the Pats do a draft board (anyone have a link to that article from about 3 years ago? ). It is nice to see the different logic that goes into building one; instead of just reading another Mock variation #245.

Keep up the good work. YOU RULE :rocker:

 

[PatsandTrojans55]

Great Job Heatster,

I like the time and effort put in to this tiered list. But may I offer some insight. The next 9 things I'm not saying who the Pats will pick but just offering some observations on what I've heard and know.

1. McFadden- His character issues are overblown by the media and is a very good kid who the Pats have had someone confirm. He's on their board but it comes down to value and $$$$$ with him. In fact, Meriweather would be off your board based on character issues this time last year and he had more issues than McFadden. I don't see them taking McFadden because of their love for Laurence but they like the kid.

2. Chris Long- Long is loved more by the fans on this board than he is by the Pats. He's not as high on their board as some think. They won't be trading up for him either. In fact, if what I hear is true and I no doubt believe it is, it would shock some people who they have rated higher than him. I give you credit you have one player listed but there are about 8 others so far. Do they like Chris? Absolutely. Would they draft him? yes. But at #7? The answer would surprise many here.

3. McKelvin-Is not the Top Corner to them.

4. Chad Henne- Is nowhere near that high to them as well as the media darling Flacco. Both are very questionable decision makers.

5. DeSean Jackson WR Cal- He is a 1st round grade to the Pats as well as 2 other wideouts. DeSean they love and would take if he was there and they had 2 1st's or and early 2nd. They love his playmaking ability and his punt return savyness. He would instantly be the best returner on this team and they notice how Hester can single-handedly win or change a game and he would improve another phase of the team. Remeber, BB looks for ways to improve each phase of the game to get any edge that another team might not have. They also, like his intelligence in route running and ability for YAC's. Remember the bubble + quick screens to the wideouts like Stallworth. He would be ideal for that. Will they draft him I don't know be he should DEFINITLY be on the list if your playing the role of the Patriots front office.

6. The Pats actually really like Mike Jenkins- South Florida, Talib- Kansas and Antoine Cason has made them fall in love with his intelligence, ball skills, love for the game and community work. If any have met him you would know why. How much love is the question. But he's very high on their list.

7. You left out an interesting RB they are warm on Tashard Choice- Georgia Tech in fact you could add him and drop Jacob Hester. Choice is a strong big back that would replace Sammy and play his role in 2009.

8. They're not high on a number of Notre Damers but they like Trevor Laws. He has a great motor, good base, and can be a hand full for some centers to handle by themselves. Possible, another Sedrick Ellis type.

9. Keith Rivers LB USC- You can put him in with Groves and Gholston. That's all I'll say about that.

Again, I want to say great job by you.

I'm not saying the Pats will draft any of these players but if you do a "Big Board" with them in mind you would do good to make sure these players are included.
Enjoy everyone.

 

[DaBruinz]

Just because he applies the same general theory an article published 3 years ago talked about, doesn't mean he got it right, or that his draft board matches the Patriots draft board. It's an educated guess at best. I'm not the only one here who has expressed differences of opinion on this particular draft board. For example, I don't believe that 5 or 6 receivers should be rated that highly, compared to other positions. And especially considering that we have Moss, Welker, and Gaffney in the fold. It was an interesting exercise to read for sure, but there are certainly areas of ranking that I find questionable.

Please show me where I said that he (heatster) got it right. Next, please show me where I said that "his draft board matches the Pats draft board.

OK. Since you failed on THOSE, Please show me where I said it was HIS BOARD. DING DING DING. Its his opinion.

Next, how about you go back to the draft article and read it again. Then go back and look at what Heatster said. It was his 1st HORIZONTAL sort. You do realize that the Pats do 3-6 horizontal and vertical sorts, yes?

Also, how about you go back and read the part where he said he'd be moving people up and down, etc.

Also, are you really that obtuse to believe that the Patriots IGNORE entire positions? If they can get a receiver who turns out to be better than Gaffney, who are you to say that the Pats won't draft him? Especially since Gaffney is only on a 1 year deal. Does having Moss, Welker, Jackson, Washington, Gaffney and Aiken make it less likely that they draft one of the 2nd round receivers? Yes it makes it less likely. But it doesn't change the fact that he had 6 WRs in the 21-35 range. And, consider that the Pats are unlikely to draft there, what does it really matter to you?

Also, if you take a look at a top 100 list, there are actually 7 receivers from 18-37.

Finally, how about you go back and read your original post. You claimed it was a MOCK when it wasn't. And while others have expressed differences with the draft board, none of them claimed it was a mock.

 

[DaBruinz]

Great Job Heatster,

I like the time and effort put in to this tiered list. But may I offer some insight. The next 9 things I'm not saying who the Pats will pick but just offering some observations on what I've heard and know.

1. McFadden- His character issues are overblown by the media and is a very good kid who the Pats have had someone confirm. He's on their board but it comes down to value and $$$$$ with him. In fact, Meriweather would be off your board based on character issues this time last year and he had more issues than McFadden. I don't see them taking McFadden because of their love for Laurence but they like the kid.

2. Chris Long- Long is loved more by the fans on this board than he is by the Pats. He's not as high on their board as some think. They won't be trading up for him either. In fact, if what I hear is true and I no doubt believe it is, it would shock some people who they have rated higher than him. I give you credit you have one player listed but there are about 8 others so far. Do they like Chris? Absolutely. Would they draft him? yes. But at #7? The answer would surprise many here.

3. McKelvin-Is not the Top Corner to them.

4. Chad Henne- Is nowhere near that high to them as well as the media darling Flacco. Both are very questionable decision makers.

5. DeSean Jackson WR Cal- He is a 1st round grade to the Pats as well as 2 other wideouts. DeSean they love and would take if he was there and they had 2 1st's or and early 2nd. They love his playmaking ability and his punt return savyness. He would instantly be the best returner on this team and they notice how Hester can single-handedly win or change a game and he would improve another phase of the team. Remeber, BB looks for ways to improve each phase of the game to get any edge that another team might not have. They also, like his intelligence in route running and ability for YAC's. Remember the bubble + quick screens to the wideouts like Stallworth. He would be ideal for that. Will they draft him I don't know be he should DEFINITLY be on the list if your playing the role of the Patriots front office.

6. The Pats actually really like Mike Jenkins- South Florida, Talib- Kansas and Antoine Cason has made them fall in love with his intelligence, ball skills, love for the game and community work. If any have met him you would know why. How much love is the question. But he's very high on their list.

7. You left out an interesting RB they are warm on Tashard Choice- Georgia Tech in fact you could add him and drop Jacob Hester. Choice is a strong big back that would replace Sammy and play his role in 2009.

8. They're not high on a number of Notre Damers but they like Trevor Laws. He has a great motor, good base, and can be a hand full for some centers to handle by themselves. Possible, another Sedrick Ellis type.

9. Keith Rivers LB USC- You can put him in with Groves and Gholston. That's all I'll say about that.

Again, I want to say great job by you.

I'm not saying the Pats will draft any of these players but if you do a "Big Board" with them in mind you would do good to make sure these players are included.
Enjoy everyone.

You talk as if you have some inside source at the Patriots. Personally, I think you're full of it.

OH, and, btw, your full of it on Meriweather's issues this time last year. It had already come out that he was well within his right to discharge his legally licensed firearm in self defense.

 

[dryheat44]

You talk as if you have some inside source at the Patriots. Personally, I think you're full of it.

OH, and, btw, your full of it on Meriweather's issues this time last year. It had already come out that he was well within his right to discharge his legally licensed firearm in self defense.

Actually, Meriweather was off my list last year, partly because I didn't see him as a first round talent, and partly because of character issues, mostly pertaining to the head-stomping. Obviously the Pats did their research and were satisfied.

My lack of love for McFadden has less to do with character issues (although we really have to question his intelligence/judgement at this point), and more to do with the fact that smart teams don't invest big dollars in rookie running backs, especially when there is another productive, first-round running back on the team. Unless we're going to run a Wishbone or some other Split backfield offense, it's dumb to draft McFadden in the first round.

PatsandTrojans55, you certainly speak from authority. Are you Junior Seau? I'll definitely be thinking of your insights on draft day.

 

[PatsandTrojans55]

You talk as if you have some inside source at the Patriots. Personally, I think you're full of it.

OH, and, btw, your full of it on Meriweather's issues this time last year. It had already come out that he was well within his right to discharge his legally licensed firearm in self defense.

You think I'm full of it? That's fine and I respect your opinion. However, There are plenty of Pats fans who care more about getting good credible information on their team than they care about their opinion being correct. If your not one of those fans that's fine just proceed to skip my posts then. If you care about credible information then your welcome.

About Meriweather, It was for Dryheat specifically and he promptly answer the reply to you and understood where I was coming from.

 

[PatsandTrojans55]

Actually, Meriweather was off my list last year, partly because I didn't see him as a first round talent, and partly because of character issues, mostly pertaining to the head-stomping. Obviously the Pats did their research and were satisfied.

My lack of love for McFadden has less to do with character issues (although we really have to question his intelligence/judgement at this point), and more to do with the fact that smart teams don't invest big dollars in rookie running backs, especially when there is another productive, first-round running back on the team. Unless we're going to run a Wishbone or some other Split backfield offense, it's dumb to draft McFadden in the first round.

PatsandTrojans55, you certainly speak from authority. Are you Junior Seau? I'll definitely be thinking of your insights on draft day.

Once again Great Job Heatster.

I'm looking forward to your mocks and will be looking for your draft analysis as that day approaches. As I get more information I will post it here as frequently as possible. Since your the one who every year I notice does the in-depth looks, I will probably post information on these players in your threads.

BTW, Great picture your raising her right.

Ciaou'

 

[PATSNUTme]

Grest Job DH44.

Yesterday I picked up a copy of the Sporting News Draft magazine which is usually a decent draft publication.

I was shocked when I looked at their big board and they had Jake Long rated at #25 and Golhston rated at #46.